And they wonder why GM is in trouble. http://www…eId=147626
And they wonder why GM is in trouble. http://www…eId=147626
This is no suprise. the Camaro is new model, it’s going to have some teething problems. Many, many cars, especially new models will have a recall or two under their belt. It’s not limited to American automakers by a long shot.
There is no logic in your statement. I am sure you realize that all makes have recalls so does that make all vehicle manufactures junk? Are all makes in trouble? No they are not. This happens with all new models and it is not a rush to manufacture.
That doesn’t mean much to me. While working for Nissan, Honda, and Subaru I used to see Recalls and TSBs all of the time on new or near new vehicles.
In one instance regarding Subaru, the parent corporation SOA (Subaru of America) was sending their parts reps around to change out steering rack pinion springs which were causing some models to spontaneously go into a high speed wobble.
This was done by the parts reps to assure there was no paper trail, no Federal Gov. interference, no recall issued, etc.
Subaru was calling the customer cars in, feeding the customer a line of BS, and doing the pinion jobs on a shop rack and off the record of course. I even confronted the Subaru parts rep about it who simply grinned sheepishly and nodded when I accused SOA of a coverup.
At least GM is stepping up and covering it up front rather than performing a whitewash. of the problem.
I agree with Tester on this. Over the past 40+ years I’ve bought a number of new models and the only one I ever had with a serious safety recall was a GM. That was my Vega and it had quite a few of them, including rear wheels that fell off.
My Toyota products all combined had a few minor recalls, but never a safety recall.
The Camaro has been in design and qualification for years. Too many years, to the point that it’s late to the market segment. It should not have begun its life with a defect of this magnitude.
Sorry guys, that’s how I feel. Agree or disagree, that’s your choice.
Sure, Toyota has safety recalls and recalls due to lawsuits.
(Took a class action suit for the last one)
That’s just a few random ones. There’s a lot more floating around on Toyota not to mention other makes.
I never cease to be amazed how a GM recall means “junk” and yet Toyota/Honda/Nissan/Subaru problems are given a pass even if the recall is for an identical problem.
Scratch out the word “Toyota” in the above examples, substitute “GM”, and the response would be…???
I concur on this. I never understood why imports get the pass. People ofen mention the recalls specifically on the Vega, and while I agree the Vega was not a good car ( the only good vega is one that is now a race car ) the car came out some 30 years ago.
they actually put the Camaro on the market?
I thought it was a myth, like the Volt, or Bigfoot, or the Loch Ness monster
AHHHHH… Thats not so bad. We’re talking about 1200 vehicles here, an easy fix for GM just to re-route a battery cable. You want to talk about real recalls, heres a couple from when I was at the dealership. We were replacing 4 cylinder Fiero engines that were cracking in the blocks and causing engine compartment fires and of course the Cadillac 4100 aluminum motors we were replacing. We had a pile of those stacked up outside the shop waiting for the junk man. There were so many of them we were replacing that GM stopped taking the old ones back.
As I’ve stated before, I worked for several Asian car dealers over the years (Honda, Subaru, Nissan, Mazda) and every single one of them has recalls (and all recalls are related to safety problems), TSBs, and numerous problems that may not even be mentioned in the recall or TSB section.
GM recalls ball joints and it’s “yep, typical GM junk”. Toyota recalls ball joints and the only thing heard is chirping crickets. (And I believe 2 Toyota execs were arrested for trying to cover this one up. Same thing with Mitsubishi; coverup at the very top).
So Transman makes a point for me. While he’s stacking up Fiero and Cadillac engines I’m stacking up Honda and Subaru ones, along with a not so annoying number of Subaru transmissions. The transmissions are money makers so what’s not to like.
You should have seen the warrantable pile of Honda engine blocks and heads in the back room; a full 7 foot high pile of them awaiting the disposal order.
This doesn’t bother me either…All cars will have problems…What I like to see is how they deal with these problems. If they bury their heads in the sand and ignore the problem for YEARS and just let their customers suffer…NOW THAT’S A PROBLEM. GM has done that too often.
OK, this may not bother most of you, but I agree with the OP that this is a terrible public relations faux pas.
Today is May 12, 2009 and the 2010 model [b]already[/b] has a recall? Is the car already available for sale? How do you recall a car that hasn’t been sold yet? If it is for sale, they should have made it the 2009 Camaro.
Yes, Honda, Toyota, and all the others recall cars too, but how many of them issue a recall for next year’s model? This is a blunder of astronomical proportions.
A blunder of astronomical proportions??? You’ve got to be kidding??? GM has put out a new model, after only 1200 units they decide they dont like the way the battery cable is routed and want to route it in a different way because the cable is making contact with the starter motor and could possibly wear through the insulation causing bigger problems. This is not a blunder, it is a design issue they found with a new model, or should I say a new “design” of an older model. They said “Lets correct this now” and are incurring the expense to recall 1200 units to reroute the cable, period. If they would have let this go and did absolutely nothing after 1200 units then build 3000, 30,000, or even 300,000 units knowing that the insulation could wear through in 2 or 3 years and cause fires??? THATS a blunder of astronomical proportions. ok4450 is absolutely right, with GM its junk, or a “Blunder of astronomical proportions” where Toyota, it goes unnoticed. Like I said earlier with the engine recalls, these are real defects. ALL manufacturers have defects and recalls, thats part of the business. GM didnt like something in this new design and theyre correcting it.
I understand all that and I stand by my statement. From a marketing and public relations standpoint, it creates a [i]very[/i] poor impression when you issue a recall on [i]next year’s model[/i].
Toyota has obviously had quality and recall problems in the past, and I am not giving them a pass. If Toyota issued a recall on [i]next year’s model[/i], I would call that a colossal blunder as well.
From a marketing and PR standpoint, GM could have sailed under my radar if they had just labeled the new Camaro with the proper year instead of trying to create marketing hype by calling it the “2010 Camaro.” By labeling it as next year’s model, they have made themselves look bad.
With exception of the last item (ouch!) and the last on the list of the third item (the part that could contact the fuel system in a rear end collision) all of these are for replacement lamps from a specific parts manufacturer. And all but two allude to the same replacement lamp problem on the same vehicle, the Tacoma.
Toyota isn’t perfect, but my own experience over the years has been that GM has far more serious safety recalls than Toyota. I’ve owned two GMs over the years, and both had safety recalls…one of the vehicles had a list of them. None of my Toyotas has had, and I’ve owned numerous Toyotas.
I don’t give any make a “pass”. I’ve been straightforward about the performance of all my vehicles. But that’s been my experience. Toyotas are simply more reliable and simply have fewer safety recalls than GM.
The term “Toyota” has no magic. If I’d had safety or reliability problems with my Toyotas I’d try another make. The whole reason I tried Toyota in the first place was because of the numerous serious problems my GM had, especially that one where my rear axle came out of the housing while I was driving. If the Toyota I’d tried had also had serious problems I would not have bought another.
Sorry guys, but that’s my story. The growth and shrinkage of the respective manufacturers’ market shares over the years suggests that my experience was not unique.
I have to agree with Whitey on this one.
These past years countless engineers have spent countless thousands of hours performing qualification, validation, and accelerated life testing that subjects the vehicle to environmantal conditions well beyond those expected in real life. Beyond that, cablings’ inherant weaknesses and failure modes are well established, as are techniques for routing, securing, protecing, and establishing stress relief. Examination and testing such as Hypot (high electrical potential) testing of cabling systems including battery cabling are standard protocol after subjecting each of the electrical systems and then the entire vehicle to all of the aforementioned accelerated life testing.
This should naver have made it to production. I’m left suspecting that some manager, probably a production manager, made a last minute change to save time or cost. Or perhaps there was an omisison of a production process operation.
Sorry guys, but 23 years in quality engineering tells me that this one should not have happened.
Many car companies put out their new cars before the actual calendar year has begun, especially with a new and exciting model. My 1996 Taurus was built in April 1995, and that was considered a new and somewhat exciting design, although poorly received by the public since it was so butt-ugly. I think this recall, if anything, shows that GM cares enough to try and catch any problems with their new model before it has a chance to affect anybody. This is an all-new car, so a higher than usual recall rate is likely. Remember what happened when the Focus first came out in '99-'00?
perhaps with the government breathing down their necks, they got a bit jumpier than they were before. coughheadgasketproblemscough
Excellent point. And VERY well stated!
“This is a blunder of astronomical proportions.”
Aw, c’mon. How many people have been injured from this? It’s not an exploding gas tank, for goodness sakes. They found an issue on a new car that they want to take care of. Apparently no one has had a problem with it yet. That puts it under the category of being cautious with their customer’s well-being. Call me when there is a real issue. There might eventually be one, but this isn’t it.