DTC U0121 x 4. "4 modules not communicating to EBCM"

No, doing all maintenace based on mileage is incorrect. Oil changes once a year no matter how many miles. Brake fluid changes every 3 years no matter how many miles. Battery and tire replacements on time rather than miles. Timing belt replacement on time rather than miles.

All correct since they are xxx miles or yy months whichever comes first. Not a waste of money.

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I’ve been driving this Terrain for 9 months without the ABS working. Actually the loss of the collision alert, lane departure warning and the flashing “service power steering” message have all bothered me more than not having ABS. But the reason any or all of it matters is that I need to sell this car and don’t think many people would be interested in buying it with all this crap going on.

hmmm … one thought experiment to consider, what if you could sell it for $1500 less now, compared to fixing it for $2000 to effect the repair, then selling it for the higher price? It seems like since you intend to sell this vehicle, it might be worth taking a chance to put it on the market, see what the best offer it brings you, as-is. There’s a lot of diy’ers looking for this sort of vehicle who’d be willing to take the chance of being able to fix it themselves, if the price was right. As a backup plan, they’d figure they could drive it with the warning lights on. One issue w/the warning lights though, might cause problems if state law requires safety or emissions testing.

No matter how carefully you drive their will always be someone who turns in front of you , stops suddenly for no reason and a whole list of stupid things people do.

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Four modules have the same fault recorded: loss of communication with the ABS module. The ABS module is “offline”.

Those modules may be the PCM/TCM, Power steering control module, Lane departure module and Pre-Collision module. Also, there is likely no communication between the scan tool and ABS module.

Das ist kaputt.

With so much electronic overkill on late model vehicles, those pre 2010 cars are beginning to look more appealing.

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It could always be something simple. There’s a difference between a real diagnostician and parts swappers. I have a couple youtube channels I watch regularly with guys that actually diagnose the problem. It’s a pleasure watching them work.

I found this looking up your DTC. It’s a bit tough wading through some of it but keep watching to see the root cause. Imagine if it was this simple? BTW- My FIL had his furnace acting up. Guy comes, replaces the control board TWICE, igniters etc still has problem and he left to come back another day. I found it in less than 10 minutes- a loose ground wire…

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And, you can apply the brake–as needed–on just one, or two, or three wheels, rather than on all four?
Amazing! :wink:

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No, assuming that one should change oil and brake fluid solely on the basis of odometer mileage–and not on the basis of elapsed time–is incorrect.

OP might put on his Sherlock Holmes hat and consider the problem to be one of simple logic. Then eliminate the possibilities one by one. Once everything else has been eliminated, the cause must be among the only possibilities left.

First, state the known facts

  • The ABS module has four inputs: (1) power & ground; (2) an inter-computer communication bus; (3) 4 wheel speed sensors
  • And it has one output : ABS solenoid pack control
  • A significant current draw caused by an unknown source exists. Removing a fuse indicates it is most likely associated with either the ABS electronics module or the ABS solenoid pack. This could be a vital clue, and should be exploited.

Tests to eliminate the possibilities

  1. Restore fuse, verify current draw, then use a current probe that measures the magnetic field caused by a current in a wire, or just a magnetic compass like boy scouts use for finding directions on a hike, try to follow the magnetic field along the current path caused by the current draw. This might not work if the return current path is adjacent to the draw current, magnetic fields cancel. If so
  2. then unplug ABS connectors (wheel speed, com bus, solenoid pack control, power & ground) one by one to determine if unplugging one of them eliminates the current draw.
  3. No joy from test number 1&2? Disconnect battery then probe the resistance from each wire involved with the ABS system for a short to ground. Still nothing? Then probe each wire to each wire, testing for a short from wire to wire. (May take quite some time.)
  4. Still no joy? Restore to oem configuration , then remove the solenoid pack; does that affect the current draw?
  5. Next remove the ABS electronics module. Does that affect the current draw?
  6. Since you now have the module & solenoid pack removed, inspect them carefully under good lighting & magnifying glass, on the work bench.

Yaw rate sensor, steering angle sensor, accumulator pressure sensor, brake pedal stroke sensor, brake light switch…

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Good info. Add those inputs to the list of things to eliminate. I’d place those as being a cause at a lower priority at this point. If one of those is the cause, then replacing the ABS electronics module and solenoid pack won’t fix the problem.

Well George, it is too bad I can’t hand you the keys so you can do everything you just listed. That sort of procedure to track down exactly what the problem is - IS why I finally decided to take it to the dealer. I figured they had everything anyone could need to ID whatever the problem was. I was prepared for nearly anything - but I expected them to come back and say that they found it in 20 minutes and it was XYZ and I’d pay them and be finished OR they would say they need to spend hours tracking it down using a procedure like the one you just listed and it would possibly be hundreds of dollars in labor to get the answer. I would have been OK even with that answer. What I wasn’t prepared for was what they told me - which left me with the impression that not only were they not sure what the problem was, but that they just wanted to replace the most expensive possible components and “start there”. So I left. I sure am not capable of doing what you described myself. I am still curious about this X411 connector possibility - which is another thing I assumed a GMC dealer would know about and investigate.

Think about this situation from the dealership shop’s perspective. If they tell you they want to do a bunch of tests, you are going to ask them how much it will cost. But they won’t be able to tell you until they are done with the tests. That approach while scientifically sound, it creates a no-win situation for the shop. B/c they can’t tell you how much it will cost. On the other hand, they know exactly how much it costs to replace those parts. Their theory undoubtedly is while in the process of replacing those parts, they’ll probably discover the actual problem.

IMO , just pure guess mind you by somebody with no ABS experience, imo the problem isn’t either of those two assemblies. Something else, likely a wiring harness problem.

When this first started, did anything unusual occur just prior? A minor accident? Drove the vehicle through high water?

The very first thing that happened was the battery that had been in there for a couple of years - an AC Delco that the dealer had put in - died with no warning. And I mean totally dead. The next thing was me buying a new battery and putting it in. But everything was fine for 2 weeks after that. The day that the warning lights all came on, 2 memorable (not saying significant) things happened - first, I hit a pothole. Second, a really strong line of storms came through and blew a bunch of dirt towards the rear of the car (which was parked in an open garage at the moment). No water that I recall, although it is possible I had washed the car in that time frame and perhaps got some water from the hose near or inside that X411 connector.

Did you attempt to jump start the dead battery using another vehicle? Before you knew it was totally dead?

no. And in the time I’ve been researching this, I found many things saying that people who did do that caused a problem with the big EPS megafuse. That was the first fuse I checked when I thought perhaps I had shocked some module when I just connected the new battery and got the small spark. I was sure for a month or two that that was the problem but it wasn’t. I should add that it was the day AFTER I hit that pothole that was the very first time I had the whole array of lights and warnings.

My guess is the dead battery was caused by whatever the problem is now. And the problem is probably intermittent, which is why there were no other symptoms for two weeks. It seems pretty unlikely that the pothole or the wind storms are the cause. But if they were, I’d put the pothole as a higher % than the windstorm. When you hit a pothole, the wheel moves up and down quite abruptly. That movement, if abrupt enough, could damage a wheel speed sensor or the harness wiring going to that sensor. A wire could get pinched when a wheel hits a pothole for example, pinched by something in the suspension system that normally (absent potholes) isn’t close enough to the wire to pinch it.

I can’t see any shop risking the liability to intentionally disable the ABS on any vehicle…

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This is basically what the guy said when he handed me the keys. Something like - you don’t really need ABS anyway. As if it wasn’t a big deal. The fuse is out to keep the battery from dying. The owners manual for this car makes it sound like you shouldn’t drive the car at all with any of these lights on, but particularly if the “BRAKE” light is on (which it is). So like I wrote - I am pretty disgusted with the whole situation.

A lot of car owners, particularly those with vintages post 2010, feel the same way I expect. Car designs are getting more more complicated. And the functions are more and more inter-connected. This is good from the point of view of offering the driver modern conveniences and safety features, but causes no end to the problems when a critical function fails.

Pragmatic-thinking-wise, I expect your shop will probably be able to figure out the cause & fix the problem if you give them the go-ahead on the plan they previously proposed.