jtsanders: Yup, official Honda CPO bought directly from a Honda dealership.
All righty, then. If the dealership can’t come up with the papers, get Honda America to bust on them. You might even be able to get them to take it back. You might need a lawyer to accomplish that, though, and don’t assume it is guaranteed.
jtsanders: Yea- that’s why I chatted with Honda directly rather than calling the dealership. I was annoyed. I expect, as others have said above, they will come up with some papers, real or not. Truthfully, though, I actually don’t want them to take it back- Its only been a week, and we love the car (2014 Odyssey). I expect it was just an old battery, but I think we’ll have the mechanic check it out when they change the battery.
Volvo_V70 is right - CPO cars’ main value is the detailed warranty. Having discussed this here, and having seen comments under many stories on the subject from mechanics, I do believe that the inspection is skipped in some cases. Location matters with batteries, but here in the Northeast, I have never had to replace a battery sooner than 6 years. Here is the Honda CPO checklist in PDF form. I think not having the signed checklist on a Honda CPO car is about 9 on a 10-scale of shady. It has real value, at least it would to me.Why wouldn’t the dealership re-do the inspection if that proof was no longer with the vehicle? So in summary, CPO cars have value and your particular experience sounds very shady to this prior owner of a CPO Lexus.
I see something on that list that cannot be faked- the rotor/pad thickness information. If they did not do the inspection, this will be hard to fill in correctly after the fact and could easily be used against them if they deviate enough from reality…the rest of the stuff is just check boxes.
I wonder what Honda and/or dealer flat rate time is for mechanics to perform a CPO inspection???
That CPO checklist is quite lengthy and detailed. If they’re paying peanuts then pencil-whipping it and running it out the door is a distinct possibility. After all, the bottom line for the mechanic is how many (if any) flat rate hours he’s going to be paid.
I know that if I was asked to perform a CPO inspection that lengthy and which included pulling wheels and measuring components, there is no way on God’s Green Earth I’m going to do that inspection if they tell me up front I’m getting an hour for it. Talk about 2.5 or 3 and then we got a deal. For an hour they can get someone else.
Same goes for OK’s defunct vehicle safety inspection program. According to the powers that be a proper inspection required the car on a lift, pull the wheels, etc, etc, and a bit over 1 hour of inspection time.
For this the mechanic got paid 2 bucks.
Does anyone think that me (or any other certified safety inspector) was EVER going to do a proper inspection by spending a shade over an hour for 2 measly dollars?
Not in a million years. We all pencil whipped them and out the door they went. We didn’t even worry one bit about the possibility of a huge fine and jail time. The paycheck was Numero Uno and no mechanic was going to allow his paycheck to suffer any more than possible because of a 2 buck inspection.
It’s been awhile since I performed any CPO inspections, but here’s what I remember
We got paid less than 2 hours, might have been around 1.5hrs
There was some real pressure to make sure every vehicle that theoretically qualified a cpo vehicle. Obviously vehicles that are too old, were wrecked, or something else really obvious had no chance
On top of that, they supposedly only had a few dollars per vehicle to spend. So it was a problem if a vehicle needed a set of 4 tires, a windshield, or something similarly expensive.
I remember a few times when I presented my findings, and I was reamed . . . it’s not as if I was the one that wore out the tires, cracked the windshield, etc. They told me I wasn’t playing ball, because they were counting on getting every qualified vehicle certified.
For what it’s worth, the mechanic wasn’t always in a position to say “no” to a job. And if he did, there were sometimes repercussions for him
What is a CPO ?
Certified Pre Owned
Thanks for the mucho quick response.
The term is kinda funny.
Why would a used car need to be certified as used.
Apparently you did not read the header of this thread.
Yes, the funnies of the English language (as interpreted by marketing people). Perhaps Certified & Used would be better, but for some unknown reason used is a bad word today.
If you were supposed to receive a checklist and didn’t then perhaps Honda Corporate could bring a little heat to the dealer.
I’m not going to accuse this dealer of not doing a proper inspection (I just don’t know the details), but when dealers fail to follow proper CPO procedures it can cost the manufacturer more money because they are providing a very valuable, and depending on the particular manufacturer, in some cases a very comprehensive warranty (same as new car), through the dealer and based on their inspection and qualification of select vehicles.
An article from a few years ago tells of Honda and GM both cracking down on some sub-standard dealers.
As most people know, not all dealers are created equal. Some provide much better service than others.
I live near a small town that has 3 new car dealers. The market is very competitive. They rely on a fairly fixed market and repeat customers are a must. If any of these dealers provides less than very good service then they won’t be in business too long.
One of the advantages of small town living. The dealership owner’s also go to the same churches, belong to the same clubs, and their children go to the same schools as everyone else in the community. There’s no running away from bad behavior. I imagine you can leave the keys in your car and leave your home doors unlocked too.
That would be the wrong thing to do no matter where you live.
Unlocked homes and vehicles were very common when I was growing up. I don’t recall anyone leaving keys in them.
It is still very common around here also.
A keynote speaker at a recent conference said that he is from Montana, and everyone leaves the keys in their cars an no one locks the doors at night. There isn’t any crime because everyone would know who committed it almost as soon a the deed was done. Not being able to get away with anything is a powerful incentive.
When my mother died, she had a house in rural Virginia. I went down there every month to check on it. While there on one visit, a neighbor came over and informed me that a man in the neighborhood took some things from the house. He was found out and his wife made him return the stuff.
I stand by my statement that leaving the keys in a vehicle no matter where you live is Dumb.
As for no crime in Montana, the state web site would seem to contradict that.
A three year old vehicle is going to have some maintenance needed here and there, that’s just the way it is with something with thousands of moving parts, and the parts that don’t move being bounced around all the time you are driving. You’ve purchased a reliable, solid vehicle made by Honda, one of the best manufacturers, and it is still fairly new. So you should be fine. You’ve done about all you could do to increase your odds. Now about this checklist, say a tech spends two hours checking all 182 items, that’s about 40 seconds per item, right? The only way to check a battery in 40 seconds is to start the engine. If it cranks & starts , the battery checks out as ok, maybe a visual inspection of the battery connections as a follow up. If you just want to mess with the dealership and cause them grief, that’s up to you. But if you want a reliable car for the long term, suggest you spend your time shopping around for the best inde mechanic in your area who specializes in Hondas or at least Asian cars, and take your Honda to that shop, pay them for a general inspection as a way to introduce yourself and your car and get a file started. Forget about the checklist, and find a good shop to use for your future needs, that’s my advice.