Nothing against being safety conscious but I just don’t expect to have many accidents. My efforts go into making sure I don’t have a bad accident or minimizing the impact, rather than expecting to have one. The people I have known who were killed in a car accident wouldn’t have survived in anything or didn’t use the simple seat belt to keep them in the car. I rode home 50 miles with the tow truck through Minneapolis traffic and the guy didn’t put his seat belt on. When talking about it he said that his Ford (I think it was) would push the steering column right into him in a front crash. So he was ready at any point to flatten himself in the seat to avoid the spear. Couldn’t do that with a belt on.
jtsanders I am a 1952 model. As a little kid I stood between my Mom and Dad on the front seat so I could see outside. At night I would lay on the rear parcel shelf and gaze at the moon and stars. I rode in the back of pickups. I owned quite a few vehicles with no seatbelts but they were equipped with steel dashboards and a steering post that could have been used to harpoon Moby Dick! Every vehicle I have owned with seatbelts they have always been used. In about 2005 I went to lunch with a 21 year old co-worker in his Acura Integra. The “Click it or Ticket” law was in effect. As I buckled up he pulled his seat/shoulder belt across and hooked his thumb in it while holding it on the side of his seat. This was obviously to make it appear that he was wearing the belt. His Acura was a manual which made it far more difficult than just clicking the belt. I asked why he would do that? His answer “seatbelts are for wimps”! About a week later we went to lunch in my car. He tried the same thing. Hey! My car. My rules. I informed him if he was riding in my car he would have to be a wimp. He buckled up. Youth is wasted on the young!
B.L.E. I made gunpowder as a kid. Potassium nitrate, sulfur, and charcoal. I made it outside.
I sometimes wonder whether the original post is about our young teen drivers having fun driving “any car they damn well please” , or examples of a frustrated youth on the part of those who think it’s OK. .
I can’t say our kids were given the best advice growing up and driving in our family but both love to drive today, have had no accidents…other then bumping into their own car in the drive.
They were weened on low powerd four cylinders and preached and practiced good driving decisions as teens.
I saw it all the time otherwise…give the kid what they want so they stay out of your hair, using cars as baby sitters…or give the kid a car they wanted too. They allow the child to make decisions instead of doing the right thing and exercising parental authority in making good choices. There is no reason for a capable teen making poor grades academically and still being allowed use the family car like a toy.
One example of a poor choice that works out does not make it the right choice and that’s what we most hear from “proponents of permissiveness” . I see too many parents exercising their right to do nothing but allow their poor driving decisions to be passed down to their kids. This happens for one reason only. They were lucky enough to have survived. Statistically, it often catches up with the kids. I knew a parent who had a history of drinking and driving and thought it was OK for their kids to go through the same experience. You have to be ,;$&@ kidding me. This is not an unusual theme in promoting poor lifetime drivers.
Allowing a kid to drive a safer car with a good safety rating is no guarantee. But it is a sane decision born out of concern that should be accompanied by insistence on good driving. It should be applauded and not ridiculed as taken by itself, it teachers the child good automotive choices. Our kids will be driving our grandchildren around…
I’ve been thinking a little more about the increase in safety equipment in our vehicles. I don’t think it is so much about the public as about insurance companies. The IIHS drives changes in auto safety equipment and they reduce death and injuries. This in turn reduces their payouts, and increases profits. There is certainly an altruistic aspect, but money plays a part too.
My original post wasn’t about teen drivers specifically, and whether permissiveness is a good or bad thing is a different discussion completely. My original intent/question was eloquently explained by @ccatx in his reply. When shopping for a car, the first thing he does is look at safety and crash ratings. If a car is not at the top of the class for safety, it is out of the running, even though the car may satisfy all of his other needs. That’s the thought process I have a hard time understanding.
If I were shopping for a new car today, I would make a decision based in affordability, practicality, styling, comfort, reliability, and maintenance costs. Safety would fall behind all these. If I found a car that met the first 6 criteria and had a horrible crash rating I would still buy it. Because I don’t need the crash safety.
I need it to be affordable because I’ll have make the payment every month. I need it to be practical and comfortable because it needs to haul groceries, soccer and baseball gear, and an extra kid or two easily twice a week and go on vacations. I need it to look good because I’ll have to look at and drive the thing every day. I need it to be reliable and have reasonable maintenance costs for obvious reasons. I don’t need it to do well in a 35mph offset frontal crash because that’s not going to happen to me. I’m not being oblivious to danger or feeling invincible. Just stating that the chances of it happening are almost zero.
It seems as though we are putting the greatest emphasis on protecting ourselves from the things that are least likely to happen.
When shopping for a car, the first thing he does is look at safety and crash ratings. If a car is not at the top of the class for safety, it is out of the running, even though the car may satisfy all of his other needs. That's the thought process I have a hard time understanding.
Especially when you consider the fact that I have yet to see anyone driving on the street dress up in a crash helmet, fireproof suit and gloves, and have 5-point harnesses replacing the seat belts in their cars.
Just to veer off topic a little but I don’t care how old I get, I will be the one deciding what car I will drive, not my son, bless his heart.
Hear about the 7 year old in LA that got killed by an ice cream truck. The kid was riding his electric cycle along side the truck. Then they attacked the driver for killing the kid. It was rumored that one of the attackers was the mother. The mother should have been the one attacked for allowing a 7 year old to have and drive one on the street.
@Bing; Last I heard the mother stated that the cycle was non-operational and he was just dragging it alongside him; either way, what a bad loss. On the same day a nine yr old was hit by stray bullets in a park while playing with her friends. So sad.
@asemaster; I assumed you are addressing parents attitude towards kids. It is probably because my 18 yr old has just gotten her DL. I was actually somewhat pleased that they failed her on the 1st take (even though it wasn’t fair); I think she now appreciates the license even more. She is off to college and not driving, but on some level I know any car I get would be driven by her (as I am not buying a “new” car for her), so even though me and my wife have survived a lot of crappy cars (1st airbag in 2003), I think I want to use the new safety features to her advantage. She doesn’t drive stick yet, so I might get a beater for myself.
@Bing
That is sad about the kid
Anyways, I often see teenagers riding those electric scooters in traffic . . . the ones that aren’t even legally permitted on the street. They’re endangering themselves, and everybody else. And of course, they’re not wearing a helmet, or wearing clothing which is easy to see
I sure hope nobody gets hurt
And Another Thing.
I Have A 27 Year-0ld Son & (almost 20 Year-Old Daughter) That Made It Through Those Dangerous Early Couple Of Years That Every New Inexperienced Driver Must Go Through And Hopefully Emerge.
Don’t think newer drivers are more at risk than others? Ask my insurance agent or check the history on my insurance premiums or check your own.
Newer drivers make mistakes. It’s part of the process. I understand that. I was a beginning driver and beginning pilot at one time.
My kids were both very cautious and mature. They understood that a time would come after they got a good education and career, for them to pick out a cool car, cool everything. But they trusted their good old dad and his spark of wisdom to get them there. I picked large, fairly safe cars with lots of airbags, ABS, etcetera.
Son’s got a Masters, good job, bought a house. He’ll pick out a new car, his choice, when he feels the need. Daughter’s in college, tough science/math classes, took my wife’s car back to school with her in August so she can concentrate on studies, the important thing to her.
We’re driving Daughter’s car. Spoiled kids? No. Responsible kids? No Complaints. Do the kids wish they drove sports cars when they were 16? Maybe, but they couldn’t have afforded the choice and it would have left nothing to look forward to/work toward. Have they got complaints of me? No. Not about any of that stuff, anyhow.
FWIW, Several years ago my wife and I, in fairly short period of time, were crashed into 3 times while legally stopped and 3 times had our cars totaled. My kids have both hit/been hit deer. They are thick here. I live in the trees basically, 20 miles from town. Our driving records attest to the fact that we’re pretty good at it, but accidents can find you, even if you’re stopped at a draw-bridge waiting for it to open, believe me.
I guess that’s why I am cautious “afraid” and protective of my family.
CSA
“B.L.E. I made gunpowder as a kid. Potassium nitrate, sulfur, and charcoal. I made it outside.”
I’m sure you’ve heard about the guy who brushed his teeth with gunpowder. He went around shooting his mouth off!
Sorry.
CSA
My son was pretty responsible. He was assigned my 86 Riviera in high school. I learned some years later that he ended up putting it in the ditch somewhere one night. Went and got a farmer to pull him out. Nothing damaged I guess. Maybe he cleaned the weeds out. No air bags in that one. I do hope he was responsible enough to pay the farmer for use of his tractor though.
@ sgtrock21
B.L.E. I made gunpowder as a kid. Potassium nitrate, sulfur, and charcoal. I made it outside.
Did you actually get the stuff to explode? When I tried to make it, it mostly just fizzled and made huge clouds of smoke, but then as a kid I didn’t realize that the recipe for the ingredients were by weight and not volume so I made a pretty unbalanced mixture with way too much saltpeter.
Later, we learned we could make “rocket fuel” by mixing sodium chlorate (weed killer) with table sugar. It made huge clouds of smoke that smelled like caramel.
a little tongue in cheek…or not…
@bscar2
May as well stay in the house, and barricade the doors and windows
Then set up your lazy-boy a few feet behind the front door
Sit down with your loaded 12 gauge, just in case anybody makes it through the door
Totally right . But with cars, unlike politicians and bears who really spend most of their time keeping away from humans, people drive feet away from you on undivided highways with closing speeds of at least 110 mph with speed limits of 55 mph. They are often tuning the radio, texting and talking while weaving in and out of your lane or coming up in you from behind while you wait to turn. Unlike political propaganda, these drivers are to be “feared” and prepared for with good choices to at least give you a shot at survival. To call that unnecessary fear is not something I am prepared to do.
I don’t own a shotgun. Couple Mosin Nagants, a Tavor, and a couple other rifles, and my CCW handgun. 
I’ve heard on CNN and Fox(the only TV stations they switch between, weekly, at work and the only TV news I watch) both talk about the ebola scare/pandemic/whatever and what we can do to stop it. My advice to them all, stop talking about it 23/7(gotta have an hour of other news in there somewhere) and/or just shut the TV off.
Fear is a natural emotion; We can choose to learn from it or let it control our lives. It also brings in TV ratings for the news channels if they make you afraid of something so you’ll pay more attention to them for more information about this new fear.
Yep, the same people we can’t get to obey speed limits and stop texting behind the wheel are scared to death of ebola, terrorists, and child kidnappers. That’s the power of sensationalistic news media.
Remember when parents just let their kids walk or bike to school, without escorting them? There is a route to work that I don’t take when school is open because of the traffic jam of mommies dropping off their kids at the front door of the school.
“Remember when parents just let their kids walk or bike to school…”
That’s when every neighbor hood or two had an elementary school. Over the years, they discovered it was cheaper to have kids bussed across town to one large school. Now, in our town, if you want your 3 rd grader 8 year old to ride his/her bike to school around here, they will have to bike 6 miles over city streets, through a dozen lights, bad neighborhoods, cross two 55 mph highways and pray it doesn’t snow cause it’s way too far to walk.
Times they have changed and school logistics have too. Now schools have to keep the at risk kid and not kick them out but provide an education for everyone by law. Their facilities are large and complex to provide everyone with the techno guy they need and they can’t be in every neighborhood. It has less to do with attitude then it does logistics as to why why kids “take a bus” and can’t just walk. They all take the bus or have mommy drop them off. It’s a transportation nightmare and the norm in many towns in the USA.