The Underappreciated Drum Brake

You understood wrong.

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Here is some people on a corvette forum saying the same thing as I am. If you read and educate yourself to the facts you will see what really happened to the Fiero!

The facts don’t agree. Here are the 0-60 and quarter mile speeds for Corvettes and Fieros during that period. The V6 Fieros were 8 seconds 0-60, the Corvettes 6 seconds. The Fiero was faster than an older Corvette, but not by the time the V6 came out:

p.s. - did you happen to notice that pretty much EVERYONE on that Corvette forum disagreed with the original post, and that the original post had NO information to back it up?

p.s.2 - the V6 in the Fiero was the highest-output version of the 2.8L, port injected with 140 hp. It was not ā€˜detuned’.

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I’d never heard that

Then again, you like to rewrite history :wink:

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I can understand why, but I’l let the rest of you figure it out. I’m tired of people refuting my every statement on here.

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Here’s why the Fiero got axed, declining sales as performance improved:

1984 136,850 sold

1985 76,371

1986 83,974

1987 46,581

1988 26,402

The ā€˜89 prototypes tried lots of different engines, but in the end ā€œGM cited slumping and unprofitable sales of the Fiero as the reason for its demise following its 5th model year.ā€

GM made money selling cars by the hundreds of thousands, not the thousands.

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I experience the same. I present matters of fact, such as ā€œDrum Brakes are more efficient than Discā€ snd get clobbered for it. These are not merely opinions, these are well regarded facts based on science and engineering.

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Fiero Facts! This id not something I cooked up in my head, this was known over 30 years ago. Fiero Facts. GM killed the Fiero to protect the Corvette. The Fiero was simply getting too good.

Two facets that are apparently not popular on here.

You know what you and I are pretty brave and patient to continue posting our knowledge here. I’m in contact with at least one other CarTalk regular who has since resigned to just monitoring and reading the goings on. They got fed up and tired of the Tribe on here, and instead of risking suspensions or bans due to losing temper, they just stopped actively participating completely.

I will say that there are many on here I respect and enjoy debating with and alot of people on here I truly like. Its like that old song :musical_note: ā€œThere is no good guy, there is no bad guy, its only me and we just disagreeā€

When you present a matter of fact on here alot if times people will pick it apart. I’d love to talk politics on here, we could really disectalot of things.

I think alot of people in life just like to argue, I have the same thing with my wife. If I say the sky is blue she will argue the point with me.

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That last point is probably why an old co-DJ of mine on the college radio club decades ago now lives on his boat in a yacht club, and holds down two decent jobs: selling radios and other electronics for boats, and being the go-to DJ for the club!

He has plenty of friends, colleagues, but his life is drama free. ā€œYacht rockā€ anyone? :clinking_beer_mugs:!

Except the Corvette

It really doesn’t matter if the performance of a drum brake can be better than a disc brake. It comes down to economics. Drum brakes have more parts (purchasing, inventory & handling costs) and require more labor to assemble. Disc brakes are unitized and can be outsourced. Drum brakes must be assembled in-situ on the car axle assembly. That makes drum brakes more costly to manufacture. End of story from a manufacturer’s standpoint…

There’s an old saying that comes to mind- perfection is the enemy of good enough.

You don’t need better when good enough will do. Aside from the argument of which can perform better, disc brakes cost less and are good enough to meet the demands of the application…

My own experience is that when disc brakes came out, they outperformed the drum brakes at the time. I even switched out the front drums on my cars to disc brakes to get the braking advantage. Could drums compete with them if designs or materials improved? Probably. But their inherent increased costs made them unable to compete and they quickly got replaced.

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For TEN dollars I will give you the solution to that problem.

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Even Carolyn called him out for his behavior.

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Called out - for being factual?

What kind of forums are these??

Welllll… lol

That reminds me when I was an engine specialist at U-Haul back in 2001(short lived, only company I every saw that screwed themselves on purpose and they flat out lied about health ins, I left over the ins) and I saw that one of the big trucks I was working on needed rear brakes, so I went to the parts department and they gave me backing plates loaded with everything, I said I only needed shoes and springs, they said this is the way we do it, so I took it and moved all the parts including the wheel cylinders over to the old backing plates, they thought I was being a smart A… lol… I just wasn’t in the mood to smell gear oil at the time, all though I was the only one that did rear ends also, funny thing is I did everything except transmissions there…

BTW, this I enjoyed doing when I built my rear end…

No, that was never the case. The Fiero wasn’t in the same ballpark as the Corvette. The Fiero’s competition were cars like the Non-Turbo RX-7, Nissan 200SX and Pulsar, and the Toyota MR2 , It didn’t have the power or handling chops (particularly in the pre-88 models) to compete with the Corvette.

With that said GM didn’t do the Fiero any favors. GM had an ideal engine for the car, the 2.3L Quad 4 just sitting there and they didn’t use it. The Turbo 3.1 (used in the McLaren Grand Prix would’ve been an option and that would’ve gave it performance comparable at least to the 5.0L TPI F-Bodies. But none of that happened. Still some enthusiast have crammed the venerable 3.8L in Fieros (both supercharged and N/A) and I’ve seen one with a Northstar swap before as well. But as they came from the factory, they were never particularly fast cars.

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That’s a BIG offense. I would have filed a complaint with the Attorney General. That company can be seriously fined (well over $100,000 per incident). As a hiring manager HR and legal would stress on us the seriousness of lying about benefits to a potential hire. Luckily our benefits were pretty good, so we didn’t have to lie.

Or, with your state’s Insurance Commissioner.
I did that several years ago, and my LTC insurance company suddenly came up with much more customer-friendly billing practices, about 1 month after I filed the complaint.

I don’t think that it was a coincidence.