Wheel Question

Maintenance/Repairs
1

Would swapping wheels (with tires on them and all) from Car A to Car B be ok if:

Car A:

Has bolt pattern 114.3 x 5
Wheel size is 16 x 6.5
Tire size is 215/60/16
Hub and center bore diameters are 67.1
Wheel offset is 44-48 mm

Car B:

Has same bolt pattern, same wheel size and same tire size. The difference is the hub and center bore diameters are 60.1. Also wheel offset is 48-52mm

Obviously using the wheels on Car B on Car A is physically impossible, however, could I safely install and drive using the wheels from Car A on car B? Everything is the same except the center bore diameter. Would I need to get a hub centric ring to fill in the gap?

From what I understand the hub centric ring does not bear any weight/load, (some people say it does and say if you don’t use a hub-centric ring adapter your wheel studs can snap off, however I believe this is a MYTH but can anyone clarify this?)

From what I understand the hub centric rings just help center the wheels when mounting them. But as long as I torque lug nuts in a star pattern down to spec it should be perfectly safe to use the wheels from car A on car B right?

Or do I HAVE to buy the hub centric rings? Or would these wheels be unsafe to swap regardless?

2

Most customer’s cars I have serviced with aftermarket wheels did not have hub centric rings, it is necessary to lift the wheel to align the lug nuts while tightening.

Many hub centric rings are plastic, do those prevent the studs from breaking off? For a few dollars more you can buy aluminum rings.

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3

If the wheel hub and the bearing hub tight tolerance was not important, then why does every modern vehicle make sure they are a tight fit???

Yes, a gap can cause vibration problems and under certain conditions you can snap wheel studs as well as lug nuts can work loose… Hub centric rings are very cheap and need to be used, some shops will refuse to remove a wheel (rotate etc) if they are not used when there is a gap…

4

Would could a wheel stud snap if there isn’t any load on the hub bearing?

5

How is there no load on the bearing?? Are the wheels off the ground??

I have seen a lot of wheel offs over the years even being properly torqued to spec, almost everyone had custom wheels and no hub centric’s…

Hitting pot holes can/will jar the wheel and having the hubs both match up puts the load mainly on the hub and not the studs, now add custom wheels with a gap and no centric rings and hit the same pothole and now it is only the wheel studs absorbing the hit, a few of those and you can snap a stud…

Studs can/will stretch over time, some worse than others, and putting the full load just on the studs only adds to the issue…

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6

If neg offset:
On your car A -48 offset vs car B -52 offset, using A on B will move the wheel/tire 0.160" closer to the steering/suspension, as long as it doesn’t touch/rub, you are good…

If pos offset: +48/+52 then it will be 0.160" farther away…

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7

Correct me if I’m wrong, but from what I understand, hub centric rings do not bear a load and their sole purpose is to make mounting and centering the wheel easier.

The weight of the vehicle is supported by the friction between the wheel and its mounting surface on the axle. The friction is created when the lug hardware is properly installed and torqued to specs in correct start pattern and foot pound

I am planning on ordering the rings regardless for peace of mind

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8

You are correct. The centering rings carrry no load, they only locate the wheel. It helps center the wheel while tightening. If the lugs come loose, the centering rings will help save the studs from breaking for longer… long enough to pull over and tighten them.

The friction between the wheel and hub caused by tight lugs creating that clamping force is what takes the load.

9

Could there be any consequences of running the setup I described in my OP without the hubcentric rings?

Could lack of the hubcentric rings in this setup cause the lug nuts to work themselves loose, even if they are torqued to specs?

Or are you saying if someone maybe forgot to tighten the lug nuts properly, the hubcentric ring would act as a fail safe and buy you a very small amount of extra time to pull over and tighten them?

If it’s correct that the center bearings don’t bear load and I didn’t have a problem mounting the wheel to the car and torque everything by the books, is there any real reason to use the rings?

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10

In the order of your questions…

The only consequence is getting your wheels tightened off center. Much more likely without the centering rings.

No, once tighten properly, the lugs will stay tight. I have raced on wheels with larger center hubs and never lost a wheel or lug.

Yes, exactly.

Yes, there is. The rings assure the wheels are centered when the lugs are tightened.

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11

Few more questions,

1.) What would the consequences be of having wheels mounted off center without the rings? Even with everything torqued down to specs?

2.) Given all the specs in my OP, is this setup using car A’s wheels on car B 100% safe in the long run as long as I get the hubcentric rings?

3.) Using car B’s wheels on car A could have disastrous consequences correct? Since car B’s wheel center is 60.1mm and car A’s wheel hub is 67.1mm, the wheel would not bottom out on the wheel studs in this scenario correct?

My friend and I were possibly going to swap wheels, his car is car A and my car is car B. Looks like i’ll just have to buy his wheels and he’ll just have to use that money to get new wheels he likes…

12

  1. It would vibrate a little or a LOT. It would feel like an unbalanced tire, wear like an unbalance tire and stress the suspension like an unbalanced tire. You seem to be trying to talk yourself out of buying centering rings… Not a good idea. Buy the rings.

  2. As long as nothing rubs it will be a safe (with the centering rings) as the current wheels

  3. Correct. Only a blithering idiot would try and tighten B’s wheels on car A. Even worse if they tried to drive on them. The only way that works is to dis-mount the tires, take the wheels to a machine shop to enlarge the center hole on a lathe and remount and balance the tires. The cost of that would buy a new set of cheap wheels or a used set with tires on them.

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13

Hub centric provides two primary benefits; it’s easier to mount and balance a wheel (a big bonus to the manufacturer) and the mechanical support provided by the hub to wheel interface reduces the chances of a pothole strike distorting the studs and causing the wheel to be mis-located. Left in that state can lead to wheel holes getting wallowed out, studs breaking and worst case, loss of the wheel. The designs and materials used for hub centric and lug centric are different for a reason. Most aftermarket wheels are designed to fit many applications. So adding the spacers to restore the hub centric support is needed to restore the full capability and robustness of the original design. Granted, the potential for failure is low, but it’s not non-existent. Especially if the roads where one drives are riddled with pot holes like they are around here. I agree with Mustangman, just get the spacers and we’ll all sleep better :wink:

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