Yes, I think in fact the OP corrected it in a subsequent post, just a digit switch, OP typed “31” but meant to type “13”.
Yes going to my first response to the op, voltage does not equal amps. I still would have you check the resistance of the negative battery cable, rule it out, the alternator can put out the volts, but amps is what is needed to charge a battery. A corroded cable will supply volts, but not amps. 4 pages later and no solution yet, and cant spend 10 bucks on a new cable or at least inspect it? Typical failure, corrosion at end terminals where the cable coneects to the terminator, corrosion in the cable due to breech in jacket. Been so right many times, wrong other times, but this in my mind explains all issues at this point.
I own a couple of old Cutlasses of the same vintage myself. Assuming that the alternator has been tested, both in the car, and out of the car on a testing tool by a good electrical shop, and has been found to be good, (As others have said, don’t assume it’s good because it’s new/reman.) then you should know that it’s not unusual for Olds of this vintage to have “iffy” underhood wiring harnesses. Age (brittle insulation) and vibration seems to do them in. There are several aftermarket restoration houses out there that can supply you with a new underhood harness. I had to do this with one of my cars. Once I had the new harness installed, viola, problems disappeared.
Good luck and keep us up to date.
Pics? 
Hey DB…Yes I believe it was the first model year. He has TWO of these beasts…and yes they were made in Italy.
My friend who owns them did a few calculations and figure it cost GM about 1.2 million per vehicle… LOL…
GM invested a few BILLION in the Allante project. In additition to all the tooling, the R n D…They purchased a few 747 Airliners to fly these things back n forth from GM to Italy n back…and then only produced 20K vehicles total ?
He figures they are worth over a million per unit…lol. Draw your own conclusions from there…He is selling both his vehicles if anyone wants one.
Yes the “new” alternator was most likely a “Reman” but like you said…it can go awry in either situation. Parts should not be bad out of the box…but if you know how to test things it helps a lot…and test new parts I DO…and OFTEN. Otherwise you could drive yourself proper nuts trying to fix things sometimes. LOL…Good Times People…Good Times.
Blackbird
Well, after writing a long post and losing it while trying to attach a photo, I’ll have to start over.
I’m going to pass on the fine details this time.
I discovered that the wire connections on the horn relay were very warm so I have either replaced a bunch of wires under the hood or thoroughly cleaned the wire terminals of those I couldn’t or didn’t want to replace. What is interesting is that on this car, one of the wires coming off of the coil has a specific internal resistance, and it is marked not to cut or splice. Didn’t replace that unit entirely.
Made a pair of 00 battery cables and installed them.
My question is whether it is OK to put what appear to be modern spark plug wires on this car. The ones I have acquired are Accel High Temp Super Stock Radio Suppression Core 8mm wire. They have a resistance of about 7 kOhms per wire. The one that I measured from the old set was more like a normal copper wire (about 1 ohm). I have not started the car since starting this project, so I am not yet sure if this work will solve the original problem, but it can’t hurt. I’m concerned about using these wires for a car of this vintage.
I’ve attached a photo of the car for anyone interested.
Advice on the plug wires is appreciated. Of course, I need to buy one special wire to use on the #7 cylinder, because the straight boot on the one I bought rubs on the steering shaft. Probably cost about $25 when shipping is involved. Such is life.
Thanks again, and I’ll keep you posted on the progress.
Cryoman
The special wire is most likely a fusible link that is designed to blow out if the designed current capability is exceeded. The heated wires going to the horn relay is strange. The relay is there to only operate the horn. I have to think you have a connection going somewhere it shouldn’t go to and is supplying current to something. Does the horn work? You could remove the relay and see if the wires cool down and if so that most likely means the relay is closed and working all the time and shouldn’t be.
I suggest you replace the sparkplug wires with the suppression wires. You don’t need non-resistive wires. Use the proper plugs also.
Concur, the new resistance wires you’re using should be fine. Spark plug wires these days are much more durable than the ones the came with your car new back in 1968 I expect. I think they use some kind of silicone insulation now. And that stuff is very durable.
The stock wiring was a carbon core resistance wire that was not very durable. You might get it to last through two sets of spark plugs. Many people switched to copper or steel core wire even though it did cause static on the AM radio. The steel core was a little better in the the static department and was a good compromise.
The point type (Kettering) ignition is not sensitive to the resistance of the spark plug wires so you can use pretty much anything, but the coil in this type ignition could only put out about 25kV max, so too much resistance was a problem.
GM went electronic ignition in 75 and introduced a carbon fiber core, silicone impregnated 7mm wire which is very durable. You 8mm wire is a like a heavy duty upgrade and is OK to use. I’d just keep it.
If the horn has a relay…and its hot… that usually means you have the relay wired incorrectly.
If it was wired proper…the horn would be stuck blasting away. Methinks that the electromagnet coil is being energized at all times…which would then blow the horn…but only if the wires were correct and or the horns function. Maybe the horn is blown out and you dont know it…when is the last time you heard it honk ? Test it directly to know for sure…
The horn relay is a simple device… Constant or switched power to one side of the coil in the relay…and the ground to the horn switch device… They could wire it in many many different ways…just pick one that works with what you have available.
I could go on a dissertation on relays and how they work…but the simplest model would be the 4 pole relay in this instance… Power n switched Ground to the electromagnet…and then the two poles out…to feed the switched device. It would be fed power or ground…again…all how they wired it to function. The other 2 poles of the relay put a break or switch in whatever your sending to the horn proper…again…can be power or ground but usually power. You need to review what wires go in and come out of the relay to decide how it was setup. You could have some wires switched up accidentally.
Blackbird
The horn works. I will take a hard look at the wiring diagram to be sure everything got hooked back properly. I’m pretty sure they are correct. I was wondering if the terminals on the wires were so old and corroded that the current was having a hard time flowing from one wire to the other. See below.
There is one wire coming straight from the (+) battery terminal and connects to a flat piece of metal that is part of the relay, and from that same connection goes the main hot wire to/from the alternator, and in conjunction to the voltage regulator. A third wire from that same connection to the fuse panel (CLK/LTR/CTSY) (all 3 wires are connected to one of the screws on the relay). The relay also has other connections in back that actually function to make the horn operate. The wires mentioned above just seem to use the horn relay unit as a junction where several components come together (if this makes any sense). The part called the horn relay seems to do more than just make the horn work.
I’ll keep updating as progress is made.
Cryoman
Your last post makes a lot of sense. It sounds like there has been some jury rigging done on the wiring. The main alternator lead supplies a lot of current to the battery so if there is even a small amount of resistance at a connection point it can cause heat. There should be a fusible link near the battery going to the alternator lead in case the lead gets shorted to ground. If there is no fuse in the circuit I suggest you install about a 80 amp fuse in line with the lead. The wire going to the alternator should be at least a 8 gauge wire. The horn circuit should be on another fused circuit separate from the alternator.
Thanks again for more insight, Cougar. Apparently you have a breadth of experience in this area.
The wiring diagram indicates that the main alternator wire was originally 12GA. There is no indicated useable link there, but the wire going to the fuse panel from that connection point on the horn relay does have one.
One of my thoughts was that, as it it looked like the metal had been painted at some point over the years, the paint may have been causing some resistance in the metal where these wires come together, increasing the resistance.
I just went out to confirm continuity of the wire coming off the alternator and going into the connection on the horn relay (the wires go into and out of some electrical tape holding a bundle together, so I can’t visually trace them). It is fine. What I just realized is that the large wire that the wiring diagram suggests is supposed to be going from the positive battery terminal to the same junction appears to have been disconnected and re-routed to an aftermarket ammeter inside the car. My father is coming to visit next week, and I think he is the one who did this, so I’ll have to try to jog his memory. Nevertheless, I have a hard time believing that the ammeter needs that thick wire (also appears to be 12GA). Perhaps that a major cause of this problem. Now that I say that “out loud”, how is the current from the alternator getting back to the battery to charge it? Perhaps that is the key to this whole problem. I’ll run out and see if I can trace continuity from the alternator wire to the (+) battery cable.
Back in a minute.
There is continuity between the hot lead coming off of the alternator and the (+) battery terminal, but my concern is that it is such an indirect route that this could be a source of the trouble.
I’ll keep assessing the wiring and trying to recreate the original circuits to the best of my ability and see where that gets me.
Thanks again for the advice.
Almost bed time now, so I better sign off.
Cryoman
In my comment posted at 7:14 PM, I said that there is a wire coming straight from the (+) terminal on the battery and connects to the flat metal at the horn relay that feeds other wires. That was based upon the wiring diagram and not how things are now. Just wanted to clarify that, as that statement director contradicts my later statement about that wire not being connected there.
I’ll fix that problem and continue.
Cryoman
There’s a dash ammeter on my early 70’s Ford truck which measures from +40 to -40 amps. - means the battery is discharging, + means the battery is charging. They only way I can imagine it would know what the truck’s current flow was, the current from the alternator to the battery has to go through the ammeter. You’d think that kind of ammeter would be hard to implement as a dash gauge, but it could be just a magnetic needle which is deflected by the magnetic field of the current; i.e. it would have very low resistance, probably impossible to measure. I think you are on the right track to investigate carefully this aftermarket ammeter.
I’m glad you chimed in here, as it resulted in me tracing the wiring of the aftermarket ammeter. In fact, the wiring seems to be as you describe. The hot lead coming off the battery that originally connected to the horn relay junction seems to bypass that now, and it goes into the ammeter. The wire coming out, presumably the return current, does indeed connect to the horn relay where, presumably, the original wire connected. So, the battery is indirectly connected where it should be in this context, which goes through the aftermarket ammeter.
The wire appears to be 12GA thickness.
What do others think about this setup?
I am going to try to get it running this weekend and see how things behave. I’ll add more to this post when I have more information.
Cheers.
Cryoman
I’m presuming the horn relay is involved only in the sense that it sports a place where it is possible connect the two wires you want connected with a very low resistance contact; i.e. the horn relay isn’t involved in the charging circuit, except physically.
One way to quickly assess if there’s a higher than should-be resistance in a high current circuit like that is to measure the temperature along the path. High temperatures only at a certain spot mean the contact there isn’t being made cleanly. This could be an opportunity to buy one of those infrared temperature-measuring guns.
The description of the wiring to the ammeter you have makes sense. In order to measure battery current the way your meter is designed you have to put the meter in series with one of the battery leads. Normally the positive wire is used for this. The leads to the meter do not have a “return” to ground like a voltmeter connection would use. The disadvantage of this type of meter is the fact that the wiring to the meter has to carry the full current of the battery/charging system. There will be some losses in the wire and so less charge to the battery from the alternator, though the voltage regulator may sense that and help make up the loss. I suggest you remove the ammeter along with the wiring to it and install a voltmeter to monitor the battery instead. If you do that, connect the power lead of the meter to a connection point after the ignition switch. I would also use 8 gauge wire for the alternator lead to reduce wire losses.
GeorgeSanJose is correct in stating that the part of the horn relay I have been talking about is just to provide a support for connecting the various wires. It is just a thick piece of metal being attached to the overall relay unit. The actual relay components that run the horn are separate and have different wires plugged into them.
I will follow Cougar’s advice and pick up some 8 gauge wire so I have some on hand. I’ll swap out the current alternator wire when I can.
After I get this puppy running again, hopefully tomorrow, I’ll let you know what I find. Hopefully nothing other than a smooth running engine with no apparent issues.
After this trial is over I need to ID the coolant leak near the back of the engine. I may just pull the heads and have them reconditioned. They need hardened valve seats anyhow, and I think the leak is either from the head gasket or one of the frost plugs.
The adventure continues.
CRYOMAN
Seems like a fun project. Teenage-me had friend with a 442 and I rode around w/him in that car of his many times. One powerful beast. I concur w/ @Cougar 's advice to use 8 AWG wire for the run from the alternator to the battery. 12 AWG is too thin. And make sure it’s really 8 AWG. Some foreign manufactured wire is sometimes found at parts stores where the manufacturer felt the need to save money and backed off on the copper content. Electrical supply shops – like where electricians go for supplies for wiring homes – will have the good stuff. You want stranded 8 AWG.