Good luck and please keep us updated
If the sensor did not fix your problem, it may take a few days for the light to come back on
It was very prudent of you to replace the remaining oxygen sensor before throwing a cat at the car
I think I’m talking to the professionals here and not the DIY crowd, but how hard is it to diagnose a failing catalyst vs. a weak downstream oxygen sensor if you have the right equipment and the car left with you for a suitable period (several hours or overnight)? I see this all the time and I can only assume that there are more shops out there (from local small operations up to the dealers) than I’m aware of that have nothing more than code readers in their toolboxes. I may charge you a hundred bucks to diagnose the cause of your engine light, but I’ll be correct on my findings or you won’t pay for the repair.
Spoke too soon folks - my dang light came back on again this afternoon! I guess it is the cat after all! I have to try to get my son’s car fixed Monday - it has a sensor bank 1 code and a misfire and is older than mine so we’ll get it done first. Guess as the week rolls on I’ll have to go back and if they get the same code (which they probably will) it has to be the cat. Everything else has been checked out, even by the dealership. I have had this car a little over two months and am already wanting to get rid of it! When the other Honda that my son drives had 132,000 on it, there was NOTHING
hit the return too soon - I meant to say there was nothing wrong with my other Honda at this same age and mileage. I have to hope it gets better.
So? How much did that unneeded oxygen sensor cost you?
Tester
Around $147 Tester - could have gone toward fixing the sensor on the CR-V which has a PO 135 code and probably really does need it. Oh well - I guess in one way I appreciated the fact that this mechanic was willing to try to do some tests or something and see if that solved the problem but it obviously didn’t work. Maybe when I get the convertor, I can negotiate the price a bit since this last sensor didn’t work. Very frustrating! When I’ve had check engine problems in vehicles before, it gets solved the first time - guess every vehicle is different though.
Even w/the most trained shop techs available, and with the best test equipment, in some cases the diagnosis is ambiguous, and about all the shop can do is make an educated guess and replace one of the suspect parts and see what happens. Often they’ll get it right, but as you have found, not always. Hopefully replacing the cat will fix the problem now. Best of luck wncgirl.
Update guys - know it’s been a few days. May be getting to the root of this problem and I wish it were better news and a quick fix. I had planned to take my car back down to Meineke yesterday for some additional tests since the last oxygen sensor didn’t work. The mechanic at one time had mentioned that I might have an internal coolant leak because he had to add a bunch of coolant but couldn’t see any leaking out on the ground. Well this last Saturday, the car begins to leak coolant out on the parking lot and is about to overheat, so I had it towed down to Meineke - thank goodness for AAA membership! Turns out I have a blown head gasket! Not wonderful news to hear but he thinks that the coolant may have been leaking into the sensors and maybe the cat, causing the check engine light to come back on. He is working up estimates on two different scenarios and is supposed to be emailing them to me. One scenario is to fix the head gasket itself and the cat if contaminated - he can get me a better price than the first mechanic I talked to there. If the two new sensors are recontaminated, he would replace them again for free. The other scenario would be a place online he knows of that can get a Honda engine with 30,000 to 50,000 on it - he has one on his own personal 02 Civic and hasn’t had any problems. I would want to be sure there’s a warranty on this or any other part for that matter. Here again, the cat and the sensors may or may not need to be replaced. My question is, why is he wanting to replace the radiator at the same time? Is that really necessary? I don’t want to be taken advantage of, but Ifrankly don’t want to take it anywhere else because this particular guy has tried harder than anyone else to help me get to the bottom of things. I doubt AAA would pay to have it towed to yet another person either.
I saw a car that failed emissions pass after using it, but I have not used it myself. I figure that I would pass it along. It’s worth a try before dropping big bucks on a cat. I would like to hear anyone that has used it and it has helped. I’m sure if the cat has melted down into a lump of coal it would not help.
knfenimore - not sure your post makes any sense in my situation - I’m asking if the radiator really needs to be replaced if I have the head gasket done. Are you referring to some sort of additive to add to the cat? No way am I using that stuff unless a mechanic recommends it. Everything I’ve read says it can make things worse.
I think you should seriously consider option 2. I don’t recall that Honda’s blow head gaskets very often unless there is a serious overheating incident, and I don’t recall mention of one here. What I would be concerned about is that its not the head gasket, or not the head gasket by itself but a crack in either the head or the block.
You have some valid points Keith, but I’m trying to find out if the motor has a warranty - I think he orders them from Rock Auto - know nothing about this company. I didn’t get my email today but called them - the Meineke franchise owner doesn’t think there is a warranty from this particular company but he’s going to check and they are supposed to get back with me tomorrow. I also wonder if I really need the radiator replaced if it isn’t leaking?
A 30-50k miles engine is probably a JDM engine. Those are used engines and have a warranty but there’s also disclaimers. They do not guarantee labor, fluids, or incidentals IF that JDM engine turns out to be problematic or does not fit correctly and also state that certain, and pricy, procedures be done before that engine is installed.
After all of that and if the engine turns out to have a problem then the cost is all on you.
Diagnosing a blown head gasket is a procedure; not a wild guess except in the most extreme of circumstances and one would hope that your lack of mechanical knowledge does not lead to blind faith based on appearances of what has been done as to tests and repairs.
I found out the engine doesn’t have a warranty so for now, I’m going with getting the head gasket fixed. Parts have been ordered. Less hope this solves some things. Mechanic doesn’t yet know if cat will need to be replaced to get the light off. May have to buy that too. We can only hope that things get better with this vehicle. When my 2000 Honda CR-V only had 133,000 on it, there was nothing wrong. Makes me wonder if previous owners took care of this vehicle.
Update everyone - the parts that were ordered for the head gasket job finally arrived a week ago yesterday. If I had gone through the normal Meineke channels, I would have had the parts in no time, but they would have been more expensive. The job is taking long than I expected though and I’m becoming frustrated. When I dropped the parts off, I thought they’d start on it right away but the car sat there 3 days before anything was even done! I know there are other cars and customers but I would have thought something would have been started sooner. When I went down there last Saturday, he was just then tearing the motor down and said to give it another week because the machine shop might take time. I called today - got a recording of the owner’s voice and left a message. Call was not returned - same as last week. Went down there late this afternoon to check. The owner was on the phone but motioned me to the mechanic. He just got the heads back from the machine shop today. The one bad head was pretty warped he said and the shop was backed up, so that made sense. He’s going through the engine and cleaning some things and says the spark plugs look bad, so he’ll change those. When I inquired about having my car back this weekend (it will be 3 weeks this Saturday since it overheated), I was told that it will be into next week. After he gets it to where it’s drivable, he wants to make sure that everything really is ok and wants to drive it for awhile. That is understandable but I also feel like every time I go down there, he keeps delaying stuff. It is getting really hard for my son and I to share the other car, but I know it’s better than a rental. I’m put out with the lack of returned phone calls and having to go down there. I’m wondering if some of the slowness is due to the fact that the parts weren’t ordered from normal Meineke suppliers and they just make him do these jobs in between other “Meineke jobs.” I am getting put out though and while I applaud the mechanic’s thoroughness, I told him that this better not add to my bill! He said it wouldn’t. I it’s not ready by Tuesday, do I have a right to get really, really, really mad? Has anyone else had an experience of a head gasket job taking this long?
I don’t know if I can answer your questions or not but Meineke is a chain operation devoted to lube services, brakes, struts, and so on. Engine and transmission overhaul would normally not be part of their daily routine.
Engine work is labor intensive and it could be (theorizing here) that your car is a work-around while churning out more lucrative brake or shock work, etc.
As to auto machine shops, yes it is quite possible for cylinder head work to get backed up there as most auto machine shops run a backlog that can vary from a few days to weeks.
The part that I would find distasteful is not keeping you informed all the way about what is going on or acting evasive. As to teardown and reassembly one could allot a single day for each and machine shop time in between. Once up and running a half hour test drive should be more than sufficient.
As to the getting mad part, I’d say just firmly polite at this point.
Just curious, but you refer to “heads” in the plural and “The one…” head. Your car should only have one cylinder head.
It sounds like the shop wants to do a good job for you. That’s the most important thing. Hopefully your shop explained when you signed the work order that this is a big time consuming job with a lot of unknowns and it isn’t possible for your shop to know exactly what needs to be done, what new parts are needed, what machine shop services are required, before they take it apart and do the required measurements. It’s not a job that can be assigned to a precise schedule. A needed part can sometimes be available the same day as ordered, or the parts store or Honda may be out of stock and it takes a week to get it in. Varies week to week. No way to predict, and I’m sure you understand your shop has no control of the parts store stocking scheduling. Likewise with the machine shop. It might be available the next day, or it might take 2 weeks before they have an opening. And then there’s the schedule of your own shop. They can’t predict how much work will be brought in each day. And what the priority of that work is. If a loyal years-long customer is on his way on vacation out of town on a family holiday with the whole car packed and ready to go, the kids in the back seat, and discovers at the last minute the windshield wipers don’t work, I hope you’d understand that is a high priority job for your shop, and your work will have to wait a couple hours so they can fix that first and get the family on their way to their vacation destination. So while it is perfectly understandable you are frustrated, your being frustrated probably won’t help the job getting done any sooner.
One approach you might take is to say to the shop owner : "I appreciate that your goal is to do a thorough ,well done job. I want you to take as much time as you need to do the job right. But could you give me a worse case estimate on when this will be done, even if you end up finishing a couple weeks ahead of the worse case date? I can then make advance arrangements for alternative transport through the worse case date, and if you finish up sooner, even better. "
ok4450 as for “heads” understand I’m not a mechanic - I guess it is just a “head.” Yes, I realize this is a time consuming job with unknowns - I just don’t like the way the owner has avoided my phone calls and I’m always having to go down there. Looks like they could simply pick up the phone and let me know what’s going on. I’m not sure the mechanic even knows I’ve called. The only reason I’m using Meineke over an independent shop I normally go to is that they are the only people in my town who are open on Saturdays - my breakdowns always seem to occur on Saturdays. Also, this particular mechanic is the only one who has seemed interested in my P0420 code being something more than a catalytic convertor. He says I may still need one but I may not - we will know more after this job is completed. This whole thing is overwhelming to me - I’m a single parent and not in a position for constant, expensive car problems and I have to wonder if the previous owners ripped me off - the mechanic says it doesn’t look like they changed the timing belt as they had told me. they did. My My Honda CR-V has been great but at it’s advanced age of 205,000 it too has problems that need tending to as well. If my son wasn’t working some, we simply wouldn’t be able to have another vehicle but I need those vehicles to work!
hmm … I can see how you are frustrated by this wncgirl. I expect you’ll be back on the road soon. Replacing a cylinder head isn’t rocket science. Nothing new needs to be invented. Gasolilne engine technology is basically the same as it was in 1910. So there’s low risk this repair will fail to fix the problems. But if the current repair turns out not to fix the problem, or worse, even more problems develop, you’d probably serve your own interests better by selling this car, or donating it to your local high school auto shop class, and purchasing a reliably-rated used car with fewer miles on it.
Hi all, just wanted to give an update and it’s not good - it is one thing after the other! The Meineke mechanic was in the process of putting everything back together on Monday but ran into some sort of problem with the timing belt cover - I couldn’t exactly make out the situation on the phone as I was coming back from an out of town business trip. Anyway, they ordered a replacement cover from Honda at pretty low cost and put it on Tuesday. By Tuesday at lunch, he called to say he had the car up and running and was going to drive it for awhile. A few hours later, he called back to say the car ran really well out on the highway although the check engine light was still on - that could possibly be the contaminated cat from all the coolant. Anyway, he got back into town and traffic lights, etc. and things went downhill. The car started losing some power and the radiator fan didn’t appear to be at the right temp. He has wondered all along if the previous owners poured something down into the radiator to try to stop the head gasket problem. He suggested a new radiator and I reluctantly agreed - another $340 with labor included! The radiator finally arrived early yesterday afternoon and by 5 yesterday they had it installed. They wanted to drive it this morning to make sure. I just got a call from the Meineke owner saying the mechanic has come down with the stomach virus today and can’t work - understandable. He or someone else has taken the car out and now it is missing! What in the heck is going on? The owner said he saw the radiator hoses and it does indeed look like the previous owners had put something in it. I asked the owner and he doesn’t seem to know but promises me they will fix it! If I still didn’t owe $2,500 on the vehicle plus this repair - which is right now at $980 (excluding the $268 I spent ordering parts) - I would just sell it for what little I could get out of it. As a single parent, I just don’t have money like this to keep throwing around. It probably won’t change anything, but I am going to write a letter to the people who sold it to me asking for reimbursement of part of the car costs. It sounds like the Meineke people are trying but I wonder if they are doing something to make things worse?