Just when you thought things were getting safer

I would agree with that. Or lack of parental guidance. Or just plain old fashioned laziness.

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Having tried Google Maps, I prefer Apple Maps, particularly because it talks to me in the same dialect that I select for Siri, but I digress, and if you donā€™t drive off the road blindly following the instructions, it will reroute you after you drive past where it told you to turn. Both mapping apps get updated often, and Iā€™ve personally witnessed them working out some of these types of problems through use of the apps.

In spite of their flaws, I find GPS apps very useful. On a long road trip, it can steer me around an accident or traffic that is backed up for other reasons. Iā€™d much rather glance quickly at my phone screen than constantly have my head turned to the side looking for addresses while Iā€™m driving down the road. A GPS is also useful if youā€™re out running errands to places to which youā€™ve never been. I can get a lot more done if I use my GPS.

Iā€™ve worked as a truck driver, so I can make my way with an atlas or a map, but GPS makes navigating much easier.

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So do I. I usually rely on the GPS system built into my 2011 Outback, but because that system is CD-based, it doesnā€™t accurately depict certain ā€œnewā€ interchanges and intersections, and there are sometimes addresses that arenā€™t in its database. If I run into a situation of ā€œaddress not foundā€, then I use WAZE.

I find WAZE to be very accurate, but the thing that disturbs me about it is the ā€œlive updateā€ info regarding accidents and speed traps. In order for a driver to input that type of info, he/she has to take his attention off of his driving tasks, and that is not a good thing.

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We have an older Garmin with perpetual map updates. They said in the instructions to update at least every two years to avoid problems with directions. Iā€™ve read elsewhere that these problems arenā€™t confined to stale data, and can include directions that are wrong.

While I do occasionally get ā€œaddress not foundā€ with my CD-based GPS, it has never misdirected me when an address was in its database. Also, the fact that it is integrated with both the carā€™s audio system and its Bluetooth function means that the audio is automatically muted when it is dictating directions to me, and if I receive a phone call, I donā€™t need to manually mute either the GPS or the audio system.

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We donā€™t have those issues with our 2019 Odyssey. It must be newer generation integration. I imagine new Subarus automatically mute channels appropriately. One downside Iā€™ve noticed in that sometimes the GPS voice is muted. The only way Iā€™ve found to increase the volume is to adjust it when the GPS voice is active. It makes sense, but you gotta move fast.

Before Covid I use to go on a business trip at least once a month. Somewhere between 12 and 20 times a year. I use Google Maps a LOT. And Iā€™ve never ever experienced what you did. Iā€™m not saying itā€™s perfectā€¦but itā€™s several magnitudes better then a fold-up map and asking directions. And itā€™s getting better every day.

ā€¦ and that is why I no longer have to rely on fold-up maps, and rarely have to ask directions. I will continue to rely on my in-car GPS, and will use WAZE if the carā€™s GPS is unable to locate an address. If both of those systems were to fail, then I would return to using Google Maps.

No such thing as an autonomous vehicle that is on public roads. Only works on test track. WAY too many variables to replace the driver, no matter how bad a driver they areā€¦ The public purse will have to supply all the parameters to the roads to allow ā€œautonomousā€ to even begin to be viable.

Computers are binary: yes/no or on/off or left/right. Life is full of gray areas and decisions have to be made, I will choose a human brain over ā€œautonomousā€ every time. Elon Musk will be doing hard time in hell, right next to Zuckerberg, for claiming his cars are autonomous,

Ahā€¦Youā€™d be wrong.

BS in Computer Science and an MS in Applied Mathematicsā€¦Iā€™ll say with confidence that you havenā€™t a clue on how computers work.

Computers have been doing AI for decades. As they get faster and faster they can do a analysis far faster then a human can.

I will choose an autonomous vehicle over a drunk driver any day.

There are many levels of autonomous vehicles.
Level one is available in most vehicles with Automatic braking, lane detection, dynamic cruise control.

Level 5 is fully autonomous. A vehicle has to meet many standards

There are vehicles on PUBLIC roads TODAY with no driver. That doesnā€™t mean they are ready for ALL public roads. There are autonomous vehicles on the road today with a driver ready to take over if thereā€™s a problem. We are probably 10 years away from making an autonomous vehicle available for the general public. But itā€™s comingā€¦get ready for it.

HUH??? The Tesla was NOT suppose to be driven in autonomous mode without a driver being right there to make corrections. Musk/Tesla has NEVER EVER made the claim their vehicles are fully autonomous. Any vehicle that is fully autonomous must meet the standards I posted above before any state or the DOT will allow them to be on the road. And there are many vehicles on the road today which have the same technology as the Tesla.

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Forty years experience in systems design and implementation ā€¦

AI is an oxymoron. A computer is simply a tool which provides ā€œresultsā€ based upon itā€™s ā€œinstructionsā€ and ā€œinputsā€, regardless of whether theyā€™re provided by the programmer or user. i.e. A computer currently canā€™t make a value based decision whether to run over the huge empty paper that blew onto the highway or slam on the brakes at the risk of being rear ended by the Semi tailgating behind you.

ā€œNo matter how smart the programmer, how user friendly the program and how many safeguards built in, thereā€™s always some idiot who will find a way to crash it!ā€.

Yes, systems have dramatically improved and will continue to improve, probably beyond the skill of the average driver in an average situation, but can fail miserably when faced with a unique situation.
i.e. Boeing

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But hereā€™s the real question, in my opinion

Would you choose an autonomous vehicle over a sober and alert driver any day . . . ?!

That depends who it is. Thereā€™s a lot more to it. Just because they are alert doesnā€™t mean they can respond quickly enough or respond correctly in the situation presented. Split second decision making means a human driver canā€™t always look in all three rear view mirrors, look ahead, and then decide what to do. Autonomous systems will already have all that information processed before the human decides to survey the situation. In a crisis, reaction time is paramount. Humans just canā€™t compete on that level.

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I thought I saw somewhere a few years ago that one of the things necessary for autonomous cars to function correctly was to basically install some kind of sensors or radio equipment under or near every single road that was open to vehicular traffic?

The steering wheel has sensors that insist you have your hands on the wheel but people have created devices to defeat that- clamps and weights. And over and over again, this tech comes with warnings when you learn about them and when activating them, saying that these advances are driver aids only, and not meant to replace drivers and that the drivers must remain vigilant. But people take advantage and get lax and make bad judgments when they see how competent the Traffic-Aware Cruise Control, Enhanced AutoPilot, and Full Self-Driving (still a misnomer) are in the end. Still, the accident rate while using AutoPilot features is about 10% the unaided human accident rate.

There is a fictional road right through our property on Garminā€™s maps. Some say they do this on purpose to prove copyright infringement by competitors.

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ā€œMachine Intelligenceā€ and ā€œHuman Intelligenceā€ both have advantages and disadvantages so the best solution is a combination of both. i.e A kill switch for the human when the computer wants to drive over a flooded road and maybe a Dope Slap feature when the human decides to take a nap.

Weā€™ve actually been using machine intelligence for years starting with automatic timing advance then automatic transmissions, ABS braking, traction assist, adaptive transmissions, lane assist, emergency braking, parking assist, etc. and it will become more widespread and improve but thereā€™s still limitations. For example, an autonomous vehicle will help you get to the hospital safely but it currently canā€™t understand that, ā€œItā€™s 4 in the morning, clear roads, not a soul in sight and the wife is getting ready to immediately deliver baby #2 so screw the speed limitā€. :slightly_smiling_face:

My point is that the solution isnā€™t ā€œeither orā€, itā€™s both.

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Sheer stupidity

A few years ago we were in Indianapolis trying to get back to the airport for a return flight. The GPS certainly took us to the airport but nobody had informed the manufacturer that they closed the airport a month before and weā€™re now using the new airport. We got lucky and flag down a car rental shuttle and we follow them to the new place . it was right out of the outer limits. Ghost Town seeing the empty Airport!

Better question would beā€¦would I choose to be in an autonomous vehicle when all other vehicles on the road are autonomous vehicles over a mix of autonomous vehicles and human driversā€¦YES.

Autonomous vehicles on the road today have had accidents. But the VAST majority (about 99.999%) have been caused by a human driverā€¦NOT the car. One autonomous vehicle did kill a woman walking her bike across a street. But the vehicle also had a driver who wasnā€™t paying attention (and should have been). As I said many times they are NOT ready NOW to be fully autonomous without a driver. Maybe 10 years.

Autonomous vehicles are predicted to save over 300k lives per year. HOWEVERā€¦the down side isā€¦how many jobs will it cost. Thatā€™s my huge concern.

Wanna Bet? I suggest you read more about autonomous cars and the technology before you make that kind of statement.

40 years? Really?

If I wasnā€™t about to retire after over 40+ years as a software engineer / architect, then Iā€™d be moving out of the telecom field and into the autonomous driving arena. 2-3 companies in the Boston area are now looking for C++ engineers for the autonomous projects.