Just curious: If you could have purchased a pro-level scan tool as part of your new car purchase for an extra $100 ,would you have taken advantage of that option? $200? $300? What if it only worked for your particular make/model/year? Would having that option for one car, and not the others you were looking at affect your decision about which new car to buy?
The cable costs $100. The Panasonic Toughbook is the basis for our scan tools, those cost thousands of dollars.
One option, OP pays $100 for the cable as part of the new car purchase, OP is required to supply their own computer, manufacturer supplies the software gratis. Manufacturer is compensated for the software expense by more new car sales.
If I planned on keeping the new car until it hit the scrapyard, I’d probably pay $300 for factory. But if I wasn’t going to keep it long it would be wasting money because it would never get used. And even if I kept the car, a factory tool would be overkill, and it would be more of a toy. An aftermarket bi-directional enhanced scantool is more than I would need to do my own repairs. And could use it for the other car and kids cars as well.
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I wanted to come back and thank you for the background info on the 5610. I ended up buying one to take a chance it supported the EVAP tests. Was $345 and came the very next day. BTW-today I saw the 5610RS for sale at Autozone for $315… we’ll get to why I was Autozone shortly…
So the 5610 did everything I needed and then some. It is able to individually control both solenoids as well as run the service bay test where you can see the valve status and fuel tank pressure value while the test is running.
Using the discrete valve control tests, I could hear the vent valve open/close (it was also relatively new having changed it a few months back due to an error code for it). However, could hear nothing from the purge valve as I changed the readings from zero percent up to 100 percent. The purge valve was brand new.
I ran the service bay test and the tank pressure never changed. Gross leak looks no different to computer than no flow btw.
So I disconnected vacuum tubing from both sides and ran my hand vacuum pump to pull a vacuum just like the engine would do. It held vacuum. But it wasn’t working at all when the computer commanded settings should have caused it to open.
Fuse checked good. Next took the solenoid inside to my electronics bench and tried actuating it on the bench. Same result. Genuine OEM replacement POS.
Went to Autozone and bought a Duralast version. Connected to truck electronics with hand vacuum on inlet and commanded the valve using the 5610. Immediate clicking and pressure dropped. Installed valve completely and ran the service bay test. Could watch the vent close and purge pulse while the system pressure dropped. When the vent opened, pressure went back to ambient. Appears to be fixed but have to wait for small leak test to run.
Opened the DOA valve and see why it failed- what a POS design. It’s no wonder they have some infant mortality.
Great to find an economical solution that does what it says. Thanks for the tip and taking time to respond to my questions. Tool worth every penny so far- thanks!
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I recommend against Autozone emissions parts . . . ESPECIALLY Autozone evap parts
Several years ago, over the course of several weeks, I watched a colleague go through several defective Autozone evap parts, before finally giving up and paying more money for evap parts of a more reputable manufacturer . . . which DID work correctly
The whole thing started with a small evap leak. Since I had changed the vent solenoid a few weeks prior, I figured the purge solenoid wasn’t far behind. Took it out and found it did have a small leak using my hand vacuum pump w/gauge. I mentioned before, it took some wrestling to get the old one out. I bought an OEM replacement from a GM parts warehouse for full retail price btw. It came in a GM marked box.
After I got it installed, my small leak had turned into a gross leak. The truck being older and with plenty of rusty lines, I didn’t initially suspect the part was defective. I thought I may have done some damage wrestling the part out or as things have been deteriorating (I recently had to replace the steering lines due to rust perforation) or it was just coincidental and perhaps the tank even had a rust hole on top. Wouldn’t be my first TB with those issues.
But lo and behold, even the place making OEM replacement valves made a dud. In this case, the Duralast part came out the hero. Gotta happen once in a while. FWIW, I haven’t had any issues with Duralast stuff, knock on wood…
Great diagnostic job there @TwinTurbo. Replacement parts failing right out of the box, arggghhhh … !@##!#$$# … lol …
Oh, one question … if your car came new from the factory with a pro-level diagnostic scanner, would that have influenced your decision to buy it?
Still on that crusade? The answer might surprise you- no.
Car manufacturers do not make the repair tools. So then I would likely be buying way more tool than I could ever use, plus, I would be paying 2x+ markup on the tool. In other words, an expensive add on that I can probably buy for less AND the one I buy will likely to be more up to date, technology wise by the time I need to do repairs on a brand new car. Do you think GM would supply us with a scanner that can do all manufacturers? Right now, I have one tool that can repair most cars/trucks/suvs. Versus paying for multiple tools (bundled into the sticker price) that are included with each vehicle I own. No thanks.
Take that money and use it to write some software that allows me to view the diagnostic info right on the infotainment screen. No tool needed. But that will never happen because it’s not in their interest to make it easy… 
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Good comments. It is of course in the manufacturer’s interest to sell more cars.
it sounds like you didn’t use an evap smoke machine to look for leaks
Didn’t get to that point. I don’t own one currently. I have looked into purchasing one and also the DIY versions out there.
Although that was on the radar, circumstances led to the eventual path of diagnosing the problem.
I had a code that indicated the vent solenoid might be bad. It was and easy to replace. Shortly afterward, I got a small leak code.
Then all heck broke loose and I had two fast succession failures of the power steering; the cooler blew and then the lines failed.
While repairing the lines, the purge solenoid was right there and reasonably accessible. So I pulled it out and checked it with the hand vacuum pump. Sure enough small leak. Original valve so no huge surprise. Replacing it with a defective, brand new valve was a surprise
Now I’m hoping there will be no need for a smoke machine!
Autel 808 is the lowest scanner any diyer would want to get. Autel 906 is next step out of your budget.
Thank you, I do think your right. The Autel 808 just recently got replaced with the Autel 900. From what I saw, the functionality would be superior to the Innova 5610 which I’ve purchased, and well worth it. What swayed me from Autel was the charges for updating. But it comes with 3 years free updates. That would have been plenty for me at my age. But I got the Innova at half price new, so I did alright. Although the Autel out does out do the Innova, I think the Innova would still be the bare minimum for a DIYer. But a younger guy would probably be disappointed in the Innova knowing what else is out there.
I’d be happy at this point with a DIYer priced scanner that can show live data and solenoid commands for transmissions, so basically a transmission scanner… 
Even my friends Pro level $6,000 scanner is very limited for transmissions…
After messing with the 5610, there are a few things I wish worked differently. First, on the screen where you can control the solenoids individually, also display the fuel tank pressure in real time. Then allow me to control both solenoids at the same time versus individually.
The hand-held Autel scanner I have is terrible user interface. Perhaps they have improved or if you buy a higher end unit, it is more user friendly.
For example, you have to hand type in the VIN. The Innova booted up and already had everything- it just asked if this was the vehicle I was working on with all the relevant details displayed.
The Autel menu system makes me select the control modules using the cryptic numerics associated with them. Half the time, I have no idea if I am traversing down the correct control path because I don’t know offhand the hexadecimal numeric for that module.
The Autel had to be updated immediately to work on a 2008 vehicle. Although it was manufactured in 2019, it had antique software version that did not cover a 2008 vehicle. Updating was cumbersome and required a PC.
I understand the shortcomings you’ve noticed. I’ve only had experience using Snap On, code readers, now the 5610, and for years have used Auto Enginuity. It sounds like you may like Auto Enginuity. It allows activating as many solenoids, switches and controls while viewing or graphing other features. The downsides to me are it’s really bulky because it’s laptop based. The software is\was pretty bulky also. It would list 20 actuators available but maybe 12 to 15 would respond. Same with live data. Many PIDs listed, bit not all applicable. Probably too bulky for professional and possibly too expensive for DIY. I did enjoy mine, but I let it get too far out of date.
Something else to note- I was having a tough time getting the truck to run and pass the small leak test. I found a list of criteria on line that was quite extensive and restrictive- as you might expect given they are looking for something on the order of a 0.040" hole/gap/leak point with a running engine and moving vehicle.
However, buried in the scanner are detailed instructions for the service bay test. In them, they list some very specific settings and driving conditions needed to initiate and fulfill the test requirements. These must be software triggers that tell the ECM the conditions will be right for running the test. Things like HVAC running on high with the rear defroster on, idle for some period of time, then accelerate to 55 mph and hold, then coast to a stop without touching the brake etc.
Not the simplest list of conditions to execute around here. But when I did, it passed immediately and all my monitors were completed. Just passed inspection for another year. Whohoo!!
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Many vehicles use an engine off/natural vacuum method to test for small leaks. This occurs during cool down while the vehicle is parked. It usually takes 2 days to complete the evaporative emission monitor test, despite popular advice to keep driving until all monitors have passed.
The large leak evaporative emission test initiates immediately after a cold start and can be easily aborted if driving conditions are not correct.
Unfortunately, none of the vehicles I have owned used that approach. All have been vacuum based tests using engine vacuum as the source. I would think the approach you describe might be just as hard to get a good result under certain conditions- let’s say if you live in a really hot environment. Park over hot asphalt and the tank pressure will rise from heat soak…
To your point, I actually screwed up my good result on large leak test by allowing an extended idle situation from cold start. Marginally failed the test (according to the test data) and generated a pending code. That was cleared up the next time I drove it normally from a cold start.
That must make it tough as a repair shop to fix a problem and issue an emissions sticker. Inconvenient for the customer, they have to come back to find out if the repair was successful and get their sticker. Or is it handled some other way?
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