Full Synthetic 0W-20 engine oil change interval

@oldtimer-11 I have the same problem you have with large feet. I wear a size 14. I have caught myself stepping on the brake and accelerator at the same time with my right foot. I always wanted an Austin Healey Sprite, but I know with my foot size it would be difficult for me to drive.

Well we are off topic with large feet . I tell people that with my clown feet at least I will not fall over on my face .

This seems strange. My 15 forester, the manual says oil change at 6 mo/6k miles.

This precedes the part you quoted-

I take it he puts very little mileage on it so the elapsed time criteria is being used for change interval…

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To say that the most successful auto maker on the planet is pathologically screwing their customers is absurd on its surface.

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There are mechanics here who are currently up to date on the latest developments in the automotive world and spend their work days actually servicing and repairing modern day vehicles.

They spend a lot of time correcting the misinformation put out there by “Google Educated” or “YouTube Certified” mechanics.

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Differing opinions on motor oils has been going on for decades. The late Tom McCahill, in his book, “What You Should Know About Cars” published about 1962, recommended one not use multi-viscosity oil. He said that 10W-30 was a lousy # 10 and a lousy #30. The real purpose of 10W -30 was that service stations did not have to stock every viscosity from #5 to #50 weight oils. He claimed that in his own cars, he ran one viscosity higher than the manufacturers recommended and never had an oil burner in over 80,000 miles on his cars. Also, McCahill didn’t like detergent oil. He said “I prefer detergent in my bathtub but not in my motor oil”.
I ran 10W-30 high detergent in my 1954 Buick and it didn’t use any oil after 160,000 miles and had never had the heads or pan off the engine.

@ToyotaWill, My best understanding of your dislike for 0W20 oil is that it is too thin when cold. Just how thin is 0W20 oil at 0*F? And is 0W20 oil thinner at ZERO Fahrenheit than at 200?

I see a couple of misconceptions about oil here. Some are simply outdated. They were valid but not as valid any longer

First 0w20 is not thiner than 5w20 at operating temperature. They are the same. Only at freezing temperatures is 0w20 thinner that 5w20, but both are way thicker at freezing temperatures than they are at operating temperatures.

Combustion by-products are no longer the chief contributor to oil contamination. The primary source is the oil itself as it breaks down over time due to heat.

Oil suffers the most breakdown just after the engine is shut down from operating temperature which I shall refer to as “hot” from now on. At a hot shutdown, the oil pump stops with the engine, so oil stops flowing under pressure. Any oil flow left is oil draining back to the pan. But some oil remains in the engine coating the oil passages, metal wear surfaces (i.e. bearings) and in valleys located in the head.

This remaining oil has to absorb all the residual heat from the engine until it cools down. This little bit of oil gets much hotter than it did when it was flowing and this is where most of the oil break down occurs. Only a very small amount of oil is affected and the next time the engine is started, it gets flushed back into the oil pan and mixes with the rest of the oil. Over time with a lot of cycles, it builds up in the oil and needs to be changed out.

This is not the only source of oil break down. Some is broken down due to sheering action of the the rings and bearings sliding over metal surfaces. Some also comes from exposure to the hottest parts of the engine but while the engine is running, the exposure is very brief.

This leads to the time and miles recommendation for oil changes. Most drivers have two to four drive cycles per work day and maybe four over the weekend. That would be 20 to 28 drive cycles per week. By drive cycles, I mean cold start, drive, hot shutdown.

If a driver has a long commute, they will accumulate more miles, but still have relatively the same number of hot shutdowns. A driver with a short commute, fewer miles but still about the same number of hot shutdown.

The manufacturers determine how many hot shutdowns they think the oil can take and set the time based on this. They also determine the maximum miles they think the oil can take even with fewer hot shutdowns, and that sets the miles limit.

Now as for the 0w20 being too thin. I was born in Vermont. My parents and grand parents frequently used 20HD oil in the winter, sometimes even 10HD. The cars still got up to normal operating temperatures so that oil got pretty thin. In those days, oil technology wasn’t near as good as today, neither was the metallurgy and manufacturing processes, but they would still get 80 to 100k out of an engine. That was considered pretty good back in the 50’s. Not many cars went over 100k even in warmer regions where 30HD was used year round.

So I am not to concerned about 0w20 oil, I will continue to use it in the vehicles that recommend it. I am a little concerned about the 10k OCI since finding sludge in my daughters Camry oil filter housing. I will be doing 7500 on it from now on. I have used 7500 mile OCI with synthetic oils for many years on many vehicles with no issues, yet.

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I think it is probably time to shut this thread down. Kind of like a disruptive uncle coming to dinner. I think all that needs to be said has been said. As I poured my 0-20 speced by Acura into my engine, it sure didn’t seem like water to me. Its getting cold here in Minnesota now so when it hits 10 below I’ll put some outside overnight to see how it flows.

@ToyotaWill welcome to the community. I’ve been looking in on this thread periodically. Thanks for your contributions; I’m sure you’ll find your experience here enjoyable but please take it easy and get to know people. Disagreements happen all the time, but they don’t need to be too heated.

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I think it is time to shut you down from making insulting, demeaning comments that have no basis in reality. I never even communicated with you on this thread, but you feel free to attack me. Plus, you sound like you think you are going to control this thread and shut it down. Perhaps that is why cdaquila created her post, as it smells like you reported this post. I think it is time for me to report posters, as the abuse they dish out needs to be addressed and stopped.

I have none

I’ve been using this “water” engine oil for years with no ill-effects

Vehicles come in for scheduled maintenance, either every 3, 6 or 10 months, depending on several factors. Since I literally see the same vehicles again and again, I WILL know if there is a problem. And there have been absolutely no problems associated with the engine oil.

No thank you . . . I have no intention of viewing any video on Castrol’s website. Why should I?

Many of the vehicles I work on use this “water” oil and there’s no problem, so why worry about problems that don’t pertain to me, anyways? Seems to me there’s no point in watching the video

I’m no engineer, so there MAY be some grain of truth to your statement, provided the video was produced by engineers in the automotive field or petroleum industry.

That said, I work on various vehicles 40hrs a week. :man_mechanic: Real world, not just testing in the lab. So I’d say I probably have more “real-world” experience repairing vehicles than they do. And not just Toyotas, but several different brands, from Class 1 through Class 8

I know that the vehicles I work on . . . several of which use this “water” oil . . . are experiencing no problems whatsoever. I know that much. That limited bit of knowledge serves me well

I dare say . . . this is proving to be quite a lively discussion :thinking:

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I remember reading about Andy Granatelli when he raced cars in the Indy 500. When someone mentioned 0W-20 having the viscosity of water, in one race Andy’s car lost most of its oil. There were rules against adding oil, so Andy put water in the crankcase to float up what little oil was left. He got In a couple more laps before the engine blew. I think this was in the 1940s just after WW II.
I hope we can keep this board civil and not attack posters who have a different opinion. I enjoy posting on this board and I appreciate the tolerance of the real mechanics on this board for my comments. I have limited automotive knowledge and even less skills in doing automotive repairs. Many of the comments on this board have been quite helpful for me. Mrs. Triedaq enjoys taking a swipe at me if I happen to leave the computer on and she sees of the comments I make.
Let’s keep this board fun as well as informative.

ummm… I hope you don’t mind my asking: does your Triedaq moniker refer to ‘tried aq’ as in tried aqueous?

(and as full disclosure, my Waterbuff doesn’t refer to being ‘a fan of water’ :grinning:)

@Waterbuff My handle, Triedaq, pronounced Tree-dah, (the “q” is silent) was the name of my late dog. My son was four years old when we adopted the dog as a puppy. He named the dog. However, the dog was male and a regular spelling of the name made it look like it was Latin feminine. Therefore, I put a silent “q” on the end of the name so that the dog wouldn’t have a sex identity crisis.
Triedaq lived to be 16. He was never mean and didn’t nose around into other people’s business. I admired that quality and decided to honor him by using his name as my handle on this board.

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I haven’t attacked ToyotaWill

I merely responded to his comments and offered my own professional experiences, which don’t support his assertions

Actually, nobody reported any of your posts. I had been watching the direction of the discussion and I was hoping to stave off having to close it if the argument got too personal.

If there are posts you feel are inappropriate you’re more than welcome to use the flag buttons.

@cdaquila

Thank you for your welcome. Your post is worded in such a way that leads me to believe you are a moderator on the site. If you have been looking in on this thread, you should have seen that a number of the posters here have been rude, abusive, have called me names, and other unacceptable nastiness… Those are the people who need to be addressed. I merely began this post, only to be ridiculed and harassed, so you should view what you consider heated as a normal response from someone who came here for dialogue and discussion, NOT abuse, name-calling, and insults. Perhaps you can have a way to private message me so I can specifically discuss this with you.

She is a moderator. Click on her picture and select Message in the upper right hand corner of the box that pops up to send her a message directly