A 50%gain in HP is a lot!! (and not cheap) It takes about 8psi of boost to gain that much…
I wounder what all he did?? Is it still a N/A engine and just cammed and with more compression along with all the induction and exhaust that goes along with it, or did he add boost or just plain add NOS???
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I previously said that most of the other cars got IIHS ratings of poor when the small overlap came out, but I should have said Marginal or Poor.
You’re right about that. There are bad European luxury cars too. I guess it’s just Volvo that remains the best.
A 50MPH crash test in to wall would probaby reveal a lot.
Both of those are 2013 redesigns that came out a year after the moderate overlap testing had already begun. My point here is that vehicles are designed with the crash tests in mind, and they often do the minimum required to pass the test. IIHS didn’t test the 2012 models of those cars, even though they were still being sold. IIHS is supposed to be for insurance companies, but it looks like they are very focused on people looking to buy a brand new car, and not a used one that’s even one year old, since they never test older models. I guess they want to encourage the industry to make safer cars but not upset the used car market.
A car is only safe in my mind if it does well on a crash test and it was not designed for that particular crash test. A car that was tested in 2012 and got an Acceptable rating is safer according to me than a 2015 vehicle that has a Good rating on the same test.
Here is a reason to drive a Volvo. They all survived this head on crash! One Dead, Five Injured After Car Crash Near Heber City
Tell y’whuuut…
A well aligned Honda Accord, with well balanced and decently tread tires set to the correct pressures could match or out handle a contemporary 5-series with poor alignment and well worn tires with pressures all over the place.
Not talking straight line - we all know who will win that contest! - but actual turns and cornering. Ask me how I know!
Ok, I’ll bite… I know some members might say, “No, don’t do it…”
But Inquiring Minds Want to Know…
The driver’s ability make a huge difference as well…
Hopefully this done on a track and not the street.
Quite simple: My 2010 Accord is fully stock, save the Pirelli Cinturato P7 AS tires, run at or slightly above stock pressures, properly balanced a year ago, eliminating the nervous wheel hop I tolerated since buying the Honda in 2020. Two months ago, I gave a local alignment shop some toe numbers, in spec, that would eliminate the left-right hunting above 55mph, and an engine cradle shift to stand up my front left leaning wheels(!). Just a hair of positive(in) toe.
This girl now tracks straighter than Christine, and no more leftward drift on highways. Plus, it corners like something two-thirds its size on backroads.
Why? Because I bothered to study the effects of wheel alignment angles, and check and maintain tire pressures with a gauge that would be considered a master gauge even only 30 years ago. (That gauge is in my avatar)
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Interesting, my 2009 Pontiac Vibe 5 speed (Matrix) running Bridgestone Turanza Serenity Plus in OE size handles way better with a negative (toe out) spec of 0.03, anymore toe out (0.04 and more) and it tends to wander from left to right at high speeds, but any less (0.02 and less) and it starts to oversteer, the more out either way the worse it gets… I can normally guess pretty close to how far out it is before being aligned, I have a LTA (lifetime alignment) and check and set every 5K when I service the vehicle (either I set it or my buddy sets it knowing how picky I am lol)… My 2006 Corolla was the same way… I would play around with different specs sometimes aligning every day or two… I also ran Firestone Affinity Touring and FS FR710’s (710’s wayy better) as well as Bridgestone Insignia SE200’s (great tire, only reason I changed to the FS tires was cause they stopped making the SE200’s) on the 06 Corolla… And I love hitting the twisty’s also… I also run door sticker pressures… I guess the Toe in might work if I never went over 30-40 mph…
And I can normally let go if the wheel going any speed on a straight flat road and she tracks straight for a good distance, just not a lot of those around here… lol
Two different vehicles, different scrub radii, different intrinsic(derived) angles - SAI-kingpin, etc.
Toe however, is an interesting animal.
Basic physics tell us that things move around, bend(strain), under load. Including the veh. suspension members that maintain alignment angles at speed, vs static.
The toe(and other align) values you see specified on an alignment printout, or in a veh. service manual, are static - stationary - values. They were arrived at by engineers to ensure the wheels roll exactly parallel to direction of travel once the car is in motion.
If there were such way to measure toe dynamically(that is, with the veh. in motion), you might be surprised to see what values you get, at forty, sixty, etc. mph(60-95kmh).
The dynamic change in toe(esp. front) for rear- vs front-drive vehicles also differs: Front toe tends to splay out a little on rear drive, while it tends to turn in a little, on front drives. That is why on rear wheel drive cars, you’ll typically see a little front toe-in specified, whereas on front and all-wheel drives, you’ll notice a slight toe-out specified.
Apparently, a slight static toe out has very different effects on our two vehicles, the Vibe and the 2010 Accord. You claim it stabilizes your vehicle at highway speed, where as on mine, it would become a two handed white knuckle experience…!
The service manual for my Honda specifies 0° front toe, with up to 0.08" out(negative) or in(positive) or plus-minus 2mm.
Once I had the shop dial in approx 0.03 inches positive(fron toe-in), and about spec, positive 0.08in toe in on the rears, this Honda was transformed from that nervous ninny to a solid one-handed highway cruiser!
To underscore, make sure you understand that ‘positive’ toe, on both sides of vehicle, means toe-in, and negative = toe-out.
How many miles on the Vibe? All original parts on the front end?
I suspect your front suspension might have a bit more play in it than does my Accord’s, allowing the front wheels to toe in quite a bit more under acceleration(remember, front wheel drive) than they would on my Accord.
Plus, I’m biased toward a steering feel that is much heavier than most drivers today might tolerate: a steering feel that is increasingly more difficult to find on newer cars, what with electric steering(EPS) and the present trend towards wider, lower profile tires which are more sensitive to steering inputs.
Final lesson: Oversteer vs understeer
Dynamic toe-out(neg), that is, front toe that remains out at speed, results in oversteer. EG: The steering wheel will react quicker to small driver inputs.
Dynamic toe-in(pos), on the other hand, results in understeer. EG: you need to turn the steering wheel a little more to achieve the same trajectory through a turn. Understeer also has the benefit of slightly enhancing straight-line stability at speed. (something I prefer, not being a rally racer 
)
$99.99 please! For the above text on alignment… 
Just kidding!
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Whereas I own a Prius because I care little for “…performance, styling, and other things…” and want to minimize fuel and its resultant pollutions…
Personally, I HATE gasoline the substance, with a passion, cannot wait for a decent electric.
Yes I do and I under stand alignments better then most, I have been doing them for over 30 years and watching what it does to customers tires over the years as well…
About 128K, and it drives about the same as it did when we got it way back still under warranty… All original parts except for the L/axle…
My Corolla (same suspension as the Matrix/Vibe) I had form 20ishK miles until it was rear ended and totaled at around 180K and it drove the same… Got to love Toyota quality!!
I also know and under stand that on my Toyotas that when they are toed in too much that they tend to be darty and harder to control, white knuckle if you will at high speed, in a straight line and going through the twistys it tends to try to turn more then the input of the steering wheel input…
And if they are toed out too much that the vehicle will tend to (on the highway) move around and try to follow (wander) the differences in the road such as a pave line making it seem as though the vehicle has a pull both to the left and to the right in which we both no is impossible with a tight suspension and proper tires maintained… Everything has a rule of thumb and you are correct about the under/oversteer with toe in/out, but evidently my Toyotas are the exception to that rule… The guy that I let align my vehicles if not me, has argued with me about the same thing as you are explaining, and he is better at alignments then a lot out there…
And we went on a recent 400 mile round trip that included 88 miles (one way) of highway (lots of long straight as well as hills and curves) with very little traffic and then a lot of very twisty curvy hilly roads and he was very impressed with the little stock Vibe, I drove to and he drove back… He even got his 1st ever speeding ticket doing 96 mph on a long stretch of the highway with very little traffic around coming back cause the car felt like he was just cruising… He was also impressed in the twistys by the handling… I also know anyone (when not me) that ever aligned either vehicle to the proper specs caused them to ill handle, and I always looked at the alignment before being the heads came off…
The Vibe runs OE size 205/55R16’s and the Corolla ran OE size 195/65R15’s, neither of which are considered Low Pro’s… And yes I know and understand the real life affect on the profile (aspect ratio) of a tire… The last 17 years of my job had lots of tires involved… lol
This is my experience with these 2 cars only, but have owned a lot of different front and rear wheel drive vehicles over the years… I also get excellent tread ware, depending on how hard I push it in the twistys…
And yes front vs rear drive differ even more when going from SLA arms with a gear box to a rack with struts and everything in between…
And the check is in the mail sir…
European, UK most especially,tax automobiles in a way that eliminates large,original design, luxury vehicles from ever being sold at a discount. Somewhat class /status designation from the original design, I wonder how such a tax scheme here would effect car sales. What would be the most popular models for America’s Mr Beans?
Don’t think for a second that engineers don’t know exactly what their toe does under all conditions!
There are measurement rigs hung onto the car that can take dynamic data to confirm what their models have told them will happen. Dynamic toe is a VERY important parameter. It is all part of the “elastic kinematics” of the suspension.
There are also alignment tools that can set toes dynamically. The Corvette plant in Kentucky has used this rolling road dyno-type device for over 30 years to set toe at the end of the assembly line. There is one worker in the car and one under the car. They set front and rear toe dynamically.
Also keep in mind every tire brand and model is a bit different from each other. The alignment specs are as wide as they are to give a knowledgeable tech to set the values based on feedback from the owner, if the owner can actually feel the differences.
Search the term “pneumatic trail” for a little info on the complicated nature of lumps of string rubber and air that keep us on the road. The best toe is highly dependent on this value.
Target scrub radius is usually 3-8mm negative because it stabilizes the tire patch. When the owner slaps on wider wheels with a less positive offset, it screws that up and pushes it positive. That makes the car much more darty over bumps. SAI is generally minimized within cost and packaging constraints. Audi and others put 4 ball joints in each corner of the car to stand the SAI up and point it to the tire centerline but that is a costly solution.
Back to toe… If I set my toe to slightly out on strut car with steering arms in front, I can feel when the toe goes to zero as I increase speed. If the zero point comes at 75 mph, the car will wander and tramline but it will get the best MPGs. If rear toe is set the same way, the rear waggles as much as the front and makes the car downright annoying.
If you want the Camry to actually handle well in corners, you need lots of negative camber in the front, zero camber in the rear, a little to a lot of toe out (0.3 to 0.5 degrees total) front and 0.1 degrees toe out at the rear and about 4 to 10 psi higher rear tire pressures. The more you want to reduce understeer, the more pressure you need.
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Depends on what you mean by decent. My base Tesla Model 3 has an EPA range of 273 miles and is comfortable and quiet. It is also affordable with an MSRP of $40,240 and a tax credit of $3750. Your state might offer credits for an EV too. All that works for me.
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For moi, low-profile begins at 60-series. Yeah, I’m ‘that’ guy.. Skinny 70-series or higher! Tracks straight down a highway without the high alignment angles needed to keep a 50-series or such going straight.
I guess I’d be that driver you’d be riding the back bumper of to go faster. I’m the complete opposite: Conservative toe-in, both front and rear, even in a front-wheel drive only vehicle.
Three years ago, I was in a crash that transformed how I drive. A rental van driver swung a door open directly in front of my car, chip-shotting my passenger side view mirror through the passenger window, smashing it, and the mirror landing in the back seat! Not to mention divoting the passenger upper A-pillar.
Since then, the posted speed limit on highways and on most local roads is the fastest I will drive, vs the minimum speed I used to.
So, you all have been forewarned: you will know it’s me when you see a train of drivers piled up behind me, doing 30mph in a 30, or 50 in a 55, or 60 in a 65, right-hand lane that is.
Nahh, I don’t tailgate. It might BE a sport here in south Florida where I live but I don’t participate. But I do exceed the limits on the highway because I don’t want to get run over.
As to Camry alignments… they were an “if” you want to handle better. I set cambers rather conservatively until I hit the track. Toe is set to the minimum to make me feel comfortable at highway speeds. Slightly in or slightly out depending on what the car tells me it wants.
I do 50 in a 55 - in the right lane. Others can pass me to my left, and: onrampers ahead of me can breathe, and merge onto the highway without feeling like I’m bearing down on them.
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RE: Price range
I was at the Columbus auto show this year and remember walking around looking at the new domestic brand trucks and their $70k-$120k price tags and just shaking my head at the ridiculousness of the sticker prices. As I walked around, I came upon the Mercedes vehicles and sat in one of their electric car/suv models(a prototype or pre-build IIRC) and was curious about the price and looked at the sticker in the window and thought “Wow! This is only $54k?! Not bad.” Gave it a minute and had to double take on my thoughts as $54k is still pretty high up there, but the prices of the new trucks had softened the blow.
However, in my town, I would trust the full sized truck at twice the price in both my driveway AND a random parking lot over the Merc anyday of the week to not get targeted for vandalism.
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