Someone told me the other day they had gone to their auto repair shop b/c the dashboard light said there was something wrong with the tire pressure gadgets inside the tires. The shop did a computer test and said two of them had apparently failed due to the battery running out, and that the other three (inc the spare) were probably close to having the same problem as they were all original w/the car. The shop recommended to replace all 5. The estimate? $900!
Does this sound reasonable? I $900 just to monitor the tire pressure? You can buy a tire guage for less than $5 and check all 5 tires in less than 5 minutes yourself in your own driveway.
Could it really cost $900 to replace 5 tire pressure monitors?
We can thank the federal government for requiring all cars to have an active tire pressure monitoring system that will cost the consumer hundreds of dollars to service. Repair shops now have an additional source of revenue…
Anyway, say that each sensor costs $120. There’s $600. Labor to dismount 5 tires, install sensors and remount and balance 5 tires, there’s another $100. Then interface with vehicle TPMS system to program and reset TPMS system to recognize new sensors, add sales tax and you’re probably over $800.
Good comment @asemaster. I guess the Feds figure if there’s a dash light that says the tire is underinflated, we’ll stop and top it off, and improve fuel economy and reduce emissions. Maybe the air is a little cleaner, and less foreign oil imports. That’s a plus. But it seems like overkill to me. If, say, the Feds instead required the auto makers to offer this as an option, maybe there is merit to that requirement. But insisting all vehicles sold in the USA have tire pressure monitors installed even if the customer doesn’t want it or can’t afford the $900 repair bills coming down the pike? For a potential slight improvement in fuel economy and only if the driver actually does stop and top the tire’s off when the lights come on? Doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.
I can see a day when someone comes up with a aftermarket box that fools the system. Maybe I should work on that. Price point say about $150. Get someone in China to make it for $10.00. I bet it sell. But big bro would have a lot to say about it. LOL
Me, I’d just put a piece of duct tape over that part of the dash lights. As long as the state didn’t require the lights to be out to pass inspection or emissions testing, that would probably be the best solution. Oh, and buy a $5 tire guage.
Any consumer irritation or anger could or should be directed at the Feds for requiring this stuff and to the consumers themselves to some extent for not ever checking the tire pressure; an act which may have led to the requirement.
Personally, I don’t care for it either but the sad fact is that the majority of drivers never, ever check their tire pressure. This no doubt let to statistics involving injuries and fatalities due to underinflation and ergo, you have the TPMS.
Like ok4450 said, the vast majority of people never check their tires, as directed to by the owner’s manual. It’s as rare as checking the oil and coolant.
Just anecdotal, I have no statistics, but as an automotive professional, I’d say maybe a third of the cars that come into the shop have all 4 tires properly inflated. And that’s on the cars we actually check tire pressure. Anyone want to back me up on that?
I guess you all have magic tires that can’t suddenly start losing air due to a puncture between the times that you check the tires manually. I don’t, so given that TPMS has warned my wife and me twice about punctured tires on the passenger side where they weren’t noticeable, I’m happy to have the system.
@asemaster, I never kept stats but my unscientific guess is that you’re probably dead on with your comments.
From all of the cars that I’ve serviced I would easily say that 2/3 of them had underinflation on one, two, or all tires including the spare. A T-type with 15 PSI is even more dangerous than a full sized tire at that pressure.
$900 is beyond outrageous, even with labor, unless they come with a new set of tires to monitor. I did a quick web search and found complete sets of sensors ranging from $40 (ebay) to around $200 (aftermarket) But I don’t know what kind of car you’re talking about, so let’s say $300 for parts. I looked up a set for my car just for fun (Chrysler) and found a fancy-schmancy set with chrome valve stems for $172, brand new, OEM, and I’m sure I could find them cheaper if I’d spent any time shopping around.
Any tire store can install these, let’s say at a max of $30/tire, including rebalancing them. So with taxes, etc. I’d say a maximum of slightly more than half what was quoted, even with replacing all sensors, remounting all tires, rebalancing, and tax.
Even allowing an extra hour of labor in case they had to do something with a scan tool to recalibrate the system or get it to recognize the replacement sensors, $900 is pretty high!
I did a little Calculation.
If you do 15,000 miles per year and get 25 miles per gallon, you will spend $2,100 per year at $3.50 / Gal.
If having a low tire pressure casts you 10 % on gas mileage, and you do not fix it because the TPMS is not there to warn you, you will spend $210 / year more on gas. This would be a four year payback, which would be borderline in my book, but assumes that you NEVER check your tires and that they will ALWAYS be underinflated.
If, however, you are reasonably diligent to check you tire pressure and they are underinflated 20 % of the time, it will cost you less than $50 per year. This is like a 15 year payback, which does not make economic sense, especially since you will probably need to do the $900 repair in 5-10 years.
From an economic point of view, it is much more cost effective to get a $10 tire pressure gauge and come up with a scheme to check your pressure regularly (Say - the first and 15th of each month or every Saturday) than to shell out the $900 to fix it.
How much would it be to replace the sensors / Batteries as part of a normal tire replacement when the tires are already off of the car? If it is not that much, it might be worth waiting until the tires need replacing.
Also, if it is inexpensive enough to change the batteries, should it be done as part of a normal tire replacement?
" If having a low tire pressure casts you 10 % on gas mileage, and you do not fix it because the TPMS is not there to warn you, you will spend $210 / year more on gas. "
In my opinion that ten percent figure is way high. Beside that, consider what would cause cause a tire to get low enough to start decreasing fuel economy. That would be a pretty low tire, but think about whatever is causing it to lose pressure, a nail, rim leak, defective tire, bad valve, etcetera.
What would cause the tire to stop leaking after it lost some pressure and not continue losing pressure until it was flat if one did nothing to fix it ?
I check mpg frequently enough that if I had a 10% decrease, I’d be looking for a problem.
What did I ever do before the “I’m from the government. I’m here to help.” mandated TPMS ?
That warning light that keeps glowing should say, “Big Brother.”
These systems should be options and the light should have an on-off feature.
"I guess you all have magic tires that can't suddenly start losing air due to a puncture between the times that you check the tires manually."
Lion9car nailed it–as he frequently does.
The “history” of these required devices dates back to the period of the highly-publicized Ford Explorer/Firestone tire accident debacle. Because so many people were killed or injured by underinflated tires in those incidents, Congress mandated these devices–first on SUVs, and later on other passenger vehicles.
These devices were never intended to be a substitute for manually checking one’s tire pressure, although–obviously–some poorly-informed folks and many lazy slugs will interpret their presence as an invitation to never again manually check their tires. Instead, the TPMS was intended to warn drivers of sudden low pressure situations in their tires while driving. And, NO, the intent was not to try to improve fuel economy.
I check my tire pressure on a regular basis (at least once each month, more often when we have radical temperature shifts), but I would still like to find out about catastrophic pressure loss in my tires as I am driving, and that was the intent of these devices.
Nowadays, many cars have oil level warning lights, in addition to oil pressure warning lights. Surely none of the veterans of this forum would interpret the presence of an oil level warning light as an okay to cease manually checking their dipstick, so…Why do so many of you believe that a TPMS is intended to substitute for manually checking tire pressure?
The bottom line is that a huge percentage of the driving public fails to do the important under-hood checks and tire pressure checks that are recommended in their Owner’s Manuals. That has always been the case, and–because of both human nature and ignorance about the workings of cars–that will probably always be the case. Whether we had TPMS or not, slackers would still fail to manually check their tire pressure, and I doubt if the presence of these devices has led to fewer people checking tire pressure manually. On the other hand, it has undoubtedly saved many tires and at least a few lives.
" . . . so given that TPMS has warned my wife and me twice about punctured tires on the passenger side where they weren’t noticeable, I’m happy to have the system. "
I had the same experience when my 18 year-old daughter was alerted to a low tire. I was happy the car had the TPMS, but . . .
I have cars in the driveway that utilize different TPMS. Some of the newer cars have the stupid mandated transmitters inside the tires and read out pressures on the IP. Some of the older cars use the cars’ existing ABS system speed sensors (no transmitters) and don’t give pressure readings.
Both systems alert the driver to a low tire.
My car is one that uses ABS for TPM. I have had no problems and the one that alerted my daughter has had no problems. That is the set-up I prefer. Free is good, too.
" Nowadays, many cars have oil level warning lights, in addition to oil pressure warning lights. Surely none of the veterans of this forum would interpret the presence of an oil level warning light as an okay to cease manually checking their dipstick, so… "
We have Oil Level Monitors in 4 of our vehicles. I do like having the feature and I agree with most of what you say. I check fluids in all cars, weekly.
Here’s the difference. Instead of a $900 TPMS system, our oil level monitors consist basically of a threaded hole in the oil pan, a few buck sensor that screws in, and a couple pieces of wire added to an existing harness.
We See Folks Come On Here And Complain After Running Their Vehicles Out Of Oil. They Are Upset That Their Engine Blew Up In Spite Of The Fact That The Oil Monitor Said “31% Oil Life Remaining.”
I’ll bet there are some who are equally surprised when their worn out tires hydro-plan them into a gaurdrail or blew out on the expressway with no warning from the TPMS that read all tires had 30 psi.
There is an inherent danger in dumbing down. We notice that many (most ?) owners don’t read their Owner’s Manuals. Many think these monitors on the IP take the place of OMs. In fact, aren’t there some Asian cars that no longer come with Manuals ?
And the silliest part of all this ?
They COULD have made them so as to be able to replace the wafer battery.
But they didn’t.
Who’s wise azz idea was that ?
I’ve taken old ones apart before. the wafer battery is something you can get at Radio Shack and Wal Mart every day but the bury it in epoxy and solder it in…how strange.