Why not Diesels or Diesel Hybrid's?


#1

Every Hybrid is gasoline. Where are the diesels? Do the auto makers think no one surfs European car sites? Am I the only one who does?


#2

[b]The problem is, diesel emission research is still going on. And the vehicles from Europe with diesel engines don’t meet the EPA and CARB emission requirements as of this date. But they’re working on it.

So, you have to wait. It’s coming!

Tester[/b]


#3

I guess some one forgot to tell benz that they couldn’t sell euro diesels in the U.S.

We will see plenty of conventional (not hybrid) diesels in a couple of years, now that ULSD will allow current emissions standards to be met. Both the euro and asian manufactures have plenty of small diesels available in the rest of the world (detroit doesn’t have a clue, as usual).

IMHO, diesel hybrids would not be very cost effective. The (supposed) advantage of gas/electric diesels is the reduction of the gas engine under part load and idling conditions. Conventional diesels are more efficient at partial load and use much less fuel under these conditions, so the advantage of a diesel/hybrid would be even more limited (the VW TDI fuel mileage is similar to hybrids already). From an economic point of view, one would have to pay a premium for both the diesel and the hybrid technologies which would make the car even more expensive than gas/hybrids with little advantage over a conventional diesel. Also, I don’t see any euro manufactures jumping on the hybrid bandwagon and the asian manufactures haven’t gotten U.S. diesels to market yet, so I don’t know who would be pushing diesel/hybrids in the near future. It will be interesting to see what happens in a couple of years.


#4

It’s just a matter of time. Some are ready to sell.


#5

The emissions problems are one thing that’s preventing sales in the U.S. But there is another, backstage reason. Refining realities and capacity. The U.S. consumer burns 45 million gallons of gasoline a day. The global petroleum industry DEPENDS on him continuing to do so. They are set up to maximize gasoline production and can not readily switch to “distillate oil”, “fuel oil” or #2 Diesel, whatever you want to call it. Even a SMALL increase in the demand for diesel fuel would send global diesel prices soaring…SOMEBODY has to burn all that gasoline and that somebody is the American Motorist…There will be no large scale marketing of diesel powered automobiles in the United States.

Diesel Hybrids work GREAT and easily deliver 65-85 MPG. The advanced ones use constant load, constant RPM engines tuned for peak efficiency. They are fitted with higher capacity batteries than todays hybrids can get into and back out of inner cities on pure battery power. At highway speeds, the engine starts, powers the car, charges the battery fairly quickly, and shuts off. They were on the drawing board 15 years ago, and their they have stayed…


#6

I wouldn’t worry about U.S. gasoline refining capacity being underutilized, if anything the refining capacity is already at the limit. The reason the there isn’t more capacity is that fuel prices are too low to justify the long term (10 -15 year) investment. Diesel fuel also requires significant refinement, especially ULSD, the market will adjust - it always does. I do agree the increased use of small diesel will cause the price of diesel fuel to increase, but it won’t be drastic.

Diesel hybrids are technically feasible, but there is a reason they are still on the drawing boards. As I said, they will not be cost effective simply because the hybrid technology does not provide a significant advantage over current diesels. You can buy a VW diesel with 40+mpg today, and it has very decent performance. If/when there is a significant market for 60+ mpg (lower performance) diesels they will be available. The current diesel Smart Car is capable of very good mileage without the weight/cost penalty of hybrids.


#7

And here I thought it was the trucker’s union controlling the price of diesel. :stuck_out_tongue:


#8

If they are controlling diesel prices, they need to do a better job of it.


#9

Actually the European diesel engines can easily meet the US standards now. They could not until this year because the quality clean diesel fuels that have been available in Europe for years were kept out of the US by the trucking industry lobbyist.

We now have the new ULS (Ultra Low Sulfur) diesel and the auto companies are getting their car’s certified. Some should be certified soon and others over the next year.


#10

Here in Ohio, the price of regular(ULSD) diesel has stayed the same since spring, before the price of gas went up. Diesel was hovering around 20 to 40 cents more than gas at the time, but it hasn’t risen much, if any, since the summer blend came out for gasoline. Now, diesel is about 20 to 40 cents cheaper than gasoline


#11

Up until a couple of years ago diesel was always cheaper than gasoline. Then, for some reason the price of diesel got ahead of the price of gas. The current situation is due to gasoline prices going up more rapidly than diesel. Diesel does tend to go up during the fall due to home heating oil production. The switch to ULSD has also pushed the price up a little. At the moment diesel is somewhat cheaper just about everyplace, we’ll see if it stays that way. My guess is that both will continue to climb for a while.


#12

I’m not going to wait, I’ve built my own electric car and then I started making BioDiesel which we run in our 2001 TDI Beetle. My next step is building a diesel hybrid. It’s not rocket surgery. There’s a great website with plans for a 3 wheel hybrid, time to clear some space in the garage for a new project. :slight_smile: