it is red with 68,000 miles ,new plugs, wires,cap and button… it appears to use a lot of amps to start …it begins starting @ 250 rpm and after 5 sceonds slows to around 15 or 20 rpm battery voltage goes from 12.5 to about 10.5 after 15 sconds of cranking thank you
Sounds like the battery has lost some capacity or it isn’t charged or charging correctly. If it’s an old battery, start by changing it out. Then have the charging system checked.
brand new battery
Is this a fuel injected car? If not it could be a carburetor issue.
New batteries can have cell problems. Did you have it installed or do it yourself? If you had someone else do it, take the car back and have them check the battery. If you did it, take the battery to the store and have them check it. That at least will confirm or eliminate the battery as the problem. I imagine the terminals at the battery are clean. What about the terminals at the starter?
It’s fuel injected, maybe the infamous CIS. I bet that may be the problem.
Ten and a half volts after 15 seconds of cranking shows the battery is holding up.
There’s not enough info known here to make much of a guess as to why it won’t start but the CIS injection is always the suspect. (Slang for CIS is “Constantly In SXXX”.)
It would help to know what’s missing; spark or fuel.
Fuel pressure test is Step One and that requires a special pressure tester; either store bought ($) or homemade. The most common CIS problems are:
Fuel pump.
Stuck plunger in fuel distributor.
Stuck pressure relief valve in fuel dist.
Control pressure regulator.
Large air leak. (CIS is VERY touchy about any air leaks.)
thanx ya’ll …CIS I will look into …here is more intel…I say it cranks normal for 5 seconds or so …then as the motors comes to the " I’m running " stage, the revs slow to a point of almost not turning at all …once lit it runs very well …I will say it this way as well …on a 70 degree day it behaves as though it is extremily cold out side a feww nice revolutions then a couple very slow revs and no more or it starts …
I bought it last year and after a couple hundred mile the first starter broke it’s snout …next one got weaker and weaker then devoloped a dead short and I was unable to turn it with a screw driver … the third one is on my work bench as they aint cheap and I fear for it’s life
also I will add the motor runs very well …CIS problems seam to be related to running poorly ,and not related to starting
There can be starting issues with CIS, does yours have a separate injector for starting? The enrichening function may be causing problems.
Offhand it sounds like a CIS problem, go figure.
If it starts instantly and then stumbles and dies then the cold start injector is operative.
If it requires seconds of cranking to start (say 5 or more) then the thermo time switch for the cold start valve could be faulty.
Once running and if it continues to run ragged then one has to suspect another CIS fault. Step One in a shop would be to connect the fuel pressure gauge and run the CIS pressure tests. This means a specialized tester, the diagnostic chart, and the vehicle would have to sit overnight before the tests can be run. This means without any cranking of the engine at all in regards to the sitting.
The control pressure regulator (in slang, the warm-up regulator) could have gone stupid and that’s not a rare thing with CIS at all.
64 k miles, runs fine when running ,yet, a new starter makes the thang start very well ,after 25 or 30 starts ,the starter begins to not be very powerfull …till the starter will not start the engine ,as the starter gets sluggish ,it takes more and more “juice” from the battery to start,
ideas …injectors leaking/dripping causing hydro-lock
…teeth on starter not meshing / binding
…heat from the exhaust (witch very runs near the starter) melting the solder in starter
…to much advance in timing
I can get the CIS rebuilt no problem but , I dont “feel” the proper problem has "popped up "
thank you SamPart of the problem may be due to excessive force from the starter is needed to turn the engine. I suggest you have the starter motor current checked to see how much current is needed to turn the engine. It also sounds like there is another issue that is keeping the engine from starting right away, as others have suggested.
You need to check the starter current draw, not the voltage drop, and see what happens. The draw will vary a bit based on a number of factors but when the starter motor is first engaged it may have a surge of 300 amps. Under steady cranking after the initial surge it should settle down into the 125 amps range, give or take.
Has this car actually ever started? If it has, does it run very ragged and belch smoke?
Have you removed any spark plugs to see if they’re gasoline soaked?
I’m wondering if the engine could be trying to hydrolock from excessive gasoline.
That’s not unheard of on the CIS VWs and CIS is CIS no matter what type of car it’s attached to.
thanx people I runs fine , fairly smooth idle , off idle smooth as silk all the way to 7 grand 100 miles per hour comes quickily .