You were arguing about my saying she probably had to take Physics and Math undergraduate classes to get accepted for the PhD program - Yes she had a degree in English. I just stated that she needed certain requirements for the PhD program, and in order to do that you need to take undergraduate classes to do so. There are probably less than the number of people I can count on one hand in the whole world that can achieve those skills on their own. My daughter met one and only one at MIT. Fellow student was from India. Brilliant girl. Everyone at MIT was amazed at how easily she grasped the subjects.
My nephews wife teaches math at mit. I suppose she has her phd. Smart kid but she scares me. Read about this girl in the uk with an iq of 161. Folks from India or Pakistan or some place but the school is trying to hold her back even though she aces all the advanced placement courses. Had her making pancakes or something for extra curricular activity. I think sheās about 16 or something. Should be in college. Not to harp on the educational system for the masses but it really bothers me we donāt encourage excelling for smart kids. Like to hold them back so they donāt make others uncomfortable. Even our local schools which are pretty good, canāt seem to break more than 50% proficiency in reading and math. Go after grants for minority drug education while half the kids canāt read. All I hear is excuses instead of horror at the outcome. Got off topic.
Correct. First guy says he doesnāt know, which tells the second guy his own hat must be white. B/c if it was black the first guy would have known. Good job.
Now about case 3?.
Again correct. Case 3 is just an extension of case 2, except in case 3 it is the third person who is able to figure it out. Another good job. This is definitely a head-ache causing puzzle ā¦ lol ā¦
Teaching has become extremely political. People donāt want to pay for it. Especially people with no kids or empty nesters. Iāve been to school board meetings where our town needed to expand the High-school at a cost of millions of dollars. One old guy got up and quite seriously said - āJust put up tentsā, They can go to school in tents. Itās that attitude that is killing our education system. We have states that are banning books and threatening teachers with jail time for teaching kids that the male Sea Horse is the one that gives birth. Look at PA about 20 years ago spending MILLIONS of dollars to keep creationism from being taught in Science Classes. Luckily it was defeated. Those kind of things happen yearly all over the country. And letās not forget by far thee biggest issue for the past 20 years is school safety. Over 394 school shootings since Columbine. Schools are spending MILLIONS now to make schools safe.
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For some reason scientist-types like puzzles. Even if they have no practical merit. Itās very common for someone applying for a tech job here in Silicon Valley to be presented with a puzzle. The interviewer is not expecting the potential hire to be able solve the puzzle , but just to show how they would get from not knowing anything to knowing something without going into a panic.
One common tech company puzzle:
Youāre sitting at a table with 6 other people. How would you go about estimating the total amount of change in everyoneās pockets? You have 30 seconds to provide your estimate.
I see no way to solve this problem. The group not in charge simply donāt want their kids indoctrinated by the group in charge. Since there is always two opposing groups, Americaās public school system looks doomed.
There is no indoctrination. Itās teaching history as it actually happened.
I suggest you read āThe Maple Sugar Storyā by Helen and Scott Nearing.
lol ā¦like I say, thereās no solution.
Thereās a scientific justification as well, related to the Gƶdel Incompleteness Theorem.
Oh man we are getting off topic but my favorite civil war historian emphasizes the difference between history and memory. Later authors change history to reflect their own bias such as the south never had a chance, even though the came close to winning twice. So he reads actual letters and journals at the time to determine what the facts were. And the facts were it was to save the union as a beacon of self government to Europe to show that it actually could be done. Slavery didnāt come up until much later although the south saw a risk to their way of life. But only a minority in the south actually were slave holders and included blacks.
At any rate, Iāve never voted against a school bond, even though a few have been just ridiculous and not a chance of passing. Our thing is declining enrollment. State money pays for each student so if you lose students you lose funding. At a presentation of our former super, he talked about the problem of kids transferring to other school districts, then talked about the number of kids eligible for free lunches at 40%. He never put the two together. Many kids do not want to go to a school where half the families are in poverty or donāt speak English. Call it anything you want but thatās the facts and kids are bailing out for an environment better suited to learning. So all the effort gets focused on the bottom half trying to get them at grade level and the other half gets forgotten. I understand itās a challenge but I donāt like to see talented kids left behind. Itās a social problem here with some businesses more interested in low cost workers. Enough. Just what it is.
No. Caltech doesnāt have programs for masterās degrees, doesnāt admit students to pursue them, gives them to grad school dropouts and the occasional non-citizen who needs to prove academic progress to retain a visa.
She didnāt go to Caltech.
Caltech administers a set of tests called doctoral preliminaries that one must pass before admission to a PhD program. If you can pass them the day you show up you can start immediately. The most brilliant students do. I assume all good schools do. Most students have to take courses for a year or two before they can pass them.
I told you. I was there. She took a job as a technical writer for the Space Radiation Lab, took courses (free and open to all employees), did well enough that Caltech admitted her to a PhD program.
At Caltech it isnāt necessarily courses or a degree.
Caltechās not normal.
@cigroller Maybe the person with the Ph.D. in English was accepted into a physics Ph.D. because she writes well. In my 45 years of teaching, I had a 4 year term on the research committee it the university where I was on the faculty judging research grants. Some of the poorest proposals came from faculty members from top rated schools and some outstanding proposals came from faculty with degrees from less well known universities.
See the immediately preceding post by @RandomTroll. I had, admittedly, missed the earlier post where first hand knowledge was provided on having gone through the technical writer and free courses route. I just know that itās not always so regimented and bureaucratic. Which is also what youāre saying. Iāve been on some grant evals myself, and yes - writing means an awful lot. (Clear writing is clear thinking Iāve always said).
??? According to the Caltech web site:
The Institute offers graduate degrees of Master of Science and Doctor of Philosophy, and in special cases the degree of Engineer.
I think the comment was probably limited to the Physics dept rather than to any possible degree program at Caltech: About physics graduate studies | The Division of Physics, Mathematics and Astronomy (I was just curious about it, so looked it up).
From that URL: āA Master of Science degree may be awarded upon completion of a program of courses. Students are not normally admitted to work toward the M.S. in physicsā Itās what I was saying above about some programs. Theyāre serious about the science and not there to pander to mere ācredentialā seekers.
I was wondering, since I had been admitted there for a masters of chemical engineering.
I do feel certain that nobody gets a phd in physics without significant science and math courses to support their work.
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Iām at least something of a āromanticā in many ways, including in the sense that I think a clear demonstration of aptitude/competence should be able to overcome technical requirements (like did you take this course or that courseā¦) Thatās the basis these days for people wanting to equate āreal world experienceā with technical requirements, such as those on a transcript.
Thatās not the way history has gone, though - substantive human judgment is more and more replaced by formal criteria. Thatās, more or less, what I meant above when saying you canāt look at 2024 criteria and apply that to however it worked in the '70s (when Cordova went through).
Which is not to disagree at all. I just know that, while checking off the formal requirement boxes is the ānorm,ā there have always been other routes. Less now than 50 yrs ago tho
The math required to do any advanced physics work is daunting. So there will be lots to learn, through coursework of some kind. Einstein struggled to get his theories to work until he concentrated on the advanced mathematics needed. Way more to it than āE=mc^2ā
Math is the ālanguageā of science and engineering. If one isnāt fluent, one wonāt go very far, especially in physics.
And some peopleās brains just work that way, and they donāt need intensive formal course instruction. There are ānaturalsā - the people who just āsee it.ā
And then thereās a whole other thing which is the ability to not just think along established lines - to bring the out of the box ideas, even if they donāt have the math to create the specific āproseā. Thereās often a huge difference between applied and basic science. Applied is generally in the box - git 'r dun within established guidelines. Basic is where the yearning is for the next AYFKM moment, that blows the doors off, even if the math isnāt there. Some people can think outside the circle. This is valued at the frontiers of knowledge - which are different from the frontiers of āgit 'r dunā
Do you know of recent phd graduates from Caltech that didnāt have a strong math background? Really has nothing to do with thinking outside the box. Einstein thought way outside the box, but had to learn the math to make it meaningful.