Natural gas stations coming soon

kmccune · March 2012

Well Dagosa the Military basically uses one high grade blend of Kerosene for everything(including the motor cycles which makes good sense(kinda like operating on Zulu time).The Air Force has experimented with and certified a bioblend for use in some of its Jets. The "gas" motor fuels would present a problem dyeing them or whatever(I say user fees on the road-forget about fuel taxes)The trouble with taxes they even hit the innocent in a round about way at times,thats why I like user fees...-Kevin

texases · March 2012

Another option the military is looking into is GTL (gas to liquids) where diesel is made from natural gas. Uses a lot of natural gas (about 10,000 cubic feet per barrel of diesel), but the product is pretty high quality (no sulfur).

DfromSD · March 2012

Making gas & oil a regulated utility rather than a commodity would help stabilize prices tremendously IMHO. As it is now every time a mouse breaks wind in the mideast speculators see it as a reason to raise prices. A good thing for them since they are also probably heavy into oil company stock.

Docnick · March 2012

@dagosa

Unlike natural gas, there is no glut of oil worldwide, and the $120 international price of oil dictates what you pay for gasoline, not an excess refining capacity in the USA.

Oil is an internationally traded commodity and Americans are lucky to have to import 50% of their crude oil. And the oil that comes from Canada, comes in at significantly lower prices than internationally priced crude. Oilsands oil from Canada sells for $20 less than worldprice.

Countries like Holland have huge refining capacity and they export gasoline worldwide, all at interantional prices. The pump price in Holland is about $9 per gallon.

In short, you CANNOT make cheap gasoline from expensive oil, no matter how much refining capacity you gave!!!

texases · March 2012

Yep, the government is GREAT at running things. Last time we got rid of price controls, guess what happened? Prices dropped and supplies went up. And regulate natural gas prices? When they're the lowest they've been in years? Why?

Sorry folks, we don't have the ability in the US to dictate prices.

the same mountainbike · March 2012

Nor should we try.

I seem to recall that price and market government controls were tried in another country. The USSR.

Docnick · March 2012

The gas price controls in the 70s caused a shortage of natural gas for heating because drilling went down to almost zero and many houses had oil heating in 1974 when oil prices went up from $2.50 to $12.00 per barrel overnight. This caused severe stress an those with oil heating since isnulation standards were very poor in those days.

Nixon finally ended the 40 cents per million BTU interstate price control and drilling soared. The US quickly developed much more gas, backing out heating oil in those areas that had pipeline and distribution access.

Canada tried to control oil prices in the 70s by setting an artificially lower than market price for internal oil while putting an export tax on oil exported to the US to bring it up to world price. It caused great dislocation in the industry and local companies went overseas where their drilling effiorts would yield more returns.

Japan wisely adjusted itself to world oil and gas prices in the 70s and developed a strong lead in energy conservation and fuel efficient car design.

Gasoline price controls practiced by dictators in Iran, Venezuela, Nigeria, Indonesia,Saudi Arabia and other places have caused numerous problems, and discouraged conservation efforts.

jtsanders · March 2012

Thanks for a thoughtful post, Docnick. I agree that price controls will not have a desirable effect in the long run. If after instituting them they are ever rescinded, the price will likely change substantially because no one can efficiently determine what the price ought to be.

dagosa · March 2012

Doc....."Unlike natural gas, there is no glut of oil worldwide, and the $120 international price of oil dictates what you pay for gasoline, not an excess refining capacity in the USA."
NO IT DOES NOT, short term. It's market pressures.

There is no glut of natural gas world wide, and that is what will ultimately determine nat gas prices as a transportation fuel along with tax incentives in any country as it is now for gasoline.

In the US 7/12 2008 gas average was 4.12
11/29 2008 1.69
3/22 2008 3.87

The price of oil per barrel did not change by 50% during that time. Please remember there IS a manufactured glut of gasoline and still, the price goes up. Gas to be sold to the highest bidder abroad on the world market, driving up prices here, as world price per gallon of gas moves in harmony but lags behind changes in oil prices REGULATED by OPEC, the biggest producer of EASY access oil.

But, my contention is still that this so called GLUT of natural gas will not suddenly make all natural gas users, if and when they ever come on line, cut costs dramatically. The so called plan is to make long haul users of nat. gas to relieve the price of diesel, which affects the cost of everything. That is a good economic strategy. The only long term strategy for lowering personal transportation costs is the ultimate flex fuel vehicles. EVs.

Kmccune "Well Dagosa the Military basically uses one high grade blend of Kerosene for everything(including the motor cycles which makes good sense(kinda like operating on Zulu time).The trouble with taxes they even hit the innocent in a round about way at times,thats why I like user fees..."

I hear you but what is your point ? Gas taxes ARE user fees that work in concert with the number of miles you use our roads.

texases · March 2012

Gas is available for export because of declining demand in the US, caused by economic slowdown, increased ethanol use, and higher-mpg cars being bought. Demand is down 550,000 bbls/day, exports are at about 500,000 bbls/day, so exports are not straining US gasoline supplies.

Can you imagine any other industry that is a employment engine, exporting millions of dollars, that folks want to GUT? So if we have a surplus in farming, we should prohibit exports in order to drive prices down? Or we should prohibit BMW from exporting cars from its South Carolina plant? REALLY?

And you say the price of oild did not change 50%. You're right, it dropped MORE than that, $140/bbl -> $40/bbl, then up 65% to $66/bbl by June 2009. So it varied MORE than the gas price.

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Natural gas stations coming soon

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