Autonomous cars are much more expensive then non autonomous cars

General Discussion
41

Well, I’m sure the technology will exist, but does that mean we can’t have a voice in how they’re implemented into our society? I’ve been told that Data Centers (to support A.I.) are inevitable, but I don’t want those in my neighborhood. I feel the same way here.

And the sad fact is that every single one of us is headed for a future where we won’t be able to drive ourselves. In that respect I can see where the freedom of autonomous cars is an enticing potential; but I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say “tread lightly & proceed with caution.”

42

Yeah, that’s where that name comes from… They’re Way Mo’ expensive!

43

I NEVER said it could. I said a fully autonomous vehicle (which we don’t have yet) could.

44

I agree. I would trust an old Chrysler “K-car” from the 1980s more than I would trust a “self-driving” car today. The most important “safety feature” in any vehicle isn’t installed at the factory. It’s the person driving! Getting rid of the driver doesn’t make me feel safer.

45

What a silly statement.

46

I have no great interest in this whole issue but many here i guess do for whatever reason. After bath houses, no gas stations and drive throughs, i thought maybe the minneapolis council got something right, like a blind pig. It appears though the boy mayor is going to veto the effort anyway.

Im not sure if the waymo is level 2 or 3 and whether it would have a steering wheel or pedals which would make a human impotent anyway, but clearly it is the right to determine the streets and weather that it can operate within.at this point. I just think it is better to move slowly on the whole issue.

Now why on car talk, there are so many against cars and human drivers of same, is another issue to ponder. Im just glad i dont have to go into Minneapolis anymore.

47

Never going to happen, for a variety of reasons—especially insurance. Currently, I am required to pay for car insurance, which costs about $1900 per year for two people/three vehicles, based on the legal theory that we could cause an accident which we would be legally responsible for, and therefore we need liability insurance to compensate the other party.

Take the human driver out of the equation, and why on Earth would I pay for insurance? Just because the state says I must have it??? It would be such a tough sell to convince people that they should pay for insurance for a vehicle which they do not control, regardless of what the laws say. Since the insurance industry stands to lose a lot of money if self-driving cars come to fruition, I can assure you that their lobbyists will be hard at work to prevent it.

48

I bet the car won’t move without insurance.

49

It would be such a tough sell to convince people that they should pay for insurance for a vehicle which they do not control…

Traffic is already beyond their control, kinda like nature necessitating homeowners insurance.

50

You cannot buy a Waymo.

51

Suppose you crashed into one, you might discover the replacement cost.

52

Because you still own the machine and the proper care and upkeep of it is your responsibility. If you fail to do that and the car is driving on bald tires, whose fault is that? This is no different than scenarios today. If the programming of the vehicle is at fault, then any judgement against you will likely be subrogated to the vehicle manufacturer by your insurance company.

53

If you own an autonomous car, your driving history will no longer apply to the insurance cost calculation. Since they are safer than cars that you or I drive, that should be reflected in the insurance cost.

54

That does make sense. Additionally, registering a vehicle requires insurance coverage (in most states, AFAIK), so the idea that an autonomous vehicle wouldn’t need insurance is bogus, IMO.

55

It would not surprise me if autonomous cars will not be privately owned. The liability for accidents is the car’s fault not the passenger/owner. It creates a new legal landscape.

You will rent the car owned by the manufacturer or a 3rd party. It will be licensed, insured and maintained by the 3rd party. You will pay for the use of the car but never own it.

56

That’s interesting and brings up some questions…

Can you Valet park one (joking on valet parking), and or if just going to the store, does it drop you off at the door, or park itself and make you walk like we do now?? (guessing drop you off at the door)

Where would the vehicle stay/park when not in use??
What if you live in a high risk neighborhood, does the vehicle stay in the driveway or go to a low risk garage/lot somewhere close?? (and charge the battery)

Do you just get a maintenance warning/email and the vehicle goes to the shop by itself for maintenance/repairs??

Will you always have the same vehicle so you can keep personal stuff in it (car seats, go bag, etc etc), or will you have to keep it 100% clean because it could be shared with another family??
If it is swapped out, what if it is not clean, who monitors it for cleanliness, self monitored or??

Will renting one be like having a monthly subscription (or whatever) to a car share type thing (taxi, lift, uber) and you are sent an available vehicle to drive you wherever, then does it wait for you (if shopping) and take you back home or to the next stop, or does it leave (went to work etc) and tend to other customers and then a vehicle, rather that one or a new one, pick you back up when done and take you wherever??

Since it would be rented, and self driving, on one hand it should stay with the renter (just like renting a vehicle long term from a rental company), or it could make the rental company (3rd party/manufacture) more money if they could keep it in use with multiple customers (logistics aside)??
I guess it will all come down to whatever the business model is, such as will it be: Shared, Reserved, Dedicated, or Fleet/business type rental/lease…

Yeah that’s where my brain goes thinking about all this…

57

IMO renting (leasing) and sharing are different. Leasing means that I control the car at all times. No one gets a rod in it unless I direct the car to pick them up. Sharing is like Waymo. When I want a ride, I hail it. I should have no expectation that the same autonomous vehicle will pick me up.

58

Lots of good questions, Dave! I think most people want their own car, with their own stuff tucked in the storage as @jtsanders aptly states. Shared cars may be OK for some, especially if kept clean. Others just won’t want that.

As for parking… Yes I think my autonomous car can drop me off and find its own space and come pick me up. Maybe it will roam around rough neighborhoods so it’s wheels don’t get stolen. :rofl:

59

I see an increase in the number of people choosing to lease or use ride-sharing but not an elimination of the same options available today.

Leasing is nice for car dealerships because you still own the maintenance and upkeep of the vehicle. Autonomous cars will still need tires, brakes, suspension, and other maintenance that falls on the person leasing the vehicle. If all those costs are assumed by the “renting” entity, your monthly costs will rise accordingly. The no free lunch deal…

A truly autonomous car would be pretty convenient in many ways. Imagine your car dropping you off at the store and then going to a charging station on its own while you do your business. When done you hail it back and off you go. Or, if you travel, it drops you off at the airport and drives itself back home. No parking fees at the airport, shuttle buses etc.

The non-ownership model has been floated around for as long as autonomous cars have been in development. The idea being, you pay a monthly or per ride fee and an available car comes to pick you up whenever you need a ride. This is exactly like Waymo or Uber without the driver. For some people this makes a lot of sense. There is a cross-over point where the expense of lots of small trips costs more than ownership.

When I travel on business, I never rent cars anymore. It’s Uber all the way. I have never had to wait more than 5 minutes for a ride and sometimes, I actually have to hurry because the car is going to get there faster than I can walk to the pickup spot.

60

+1

This is especially true for me now that I’m retired. I still participate in professional committees and each one has an in-person meeting each year. Attending those meetings would mean renting a car, parking at the hotel, then parking at the event, each with a parking fee. Why should I pay so much when I can typically take public transportation from the airport to the hotel, and then to the event? It’s often quicker to take the train or bus than going to the rental center and driving to my hotel. I’ve done that for about 20 years now.

I meet some interesting people along the way too. A few years ago I went the St Paul for a meeting. I hadn’t decided how to get from the airport to the hotel in downtown St Paul after arriving. I thought it would be safer to take the train, but then I met a guy with long dreadlocks. He told me that the bus was mulch safer because drug addicts often rode the train and it smelled terrible, not to mention the other issues with destitute addicts. While lean cut, I thought this guy was likely to be more sympathetic to the addicts. Shows how wrong first impressions can be.