Ford fusion sport hybrid project

The 350Z in the link uses a clutch to disengage the engine, the through out bearing can be seen in the bell housing.

The engine should not be switched off while driving, the battery pack is too small for EV mode and the vehicle needs to have power steering, power brakes and the 12 volt charging system to operate.

given Honda setup has a clutch to get ICE connected in and out, I bet engineers spent quite some time to get it synchronized totally transparently as it work there (I have one, I know)

yet, for DIY I would expect that this type of setup is close to insanity to reproduce, which leaves the alternative of how it was done in Chevy Volt, where traction electric motor and generator were never sharing access to the ICE and to the wheels, it was simple “generator is pumping the juice into the battery and to the traction, as needed; as car needs to brake, the traction motor becomes a generator” - that setup is much easier to make work with no hard mechanical jolts

trouble is: with no mechanical link between the two, this setup spends too much energy unproductively at higher speeds, where direct ICE->wheels would work better… and Honda made this optimization a reality on their setup

Could be, but they repeatedly talked about how much weight they’d be saving be getting rid of the clutch and flywheel. Are you talking about the link above? That doesn’t show the actual installation, just the parts that would be used.

Here’s the completed car:

It’s interesting how Hyundai gets their hybrids done:

https://www.hyundainews.com/en-us/releases/1599

In my view, this type of setup is something of “more possible” for the DIY as it has full automatic transmission setup, happy to work directly with the ICE, yet adds the electric motor part in the front of it and with easy attach/detach setup.

It’s interesting they were able to get quite impressive EPA MPG numbers in this modus operandi.

I agree 100%, I wasn’t suggesting trying it.

I think the whole discussion is pretty much theoretical, as it would take 100,500 years to get any payoff in fuel saving on this Fusion for the money needed to convert it into hybrid :slight_smile:

getting itchy hands entertained… who counts money for that purpose?! :slight_smile:

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Couldnt this be negated somehow by incorporating a controller and somehow getting it to communicate with the ecu? Also at high rpms when the motors switch from electric to IC couldnt the resistance from the motor act as slack?

I also found this, not sure if itll help much but from what I could collect they basically did what the guy in the video did but combined concepts.

I think this link may answer most of your questions. I researched the same companies the guy got his parts from and I found the product information and a bunch of pdfs that explained the process.

https://www.borgwarner.com/technologies/p2-hybrid-architecture

Seems like it’s a legitimate procedure from how they advertise it. They make it seem like it’s another upgrade to the vehicle and not some crazy or outlandish process that only works in specific scenarios or are for a niche crowd.

That article is basically a notification to vehicle makers (Ford, etc) that this technology is available for them to integrate into future designs. It’s not something that they’ll sell to DIY folks like you.

I assumed that was the case but really hoped it wasn’t. It seems like this product was in mass production around 2018 so using that knowledge I thought I’d atleast find a car with the same or similar application but I have yet to see one.

I think the main question to ask here is: what target goals this project is to tackle?

Obviously, for the “cost-savings” goal the best answer is to replace the car with another model giving you what you want.

For the “educational” goal, you have to be very specific in your target budget, how much you can spend in what the rest of the world will consider the “waste”, but for you it is the fun and education part. depending on that, some different avenues may exist.

Assuming the “education” goal, the path of the least resistance may be to convert it into pure electric at first, then make it into a sequential hybrid.

Any kind of “high-efficiency” hybrid architectures may be far out of reach of the skill and budgets, although we do not know if your bank account provides for high-6-digits for that :slight_smile:

Hmm you bring up good point. Right now I’m on a 32,000 budget and yea that’s A LOT of money to blow on one car atleast for me it is. Call me hard headed but I just like my car (mainly because it was a gift from my father, he’s been a mechanic ever since he was like 12 so it holds a good amount of sentimental value and trading it off just doesn’t feel right you know?)other than that though it’s mainly about making his gift to me the best it can be so money isn’t necessarily an issue.

Well said on the education part :sweat_smile:

Some of my friends have suggested doing a miniature version of my project like a go kart or motorcycle and even a rc car. While I do take some interest in those avenues, they aren’t really street legal except the motorcycle but that’s not really I thing you know?:sweat_smile:

Most hybrids I’ve seen have a cvt transmission that are fwd and the awd ones have a motor in the back.

My only hope at this point is to wait for the rumored 2023 ford mustang with a v8 hybrid engine and awd and just cut some rear doors to make it 4 door (haha yes it’s a joke) but even then I’ve been told that sounds unrealistic because of how the market is right now and even if it was a thing itd probably be well above 50k which is above my budget.

What does he think about this project and are you asking him for ideas and input?

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Understood on sentimental and educational aspects, all clear.

I would still think that setting realistic goals is the key to get this project to the closure.

I might imagine that with 30K budget it is quite realistic to accomplish something road-worthy and having good chances to be useful, but unless OP has the skills and tools for the metal-work and body-work (to add to all other skills needed for electric part), I would imagine that drastic subframe modifications and such are out of realistic within the budget, unless it is a “transplant the existing powerplant” effort, it’s just not enough money in my humble opinion.

If Eric actually has 30000.00 in cash at hand he will need that after school while looking for a real job with a future which might even require a move to some place far away . There is always time for dream projects later.

I dont plan on moving any time soon much less far away. When I get a steady career job then I’ll consider moving but that’s almost 8 years from now. Maybe even more since I’ll be back in school for a masters in physics after spending some time in a internship for electrical computer engineering (assuming I would have a masters there too). So yes not really planning for life after school since school will be my life haha😅

Well he doesn’t agree with me, but that’s just our dynamic. He tells me to think more realistically, I prove him wrong, and he becomes proud of me. Think of it like a harsh coach telling you, you wont make it because they want to push you past your limit. Its lowkey toxic but hey hes a product of his time and culture and I accept that. Deep down I know hes just as adventurous as me because when I pitch him an idea and it’s something with traction he takes an interest.

OK , now I think you are either Trolling or you just don’t have a grasp on practical thinking . 8 more years of school and you want to disable a salvage title vehicle that may never reach running stage again and wipe out 30000 dollars from your savings .

I am out of here.

No troll man. My family owns multiple vehicles and my school offers free transport plus my financial aid, scholarships, and programs cover the cost of in-state so it’s just money lying around to be fair. But I’ll accept your exit thank you for your time.

For now though until technology becomes more accessible I’ll put this project on ice. Theres really no reason to rush into it plus I can just just save up more and I already love my car now. But thank you everyone for helping out and helping me understand some concepts. I greatly appreciate it and look forward into learning more about cars on my free time. I originally had a bad taste in my mouth regarding the car community but obviously there are some of you who are amazing people who changed that opinion.