When I start the car recently, it cranks 10 or 15 times and then starts. When I leave the key in the ignition ON position for a few seconds it starts right away. When I shut off and try to start right away it takes time to start. What is the problem ! Someone told me fuel pump/main relay need to be changed. I did and the problem remains the same. Another one told me weak battery and I changed battery the problem remains the same. After reading some blogs, I tend to believe it could be something to do with retaining fuel pressure. How do I diagnose whether it is the fuel pressure regulator or the fuel return valve or fuel pump? If it is the fuel return valve where is it located?
There is a valve built into the pump that allows it to retain pressure as it sits…not being run. This helps hold fuel in the line until you start the car tomorrow or the next day. These can be faulty, but I’m pretty sure the entire pump needs to be replaced.
Yosemite
Agreed with Yosemite; have a fuel pressure test done to see if the system holds pressure.
That check valve in the pump is nothing more than a spring and a BB which is pushed onto a seat when the engine is not running. Debris or wear on the BB and seat will cause the pressure to bleed off.
Concur with the above posts, this symptom is usually associated with the fuel pump check valve on the fritz. A fuel pressure test to check if the pressure holds steady overnight after the engine is shut off is how to verify that’s the problem. Or if you want to risk a shortcut, you can just replace the fuel pump and hope that fixes it.
One reason this might not fix the problem is that the leak isn’t going back into the fuel tank, but an injector is leaking into the intake manifold instead.
Sounded like the pump may already have been replaced so could be an injector staying open but first thing is to test fuel pressure during the delayed start condition. If no or low pressure, then look for a leak in the fuel system or pump not coming on. If pressure, then check out the ignition system, and air and engine temp sensors. Time for the shop diagnostics though.
Could be as simple as an Old Clogged FUEL FILTER…OR a clogged or NON VENTING Fuel Tank…Both will induce very similar symptoms…
Do This…Get in the car with the windows UP…preferably in a quiet area… Shut of radio or any other noise makers. Turn the key from the zero position all the way to the RUN position…DO NOT CRANK.
Hold your Breath and LISTEN…When you get the key to the RUN position…and the dash lights fully illuminate (Dash lights are IMPORTANT) You must get all the dash lights lit up during this test as it is a function of the PGM/FI Relays duties
You SHOULD Hear the fuel pump PRIME the system. It will basically sound like a Hiss…or a Muted Humm or SHHHHHHHH sound. See what you get and let us know. If you get the Hum or Hiss sound AND all your dash lights are illuminating… that means your Main PGM/FI Relay is working and is at least TRYING to run your fuel pump for a brief 3 second pulse so it can prime the fuel rail. The pump will then begin to run constantly after the Engine ECU receives an RPM Signal…indicating to the ECU that the engine is running and in need of constant Fuel pressure or flow.
After this test it will be time to move on to a Fuel Pressure test…and or a Fuel Flow Test.
Let us know what you get with this test…its rather important and will weed out many other items all at one time.
Blackbird
Blackbird.
Do you hear the fuel pump run when you do the procedure Blackbird suggests? That means the main relay is functioning, providing power to the fuel pump, and the fuel pump is running.
If the car is still hard to start, try this: turn the key from Off to Run and leave it on Run for a few seconds, so the fuel pump runs. Turn it back to Off, then to Run and repeat this “key dance” maybe three or so times. That will prime the fuel system, bringing fuel and fuel pressure to the engine. If you then turn the key to Start and it starts, it’s probably because the fuel system has lost pressure while sitting. As others have pointed out, there are several possible ways.
My 1999 Honda Civic has exhibited this problem several times over the years, especially when the tank is low on fuel. The “key dance” has always worked and I have not replaced any fuel system parts except for fuel filters as scheduled and a fuel cap when I lost the original.
FYI you may not hear the pump prime the system even if it’s working fine. I can’t hear it in my '07 TL. Too much sound insulation.
Thanks foe the feed backs. I still did not resolve it.
I swapped the fuel/main relay with a new one, no improvement. I removed the vacuum hose from fuel regulator to see any leaking gas through the diaphragm and no gas leak noticed. I cleaned all the spark plugs as they were black and no improvement. I swapped the battery under warranty for amperage sufficiency and no improvement. I put my cell phone in the trunk and put the voice recorder to hear the fuel pump priming. I could not hear any hum noise or hiss noise. Perhaps, my my phone is not picking it up. The car drives well under any acceleration.
Another thing is that when the car did not even crank, the AAA guy did some repair like work under the dash. He said then that the problem was due to remote starter or the security system. He did something under that dash and the immobilizer light stopped working and the car started. I don’t know whether he enabled the remote start which was disabled and the car is now starting with immobilizer bypass. It is giving P1607 in the OBDII scan which could be because of the immobilizer bypass enabled.
The car starts right away if I put the key to ignition ON position for a few second otherwise it gives a delayed start. It gives an extended crank when I shut of engine and starts right away. It seems like the fuel line is not holding pressure. Does Acura 2000 TL have a fuel pressure check valve. How do I check the fuel pressure?
Does anyone know how to disable the Code Alarm remote starter? It has a two button fob. There is a black button under the dash. When I press on it , makes click noise and doesn’t do anything.
The fuel problem and the green light not flashing when the key is turn to ON position could be two separate coincidental problems. I need help on both. Thank you in advance.
“I cleaned all the spark plugs as they were black and no improvement.”
Sounds like too much fuel. Maybe a temperature sensor reading low, O2 sensor bad, or mass air flow sensor dirty.
You need to have a fuel rail pressure check done. Both at idle, and to check if the pressure holds and meets the spec after the engine is stopped. This isn’t a job for an inexperienced DIY’er. Suggest to have a well recommended shop do it for you. They may let you watch, and then you’ll know how to do it if you like next time.
What I suspect is happening is that the fuel line is draining down when you turn the engine off. Then when you turn the key to ON for a few seconds the pump refills and repressurizes the system.
For the line to lose pressure takes a faulty check valve, a part of the fuel pump assembly. For the fuel to drain down requires that you also have an injector not closing properly. The fuel line works like a drinking straw, if you hold your finger over the end of the straw and lift it, the fluid stays in until you lift your finger and allow air in to displace the fluid, then gravity takes over. Similarly, if an injector isn’t closing completely and the check valve isn’t working, the fuel line will drain back into the tank.
You can have the injectors bench tested, and I would recommend it. I would not be surprised if the injectors’ pintles and/or seats were eroded after 14 years. You may need to replace them all. That should improve the start problem considerably. If it still needs a moment to pressurize, you can then change your pump assembly. Truth is that if the injectors are sealing properly the car should run fine even if the check valve isn’t. The “straw theory” should keep the line full, and that should enable near-normal starts.
By the way, the carbon coated plugs support the leaky injector pintles/seat theory as well.
Thank you for the elaborate explanation to the probable cause for the extended start of my car. I would like to find out where the fuel injectors are located. I was able to find out the fuel regulator and after that it wasn’t clear to me where the fuel injectors are located. The car is Acura 2000 TL 3.2. Can you post some pictures if you have any. Thank you.
I’m unable to find one, but a Chilton or Haynes manual from the parts store should show the injectors’ locations. The dealer’s parts guy should also be able to print an “exploded view” drawing for you showing the injectors if you ask nicely. I’ve done this before and never been refused.
Here is a video on how to replace injectors on your car.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=acura%203.2%20tl%20fuel%20injector%20replac3ment&source=images&cd=&ved=0CAUQjhw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dp0ZNZXXypZc&ei=JvCtVLOwD8P9yQSjqoE4&bvm=bv.83134100,d.aWw&psig=AFQjCNEx0OvDigi9PdSV6hDDW-6C78whdA&ust=1420771721149683
Thank you for the video but it doesn’t really look like Acura 2000 TL engine. I guess, this video would be helpful.
Why would I want to look at fuel injectors when the car takes a few minutes to prime the fuel. The car starts right away when I keep the key to ignition ON position for a two or three seconds. Does this seem like more or less of an issue with check valve in the fuel pump.
I placed my cell phone in the recording mode in the trunk and listened to the recording. There was no hum or wooo noise when I turn the key to ignition ON position. Does the fuel pump on these cars make noise or is it muffled?
The car drives well at any acceleration !
The check valve leaking or remaining open would not affect engine operation when driving, it would only affect start up.
A leaky injector would cause you to run rich, but it could be so slight as to not be readily noticeable except as some excess carbon buildup on a spark plug when changing them out. Especially of it’s only on one cylinder. But even a very slight leak in even one injector combined with a leaking check valve could easily allow the fuel to run back into the tank when stopped.