According to this web-site…E85 is NOT sold in New Hampshire. And there’s only one location in MA.
http://www.e85locator.net/State%20Pages/NewHampshireE85stationlocations.html
But there are hundreds if not thousands of Flex Fuel vehicles sold here. Mainly pickups and SUV’s.
Just to be clear, a good portion of corn grown is for animal feed, not human consumption. I suppose indirectly it is therefore food eventually but not like most of it goes into corn flakes or corn on the cob.
Let’s not forget about the corn that becomes corn chips and high fructose corn syrup. Most of the corn that is grown in central Illinois where my mother grew up is not for human consumption.
Those who doubt that ethanol production increased the cost of their edible corn may want to read the attached study. There are lots of others if anyone still has doubts. .
http://www.card.iastate.edu/policy_briefs/display.aspx?id=1155
@TSM:
"This relatively small change in corn prices necessarily implies that the contribution of ethanol subsidies to food inflation is largely imperceptible in the United States."
Did you actually read that link?
It said that, from 2005-09, mandates and subsidies increased feed prices by all of 4%! I didn’t see what the corresponding increase in a pound of hamburger is–it would depend on the % of total costs animal feed represents–but around 1% seems plausible.
I’m by no means an ethanol fanboy, but your link does not, in any way, support the idea that “people are starving because of EtOH.”
The next sentence is
"However, this does not mean that the contribution of ethanol to food inflation is imperceptible."
It then goes on to explain.
You cannot take a single sentence out of context from the middle of a study like this and call it conclusive. You have to read the entire study.
By the way, I never said “people are starving because of EtOH.”. I resent having words put in my mouth that I never said. Don’t pretend to quote me if you’re going to do so dishonestly.
The next sentence went on describe a world in which a magic wand was waved and ZERO EtOH production occurred, market forces or no…at which point I stopped reading about the author’s "land of make believe."
Bottom line–feed prices are 4% more expensive than they would be in an unaltered market…and some amount more than that over a make-believe market in which government outlawed the production of ethanol.
(And even if production WERE outlawed, some ethanol would still be produced, heh, heh.)
"By the way, I never said “people are starving because of EtOH.”
I never said you did. Plenty of other people have, though. Actually, what you DID say was that EtOH raises the prices of FOOD corn…then you linked to a study that examined the rise in the price of FEED corn, and the effect that has on beef, milk, eggs, and poultry. Why you linked to THAT study to buttress your point is unfathomable.
Just went grocery shopping. Most commodities have increased in price about 20% in the last year. Beef has increased in price 100%. The government keeps telling us there is no measurable inflation. They are bold faced liars!
“How does taurus flex fuel vehicle know when E85 is in tank?”
Sensors are used to detect the ethanol content. One way is to use the difference in refractive index between gasoline and ethanol.
Educational, insight. I was unaware that there was an actual sensor that detected the ethanol ratio.
I have no doubt that the refractive index difference is a way to detect high ethanol content, but I’m gonna have to do a bit more research to find out exactly how these sensors work. You’ve given me a project to stimulate my elderly retired synapses…
Thanks (
In 2001 a friend at work bought a new Nissan Titan PU. It was flex fuel. The closest filling station with E85 was 60 miles away. He drove there and filled up saving $.15 per gallon. At the time E10 was $2.70 per gallon. Let’s do the math. He purchased 16 gallons of E85 at a savings of $.15 per gallon=$2.40. He drove 120 miles and wasted about 2 hours of his time. Highway mileage of his truck on E0 is about 24mpg. E10 reduces mileage by about 4%. Mileage on the 60 mile one way trip is about 23mpg. About $8.00. E85 reduces mileage by about 30% Mileage on return trip is about 17mpg. About $9.50. He spent 2 hours and $17.50 to save $2.40. Net cost 2 hours and $15.10. I didn’t burden him with my approximate and possibly inaccurate math. I just informed him he could expect a significant reduction in fuel mileage with E85 and since it was not available in our area it was a moot point. He said the Nissan salesman told him E85 could save lots of money due to it’s lower price. This individual was not an idiot just ignorant of ethanol fuel. Rule number one: If a car salesman’s lips are moving they are lying. Rule number two: See rule number one.
Next time to increase his savings he needs to go to a station farther away than 60 miles. Its the old sell more chickens next year rule of economics.
Has anyone noticed the smell of interstate these days?(it smells like some type of alcohol)-Kevin
My Taurus does not have fuel pressure regulator. The pump runs at variable speed to adjust fuel delivery when the ethanol percentage changes. The only code I get is 0172/0174 which is bank 1-2 rich. I assume the O2 sensor is monitoring exhaust temp. My intent was to try e85 to see if car runs ok? Which means the system is reacting properly to changing fuel mix. If it runs ok, than why does it have a rich condition only during idle situations. A shop with a good scan tool could tell me if it really is running right. I suppose some might say e85 and e10 are the same. It’s just “gas”. It’s “fuel”.
How does taurus flex fuel vehicle know when E85 is in tank?
http://paceperformance.com/i-10801493-13577429-fuel-composition-flex-fuel-sensor-e85.html
Siemens sold this device to GM for many years. The americans may have invented their own sensor by now (it takes a few years to catch up).
I would imagine GM Europe operations has lots of interaction with European suppliers. Maybe ford does the same thing. I see Bosch plug wires has 2 different part numbers for Taurus motors. It refers too flex fuel motor or no flex motor. I know the duratec motor which is OHC is not flex fuel. But I do not know if there is a flex fuel Vulcan motor and a non flex Vulcan motor. The vin ID is “2” for the flex Vulcan. Is there a non flex Vulcan? The duratec motor is COP.
The US Government does not report daily or weekly increases in prices. They report monthly and annual increases. The Bureau of Labor Statistics doesn’t get anything for hiding changes. They do get paid for reporting them correctly, however. There are enough elected officials on both political sides that lying will just result in more trouble than it is worth.
It appears that the ethanol/flexible fuel sensor was eliminated in 2001 on some ford vehicles;
Beginning in the 2001 model year, not all vehicles are equipped with flexible fuel sensors. On vehicles without flexible fuel sensors, the PCM calculates the A/F ratio based upon Heated Oxygen Sensor (HO2S) input signals.
There is a service bulletin for faults P0172/P0175 on the 2001 Taurus;
#04-17-12
Some Taurus/Sable vehicles equipped with a 3.0L FFV engine may exhibit a malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) illuminated and diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs) P0172/P0175, with no driveability conditions present.
ACTION
To service, reprogram the powertrain control module (PCM) to the latest calibration using WDS release B32.8 or higher. Calibration files may also be obtained at www.motorcraft.com. Do not replace the MAF, HEGO or PCM for this condition.
With a vehicle of this age there may be a real problem/failing part and the software update may not cure the problem.
Just looking at this sticker off a 2015 Chrysler 200C tells me that you lose about 25% of your mileage using E85. So unless E85 is more than 25% cheaper than E0 gas you are actually spending more money to go the same distance. If I am correct this sucks.
You’re correct, but the tests I’ve seen say it’s more like a 30% loss in mpgs, so the required price difference is even bigger.