IMHO it causes more accidents than it prevents by lengthening stopping distances.
But, we’ve debate this before and it ends up simply being a matter of preference. It trades off stopping distance to maintain steering control, and where I live there’s rarely an alternative place to steer to.
I’m not against ABS for those that like it. I’m against not being able to turn it off for those of us that don’t.
My understanding of ABS is that it does NOT increase stopping distance, but in fact decreases it. Am I wrong?
Sorry to take this in a different direction, but to the OP: did you leave skid marks? Were they long? I’m wondering about the tires.
@Waterbuff I was running late to work, I was on a busy highway, plus it was dark. I didnt have the time, lighting, or clarity to check.
If your car does not haxe ABS everything is fine and you have nothing to worry about.
@BillRussell , I typed in “do ABS brakes increase stopping distance?” in my search engine and read a document from the NHTSA, http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/problems/equipment/absbrakes.html
I, too, understood that ABS decreased stopping distance. I found out I was incorrect. In many situations, it does not, just as mountainbike indicated. The document isn’t definitive about which situations ABS shortens stopping distances - lots of lawyer-mandated weasel words (can, should, may, and the like). It is definitive on that its primary purpose is to allow the driver to maintain control.
A good ABS system reduces stopping distance in every instance except deep snow when the tires lock and plow snow slowing the car. These days, even professional race car drivers use ABS if the rules allow and engage it for nearly every braking zone. 20 years ago, a very good driver could beat ABS’ stopping distances but no longer is that true.
And don’t rely on NHSTA to be the last word on the technical merits of ABS, they are kind of stupid. They were unaware of a feature built into most every ABS system for over 5 years before it was demonstrated to them!
ABS does not reduce stopping distance. It helps you maintain control, but at the expense of stopping distance. Here’s a link to a whole bunch of articles on it. Enjoy.
http://www.bing.com/search?q=does+sABS+reduce+stopping+distance&form=PRHPCS&pc=U146&mkt=en-us&refig=cc2ca7eb05ab47168f5a2b4b091fbb2f&pq=does+sabs+reduce+stopping+distance&sc=0-14&sp=-1&qs=n&sk=&cvid=cc2ca7eb05ab47168f5a2b4b091fbb2f
As long as the brakes seem to be working well, like they were before, then, me, I wouldn’t worry about the brakes. But I’d probably take a quick look see at the tires. Hard braking can sometimes reveal existing weakness in well-worn tires.
@Mustangman , what about dirt/gravel? I thought there were benefits in locking up, and digging big, deep furrows to slow the car down. I thought you’d do better than keeping up on top of all that loose surface.
The only time my abs has kicked in is coming to a stop on snowy roads. Sure I used to pump the brakes, now just hold the pedal to the metal and let it do its thing. Preventive caution over rules abs every day of the week. I do test stops just to see how the road is while I am on it, and calibrate speed and stopping distance without abs based on real world observance.
“Should I get them inspected or am I overreacting?”
Any modern car should be able to make one hard stop from top speed (100+ mph) on level ground without damaging the braking system.
Anything less is an inadequate design, IMHO.
@meanjoe75fan Forgot gravel, non-ABS brakes can beat ABS on gravel. It works the same way, it piles up the gravel in front of the tire. In both snow and gravel, to do this requires locking all 4 wheels and skidding to a stop, not pumping the brake pedal.
@the same mountainbike With all due respect to you and your Bing links, ABS does, indeed, reduce stopping distance as tested by NHTSA. I’ve included links to papers that analyzed actual test data.
In cars, note the link to the full paper:
http://trid.trb.org/view.aspx?id=502377
And motorcycles;
I’ve analyzed data and been involved in taking test data, as the test driver, that proves what these papers say.
ABS allows all the tires (2 or 4) to stay at the optimum traction point in the tire’s operating range; And that point is not a locked-tire skid. The greatest traction comes when the tire is still rolling. The curves below show this. You cannot achieve this with a non-ABS brake system.
Thanks for the link Mustang, that is a good one.
You’ll note one comment in the report:
“The one systematic exception was on loose gravel where stopping distances increased by an average of 27.2% overall.”
The conclusion reached in the study was:
Numerous crash data statistical analyses conducted over the past few years suggest that, for automobiles, the introduction of four-wheel antilock brake systems (ABS) has produced net safety benefits much lower than originally expected. The studies indicate the apparent increase in single-vehicle crashes involving passenger cars equipped with four-wheel ABS almost completely offsets the safety advantage such vehicles have over their conventionally-braked counterparts.
But they do not explain why there’s an increase in single-vehicle crashes involving passenger cars equipped with four-wheel ABS, which was the reason they did the study. In short, the study concluded that ABS was not reducing accidents; indeed, ABS cars were having a higher incidence of accidents.
Other testing has shown a substantial increase in stopping distances on icy surfaces as well.
Overall, on good frictional surfaces ABS has no negative effect, but on poor frictional surfaces it increases stopping distances, on very poor frictional surfaces the increase is dramatic. I personally have experienced this.
As I mentioned earlier, I have nothing against ABS. But I do believe it should be optional or come with an OFF switch. I’m not sold on ABS. I was originally middle-of-the-road on the subject… until I drove ABS on icy roads. Unfortunately, we get a lot of them up here in NH.
Bing is only a search engine. The use of Bing does not in any way detract from the accuracy of any study. The two have nothing to do with one another.
On the subject of ABS or the lack of my personal biased opinion is that a study would be useless. The percentage of poor drivers is higher now than it has ever been. You can read about single vehicle accidents in places where going in a straight line should be simple but they still run off the road.
For me, having steering control to the end is more important than a few feet of stopping distance. If nothing else, if I end up in a situation where a crash is inevitable, I want to be able to hit the obstacle square with my front end instead of skidding out of control and hitting it sideways, as the first way is a lot safer.
But they do not explain why there's an increase in single-vehicle crashes involving passenger cars equipped with four-wheel ABS, which was the reason they did the study. In short, the study concluded that ABS was not reducing accidents; indeed, ABS cars were having a higher incidence of accidents.
That would be the "Peltzman effect." ABS is percieved as safer; folks take more risks; more risks leads to more accidents. A very well-known phenomenon.
Correlation is not causation!
Read the NTHSA paper testing the 9 vehicles. Interesting read. My observations from the paper:
I think the brakes did what they were supposed to or able to do… Like VDC mentioned about ABS…if it has ABS then it did not function. If it does NOT which is a very likely possibility…then the brakes saved your butt so to speak… If you do not notice any braking performance issues, smells or otherwise anything wrong with the brakes when you drive right now? Then there is nothing to worry about.
Might be a good time to check on brake pad wear level at this time since your attention is directed Brakewards… Other than that…if there are no noises, smells, smoke or anything else brake related then just keep on keepin on. The brakes did their job as best they could.
Blackbird
I have no doubt whatsoever that the tests were totally unbiased. They were, however, conducted to determine why ABS appeared to be causing an increase in single vehicle accidents, and the tests did identify a seriously increased stopping distance on gravel. Icy surfaces were not included, but based on my own experience I believe that if they had been they would have shown similar results. The only real conclusion in the study is the one that triggered the study, that ABS appeared to be causing increased single vehicle accident rates.
The “Peltzmen effect” is a very valid possibility, although wherein ABS isn’t felt under normal driving I don’t know that it would change driving behaviors.
In my driving environment the most difficult stopping condition encountered often is icy roads. For my use, I’d prefer to be able to shut ABS off. For those that like ABS, I have nothing against it.
