I read that a law enforcement officer’s throttle became stuck apparently in full throttle.
A passenger had time to call 9-1-1 and report the problem before they crashed.
(one minute on cell phone)
Could brakes not overpower engine?
I thought that an engineering requirement.
Could transmission not be placed in NEUTRAL?
Could ignition not be turned off?
Any news on cause and why crash happened?
Thank you.
Of course they could have put the car in neutral. The engine would have revved up, but it could not overrev because of electronic controls, and even if it did and threw a rod, that’s minor compared to the whole family getting killed. The story is that floor mats somehow jammed the gas pedal. Well, maybe, but slipping the car into neutral would have made this a non-event.
No one ever gets any training in what to do in emergencies in a car. I’ll bet there are literally thousands of lives lost and tens of thousands of injuries every year because drivers have no clue how to handle operating emergencies.
yes all of those could have stopped the car.
its sad: there were, I believe, 4 people in the car, and not one of them had any of those ideas.
Panic does terrible things. That why airline pilots train all the time for ‘what ifs’. That’s why everybody survived the landing on the Hudson.
“Why” this happened is because the floor mat shifted forward and kept the gas pedal floored. There is now a huge Toyota recall for this floor mat issue.
Why no one thought to shift to neutral or turn the ignition off is something I can’t explain.
Panic, I suppose.
The ignition was push button, and this was a loaner car. It’s possible that none of the people in the car knew to hold the button down for three seconds to turn the engine off. None-the-less, it is amazing that none of them, nor the 911 operator, thought to shift it to neutral.
I just cannot understand how a firm foot on the brake wouldn’t substantially slow the car down.
When Audi went through this in the 80s, their engineers swore up and down that the brakes could stop the car, even if the engine was running at wide open throttle.
I have to wonder, however, with my own cars, would the brakes be strong enough to stop the car if the throttle stuck open?
I have no idea, but I wouldn’t wait to find out.
If you experience a runaway car, shift to neutral, steer to the side of the road, brake to a safe stop, and then shut off the engine.
I’ve tried flooring both the loud and stop pedals in 1st gear with the engine at peak torque.(there was a higher purpose of doing that than just killing time) The car did slow down. If the brakes can handle 1st gear torque, they should handle it in any gear.
But it took a lot of force on the pedal, probably more than most people are comfortable with using on their cars. Most people don’t bother to explore the limits of their cars and don’t know what cars are capable of. How many people do you see flying around freeway on ramps at 40 when the 25 sign is posted?
And when you’re stepping moderately on the brakes with the engine roaring, it’s a matter of time for the brakes to fade and loose the fight to the engine.
We can all sit here and say shift to neutral, but it takes calm nerves to do that in emergencies. We are not talking about the drive thru line at Burger King.
I thought someone said in a previous thread on this topic that the brakes lost their boost (sorry, not familiar with cars) after a few pumps when the engine was on full throttle. Guess the designers never thought someone would want the brakes at full throttle.
Re neutral, one problem may be that neutral just about never gets used in an automatic shift car. After hearing about this, I had to look to see where neutral was in my car. In an emergency, people fall back on what they’re used to, i.e. in this case, hitting the brakes.
Add to this having a quirky way to shut the car down (just give me a turn key, please) and you have a bunch of little things that add up to a disaster. But then, that’s how disasters occur: a bunch of little things go wrong all at once.
in a crown vic/town car/grand marquis, at WOT, the brakes hold it firmly in place standing still. this was not going 100 MPH, BUT, this shows that it is effectivley, a clutch.
go out, sit in your car, face down the road. put it in drive. push the brakes in, and make the engine rev. you dont have to go to 6000 RPM, what ever you feel comfortable with.
you’d be astonished at the speed you dont travel at.
“I had to look to see where neutral was in my car”
Well, at least I will give you credit for honesty.
If I was that unfamiliar with a car that I drive every day, I would be ashamed to admit it!
This is not the same test as getting to 100+ MPH, pressing the gas pedal all the way down (first), and then pressing the brake pedal. I’m guessing that the guy in the runaway car first pressed the brakes lightly a few times and then realized he was in trouble. Then when he tried to press the brakes hard, there was no power assist available since he had used up the stored vacuum, and the WOT engine was not making any more vacuum. Now with manual brakes, he would have to apply hundreds of pounds of force to the pedal, and do it quickly. I think it is reasonable to assume that under these circumstances the brakes might overheat and fade out long before he could stop it. Also, it is unfair to compare a 200 HP car (Grand Marquis) to a 300 HP car (Lexus).
Chunky, Speaking Of Burger King, I’ll Buy If You Fly.
CSA
How Come My Sea-Doo, Boats, Lawn Mower, Leaf Blower, And Other RV Type Vehicles Have Kill Buttons, But Not One Or Two Ton, 200+ HP Cars?
Maybe it’s time for cars to have something as basic as a Kill Button. Even the late Soupy Sales had a “Do Not Touch” button.
CSA
Let’s see now, the throttle is stuck and the car is racing away and if I shift to neutral it will wreck the engine; what else can I do, oops, CRUNCH!
Yes, but if you shift to neutral, you won’t wreck the engine. The rev limiter will look out for it.
They could have shifted into neutral, turned the switch off, or even slammed the gear lever into reverse; the latter of which will bring the car to a screeching halt with likely no damage other than a few tires with flat spots.
With the brakes firmly planted the engine cannot override the torque converter stall speed so if the brakes were slammed to the floor the car should have stopped.
Unfortunately, the vast majority of people suffer brain freezes in panic situations.
At a motorcycle rally in Sturgis S.D. some years ago I saw a guy kickstarting his Harley and he knocked a gas line loose while doing this. The gas poured over the circuit breaker and up in flames in went.
There were about 50 people standing around and not one, including the guy who owned the bike, made a move. They were all just gawking at the blaze.
I jumped off my bike, ran over, and started bare hand shoveling dirt from the alley until it was put out.
The bike owner profusely thanked me although his bike was damaged a bit but the fact remains that even he did not make one move while I was trying to save his method of getting back home to Idaho.
It was a bit stunning to think that of this huge number of people not one had the presence of mind to jump in and actually do something.
So just put these people behind the wheel of a car that is revving out of control and there you have it.
Here are CR’s ideas on how to deal with the situation:
http://video.consumerreports.org/services/player/bcpid1886192484?bctid=48234862001
Good drivers also train themselves all the time for “what ifs”.
Things can and do go wrong with a car, and most of them do not break new ground. They only become emergencies because the driver has no idea what to do when something happens that has happened a zillion times before.
Anyone who does not know how to put his/her car in neutral is not on the short list of good drivers, nor probably fair drivers as well. This is like Driver 101. Sorry if this offends, but this is my honest opinion. Turning the wheel in the direction of a skid might be advanced techniques, but not putting a car in neutral. That should have been mastered before a learning driver was allowed to turn a wheel.