Barkydog
I changed the gas out this year in my generator as the gas was 3 years old, the gas looked fine but there was a lot of moisture in the bottom of the jug I poured it into along with with garbage…
Garbage?
…in it, almost 1/2" of water for a quart of gas. I did use a fuel stabilizer.
Was this E10 gas, or alcohol-free stuff?
We are in mandated ethanal 10% min as far as I know. Garbage looked similar to grass clippings.
Barkydog
We are in mandated ethanal 10% min as far as I know.
Well I guess that would explain the water, which seems to be the main issue with old E10.
I wonder why it’s relatively easy to get alcohol-free gasoline here in Iowa, of all places?
Garbage looked similar to grass clippings.
Any idea how it got there?
There used to be bad gas. Gas pumps used to have glass bulbs at the top through which gas was pumped so customers could see for themselves that it wasn't dirty. Gas used to lack detergents. 'Bad gas' is an out-dated complaint.As somebody who takes used mowers set out for trash and fixes them to sell...I have to say I LOVE folks like you! If I've made a quick $80 cleaning out a gummed-up lawnmower carb once...I've done it a dozen times or more. Believe whatever malarkey you want, because that brand of baloney puts money in my pocket!
yep, my son made quite a bit of money when he was in school by getting mowers and and cleaning the gummed up gas from the carbuerators then selling them
I’m still left wondering how the OP keeps the battery charged … lol …
There’s a huge reason the small engine shops are swamped in the springtime; stale gas.
I had left gas in a pressure washer over the winter a few years back. When I finally pulled the fuel bowl off it was filled with sludge the thickness of hand cleaner.
And that fuel bowl was cleaned the spring before.
The OP is the kind that just wants to see people argue over his threads.
“I made it home on bald tires all winter in Upper Michigan…what’s your problem”
Yosemite
Yosemite, I believe you’ve “hit the nail on the head”.
How do you know it hasn’t gone bad ? Today’s automobiles can run on a variety of “fuels” with different alcohol and water content up to a point. This same gas could make a small motor without a computer stumble and stall. I see it happen all of the time and what makes a small motor without a closed system that keeps out moisture run poorly, is able to function decently in a car.
This is what I understand…, there is a difference between gasoline “going bad” and the moisture content increasing because of the alcohol content. Besides, even if the gas is old initially, fresh gas is constantly run through cars to lesson the effects of the older gas. Stabilizing gasoline DOES NOTHING TO MIDIGATE THE EFFECTS OF ETHANOL. you need special additives and enzymes to deal with the effects of ethanol. As long as you can separate the water from the gasoline with a special filter, gasoline can last a long time with traditional additives. Without this separator, it needs additional treatment. Stabilizing gasoline does nothing for the effects of ethanol unless there are other additives added as well, either in the stabilizer or by you. Theoretically, gasoline in cool dry environments can last indefinitely even without stanilizer and if your fuel system is well sealed, so can the effects of ethanol be minimized without additives. I see no problem with that observation either. The problem is, over time, atmospheric conditons change and I would not trust an expensive car’s fuel system to past good luck.
Older well cared for gasoline has always run better in my equipment and cars then neglected gasoline.
Quoth wesw, 'quoth the raven, “nevermore” will I answer your questions’
Thanks.
Quoth the same mountainbike, '"As to the knuckleheads who’d buy it,"
Well, I guess I’m a knucklehead now, am I?'
No. You misunderstood. I don’t know anything about you - other than that you contribute usefully to this forum. I assumed you weren’t going to travel to Albuquerque to buy my truck. I referred to the people who have offered to buy my truck (unbidden) in Albuquerque, and explained that, because of how it looks, I’m unlikely to get a fair price or the buyer not run it into the ground.
Quoth VOLVO V70, 'Mr. Troll (name fits ) says he has only bought gas 20 times in the last 10 years . I don’t even know how many times I bought gas last month . '
My father recorded every gasoline purchase he made in a little notebook he kept in the glove compartment. It’s a tool of knowledge about how one’s car performs. I’ve recorded every purchase of gasoline I have made in my whole life. It helps nip problems in the bud.
Quoth cdaquila, 'I didn’t think anything of it when RandomTroll started this discussion, because he (I’m assuming) has started a number of threads over the last couple of years’
This is the first thread I’ve started in 3 years.
There are millions of people who think that high-octane gasoline has more energy in it, or burns hotter, or is cleaner, or better in some way other than self-igniting at a higher compression. Those are myths. All of the charges I’ve read and heard against bad gas were conjectures that no-one challenged; it’s become a piety, something people believe without investigating. I took the opportunity of passing an emissions test with 19-month-old gas as a bit of evidence against it. It wouldn’t surprise me if a Lamborghini had a different experience. Usually we post problems in this forum; I reported a non-problem.
There are millions of people who think that high octane gasoline has more energy in it
Then, there are those of us who believe that the ability of a gasoline to delay combustion by it’s higher octane content can allow the motor to extract more enegy per volume when the computer in most cars makes the necessary adjustments. It’s not whether higher octane gasoline has more energy, it has the potential to allow motors to extract more of energy that is already there.
It all depends upon where the gas was stored and under what conditons. A sealed container like a sealed fuel system in moderate to cool environments over time, is quite “gasoline friendly”.
@ok4450. …small engine shops are swamped in the spring time They would be other times as well but most small engines are used in the summer time. Snow mobiles and snow blowers are more suseptable to gas problems being stored in the SUMMER.
Small engines have poorly sealed fuel systems and the changeover of gasoline, even duing this peak running season, is much slower then cars. It’s theoretically possible for a chain saw to have been Only by the average owner and have some residual gas that is five or more years old. For that reason, I use Triufuel which has a shelf life of three plus years. It has never failed to start…even as long as three years with fewer then five pulls.
Looking at the $billions spent on lottery tickets and poured into slot machines in hopes of winning a big pay off doesn’t look worthwhile to me but spending $5 a couple of times each year for stabilizer to add to the gasoline that is used in yard equipment seems like a great investment. Gasoline left outside year round in plastic jugs will deteriorate in one year and fuel in an automobile fuel tank will eventually deteriorate. For a few dollars I’ll hopefully avoid the fru$tration.
Maybe I’ll feel lucky this summer and throw $20 in a slot machine though.
@dagosa, my point is that many, many people leave fuel in their mowers, edgers, chainsaws, lawn tractors, Weedeaters, etc through the winter.
When springtime rolls around they drag them out of storage and then wonder why they won’t start.
Best to dump it in the fall and add fresh in the spring.
RT, I accept your explanation, but I also have to point out that the terminology you use and the way you describe others shows distain and disrespect for them. That to me is sad.
As to your assertion that gas doesn’t go bad, that there’s no such thing as “bad gas” anymore, the evidence that gas does in fact “go bad” is overwhelming. Most of the people here have opened up a carburetor that hasn’t been used in a long time and seen the evidence themselves.
Let me ask you a simple question: are you aware that gasoline evaporates into the air? Are you aware that gasoline is not 100% hydrocarbon molecules? Do you believe that the entire content of the chemical mix evaporates 100% together? If not, do you accept that it leaves a residue?
If your claim is that “bad gas” is blamed for far more trouble than it actually is responsible for, I wholeheartedly agree. If your claim is that gasoline actually is more stable and lasts longer than usually claimed, I can accept that. I’ve personally used gas over a year old successfully. The exception would be gasoline in yard equipment. The volumes are small, the tanks vented, and the fuel systems very subject to contamination and/or residue of fuel whose HC molecules have been evaporating for months, so any changes would have much more effect.
But if your claim is that “bad gas” doesn’t exist, or that gasoline doesn’t lose the volatility that makes it useful, the evidence is way too overwhelming for me to agree. “Bad gas” does happen. And gasoline does “go bad”. For these purposes I would define “going bad” as losing through evaporation too much of its HC content to be usable as a motor fuel and also leaving behind residue that gums up fuel systems. The process by which it does so is a combination of evaporation and stratification. Over enough time, the stuff we don’t want, like sulpher, stays in the bowl as gump and eventually a varnish-like coating when the HC leaves with the air. I won’t speak to chemical changes, that being any actual changes in the molecular structures that make up the gasoline. I’m not a chemist.
I’ve seen some aged “bad gas” as it’s called in which a small sample would ignite very, very slowly when a match was applied or not even ignite at all.
I made a reference in the past to a project car I had in which the fresh gas went “bad” inside of 6 months on a restored fuel system. A cup of that stuff sitting in the driveway would not even burn when a torch was applied.
I don’t use fuel stabilizer but I store my generator, lawn mowers, snowblowers, rototiller , chainsaw and string trimmer dry. Actually, now that I think of it the two strore stuff does have fuel stabilizer in it because I use Sthil 2 stroke oil and it has fuel stabilizer in it.
I had 10 gallons of “mower gas” that I overbought when a blizzard was expected here and I thought I was going to have to use my generator. The power never flickered and I used that gas for over 2 years with no problems. I also had a van that sat for well over a year without running and only about a quarter tank of gas in it. I had to move the van and it started right up and ran fine. It was carbureted too.
My conclusion personally is that gas doesn’t go bad as fast as most people think, but I really, really think you’re pushing your luck if you have a vehicle with a tiny quantity of gas in it and let it set for a long period. (think how good that last inch of coffee in the pot is after setting) If you’re going to park a vehicle for a long time, I’d keep the tank full. With a full tank, if some of the gas degrades, it’s only a small percentage of the total quantity. Also, less empty space in the tank means less gas can vaporise and less air can get in to react with the gas. Any nasty residue that accumulates from degrading gasoline is also going to be diluted by the larger overall quantity of gas present, which may prevent problems.
Some gasoline companies additive packages may be better than others too. Lower octane gas may be less resistant to degrading than higher-octane, as there are probably less volatiles in it.
This last summer I had to siphon the gas from a Motorcycle that had sat for a year or more. I spilled some on the shop floor and it covered an area about the size of a volley ball. That spill smelled so bad that I thought that I’d just burn it off. I lit my little propane torch and it would not even ignite that old gas.
It may have something to do with the way it’s stored. or the quality of gas. Some seems to be usable a year later…and some not.
Yosemite
@ok4450.
You get no disagreement with me whatsoever on your keen observations. I just wanted to expand on your thoughts. Small engines have accumulated problems even during the season they are used. Just letting a lawn mower sit for several weeks in the hot summer shed over several mowings where the gas is not used completly can, add to the problem over the winter. Some of the summer gas left in the can can be much older. There is only one sure fire way to manage the fuel systems of small motors for storage. Running it dry only is not enough imo as there is always residual old gas in the system. Detach the tank and dump out the gas, run the carb dry, then pour in fresh, non ethanhol stabilized gasoline you gan run through tthe carb. Let it sit with this gas in the carb to keep seals from drying out. You should store these mtors with gasoline in the system…but with good stuff. I use Trufuel which has a storage life of several years. After being charged $2300 for the carb(s) repair of an expensive outboard, I use this systems for all my motors instead just leave it in a nd pray. I refuse to pay that amount and “negotiated” it down to $700 due to thier ineptness. But it does show you how expensive these things can be to fix.
My $2000 Yamaha gas generator was particular vulnerable to ethanol contamination and you can’t afford problems when you need it. My solution ? I went to propane as did my son in law after my advice. They are marvelous !!! I have a small work 3500 watt gasoline generator but I dump and Truefuel after every use. I will never again recomend a gas house generator. Chain saws, hedgers and trimmers only see Truefuel.
When I do a few laps around the island in front of my house in the fall before winter storage with the Truefuel in the system, it’s like my outboards suddenly had several more horsepower. That shows you how crappy regular gasoline has become.