Hi all. First post here and looking for help. My 2011 5.7 Grand Cherokee went in mid January 2020 for a $5700 entire engine rebuild at a certified dealer (Bergstrom in Wisconsin) which included a 2 year parts and labor warranty.
Fast forward 8 months and I brought it in to my mechanic to have an oil change and check out the recent ticking noise. After looking at it, my mechanic’s diagnosis was to not change the oil, but to bring it back to the dealer for repairs. He found the ticking noise to be a manifold exhaust leak, internal coolant leak, timing cover bolt loose.
I am not sure how to post photos, but I have photos of all the work performed for the engine rebuild and a detailed parts list. I brought my mechanic’s recommendation to my certified dealer. The first response was “well we wouldn’t have touched the exhaust manifold” to which I replied, “well you did in order to split my engine do the rebuild engine”. He then responded “I guess with that amount of work, we would have”. So that conversation gave me very little hope. Then he stated the next step was to make an appointment to see if it’s anything they did.
I am just trying to arm myself with knowledge before I go back to drop my vehicle off tomorrow morning. I spent $5700 on an entire engine rebuild and 3900 miles later I have a myriad of engine issues and their response isn’t giving me any hope that they’ll stand behind the work. Looking at the parts below, should I have a manifold exhaust leak 3900 miles after engine rebuild? What is the likely-hood of an internal coolant leak (mechanic thinks it’s due to an internal gasket) after an extensive engine rebuild? Questions I should ask? Any useful information I should know?
I really do appreciate any help/input. Thank you.
Since I’m not sure how to post photos, I’ll list the service/parts:
Edit: I linked service repair bills here:
- Seal - Intake Manifold
- Seal - PCV
- Seal - PCV
- Gasket-Cylinder Head Cover
- Gasket-Spark Plug Well
- Filter-Engine Oil
- Solenoid-Oil Control
- O Ring-Heater Line
- Gasket-Chain Case Cover
- Seal-Crankshaft Oil
- Sensor-Fluid Temperature
- Gasket-Cylinder Head
- Gasket-Cylinder Head
- Repaired wire harness and replace cam and lifters assembled and performed verification test passed.
If the manifold broke in the first month after the repair it might be considered due to poor workmanship of the shop but it’s way beyond that and often exhaust manifolds crack due to repeated heating and cooling. Over the years I have replaced many on most every brand of domestic cars and trucks. The Jeep 4.0 engine was notorious for cracking the exhaust as was the Dodge/Plymouth slant six and possibly the Ram 5,7 is developing such a reputation.
I’ve always answered customers who returned to me with such complaints that I just repair them I don’t adopt them. But I’ve had people want me to replace a tire that went flat within a few days of leaving my shop because I had the wheels off to repair the brakes.
I’d like to know why the camshaft was replaced, and the old one not reused. A new one is a bit overkill.
Also you have a 2 year parts and labor warranty, should take advantage of that if you can.
It might be helpful to know why the engine was rebuilt in the first place, as well.
Do you really think any good shop is going to reuse a 9 year old camshaft during an engine rebuild ? Doubtful .
There’s plenty of 15 yearold cars using their original camshaft, and running fine.
It looks to me like a way to make a higher bill for the customer. If they send an engine in to be rebuilt to a shop, they have money so why not milk the situation for more money?
Engine was rebuilt due to mice chewing through a wiring harness that controls the 8 cylinder function for eco mode which resulted in failure or properly functioning lifters creating an internal ticking noise of the valve train.
[quote=“Rod-Knox, post:2, topic:170557”]If the manifold broke in the first month after the repair it might be considered due to poor workmanship of the shop but it’s way beyond that and often exhaust manifolds crack due to repeated heating and cooling. Over the years I have replaced many on most every brand of domestic cars and trucks. The Jeep 4.0 engine was notorious for cracking the exhaust as was the Dodge/Plymouth slant six and possibly the Ram 5,7 is developing such a reputation.
I’ve always answered customers who returned to me with such complaints that I just repair them I don’t adopt them. But I’ve had people want me to replace a tire that went flat within a few days of leaving my shop because I had the wheels off to repair the brakes.[/quote]
I appreciate your unbiased opinion. In 2013, I had the manifold bolts replaced under warranty. At the time, this was a known issue and I opted to buy an upgraded bolt. The bolts were used in the repair and went 7 years without issue. Do you think they would have used the same bolts or put new ones on (which may have been the inferior bolts) when reassembling? I am just floored that bolts would be bad after 8 months, 3900 miles.
If you argue who is responsible for the repairs before the shop has a chance to inspect the vehicle you can expect resistance. You need to give them the opportunity to inspect the vehicle.
The camshaft and liters were replaced to address a valve train noise, it would make no sense to disassemble the engine, then put the old parts back in.
There are no bolts on the invoice, the exhaust manifolds may not have been removed from the cylinder heads.
[quote=“Dappersworth, post:3, topic:170557”]
I’d like to know why the camshaft was replaced, and the old one not reused.
found cam delamination and lifters not pumping up
i sure as hell wouldn’t reinstall that cam.
Who recognizes this tool?
Why is it needed?
Exhaust manifold spreader.
Aligns the holes on the exhaust manifold to the holes on the head.
Wow! Let me make a note here… Tester really is a professional mechanic…
Just in case that question comes up in the future
That is for people that can’t afford a new exhaust manifold.
Not going to work on a Hemi.
Minutes ago I searched for replacement exhaust manifolds for your 5.7L and found many offered new and used. I would extrapolate from that information that there is an ongoing issue with those manifolds failing.
The tool that I linked above is specifically made to deal with small block Chevrolet exhaust manifolds which are usually warped when removed from an engine and even after having them machined flat at the mating surfaces that tool is usually required to get the bolts started. It stretches the flanges from the center pair of cylinders to the end cylinders. If a shop was building engines to Lunar landing specifications everything would be new and I can just imagine what a factory new 5.7L engine would cost if it included new manifolds, bolts , pulleys, etc. in order to have a warranty for everything that is removed with the engine.
Thanks for all the information. I should have caught the lack of line item for manifold bolts. Will update after they dig into it.
One concern I might have since there appeared to be a disagreement over whether or not the exhaust manifolds were removed along with an internal coolant leak I wonder if the heads were even checked for flatness and I see no mention of any machine shop sublet work on a head rework.
To me anyway, that repair order appears to be pretty skimpy on information considering this is supposed to be a full overhaul. I assume that 3128 is for ??? but it just does not read like it to me.
I’ve seen some of those Chevy exhaust manifolds curl up when the bolts were removed. In several cases the bolt holes would end up nearly 3/8 of an inch out of whack.
Maybe just semantics but the OP claims a “complete engine rebuild” but there are no rings, pistons, rods, or machining done? Not even sure if the valves were ground and the heads serviced. This really was not an engine rebuild but replacing upper engine parts and the associated gaskets. Maybe I missed something.
This was an engine repair, not a rebuild. The camshaft and lifters were replaced, no reason to rebuild the bottom end or cylinder heads.
The entire thing sounded a bit odd to me is all. The OP did mention several times an “entire engine build” when the parts list did not reflect that.
His regular mechanic apparently found an internal coolant leak so that led me to wonder whether or not the heads had been checked for flatness, block deck was flat, and so on. I sincerely hope this is not a repair job going the wrong way. Already 3 issues in 3900 miles when there should be none.
Sorry, I should say repair, not rebuild. I’m definitely not a mechanic so I didn’t realize all the other work that goes into a rebuild. This is why i come to you guys! Appreciate all the info everyone’s given so far.