A couple of points here. One is that Harleys are suffocated by the intake and exhaust system to the tune of about a 15% power loss. This is one reason why many HD riders modify them, although a few do it for sheer noise. My feeling is that if someone felt their car was suffering a 15% power loss then they would modify it quickly also.
Second is this. If some guy across the street is making multiple passes up and down the street all day, and night, long then you have a problem. However, I think a lot of these complaints are selective if you want to call it that, and here is an example.
I live in a rural area now but used to live in-town. Over the years I have seen a number of âletters to the editorâ complaining about loud motorcycles and have seen a few people appear at city council meetings to gripe about the issue.
In every case, I looked up their name in the phone book or internet and they all lived on the west side of this town, which is predominantly more affluent than the east side.
Hereâs the kicker. The Air Force base is 2 miles directly south and all of these housing divisions are directly under the flight patterns. NONE of these people complain about pilot training going on which runs from 5 to 7 days a week, and sometimes until 11 or 12 at night.
Thereâs a constant parade of low altitude T-38s, T-1s, and the ânewâ T-6 Texan, which has replaced the obnoxiously shrill and now retired T-37 Tweet. The T-6 is just as obnoxiously loud due to the fact itâs a turboprop.
On top of the trainers based there (you should hear a T-38 in full burner taking off) there is also a parade of airplanes passing through on their way to various places. If you think a T-38 is loud you should hear F-15E Strike Eagles, B-1s, F-16s, etc. blasting off. The entire city is shaking and often one can hear a jet still nailing it 10 minutes later.
My mother in law lives directly under the northern approach and when a C-5 (the aluminum overcast) is landing at about 500 feet altitude right over her house conversation stops momentarily.
See my point? How can these people complain about an occasional loud motorcycle when the bikes are drowned out by aircraft?
One or two loud motorcycles a day bothers them but 15 hours a day of constant turboprop howl and jet engines in full afterburner do not?
This issue is bigger than just mufflers. Harley engines are designed to produce a certain ânoteâ and decibel level. The pistons are also to move in a way to produce a certain vibration level. The issue is that will any government agency take it upon themselves to change that.
Here is where I would take a stand. I have a legal bike, registered and inspected. No one can stop me from riding on any public roadway. I would love to know where this town is because I would go out of my way to drive through there and pray they would cite me.
Amen, brother! I would like to see stricter enforcement of the rules that are allegedly in place, but never enforced. Big bike riders are getting a free pass and degrading the public commons.
Waul McMahan, Redding California
Obviously, no town can arbitrary ban specific types of vehicles on public roads (with certain exceptions, such as weight limits). That would be similar to banning all blue cars. Some towns can and do choose to measure and enforce noise limits, and they can certainly cite you for not having a DOT approved muffler on a bike or a car.
However, I have seen private communities that have posted restrictions on motorcycles. These are roads that a paid for and maintained by the community, similar to gated communities that choose to exclude non-residents. I assume it is legal for them the keep out motorcycles and they would probably be able to call the local police and cite you if you rode through their neighborhood.
Harleys come with quiet mufflers from the factory. Harley dealers sell 10 or 15 aftermarket systems ranging from reasonably quiet to straight pipes, whatever you wantâŠLegal mufflers all have a DOT registration number on them. In Colorado, if that number can not be found, you get a ticket. If you ignore the ticket, you canât renew the registration without paying it, and the penalties, and having the bike inspected by a police officer as being legal and signed off. A BIG hassle. So around here, the number of straight pipe bikes has been dramatically reduced.
Colorado is a âno helmetâ state, so that by itself has reduced outlaw bikers significantlyâŠ
I understand and agree that bikes are not the only (or worst) noise polluters. Noise is one of the many reasons I would not choose to live near a military base, an airport, or other industrial facility. However, HDs inability to design an adequate exhaust system for their own engines is not a sufficient reason to use âoff-roadâ only equipment on the street. It is pretty obvious that the harley after-market would provide DOT approved systems if the current laws were enforced. It is my understanding (from my harley riding friends) that these DOT exhaust systems are becoming available in greater numbers because some areas are actually enforcing the law.
Personally, I find rice rockets with âracingâ exhausts more offensive than a harley with anything short of straight pipes. They can also claim a performance gain, but Iâm not sure anyone really needs to increase the performance of a modern 150 mph bike for street use. OTOH, my R80 could use a little performance help. (-;
People who want the laws and the enforcement agencies to stop others who are intentionally aggrevating them needlessly by intentionally making a raket are not whiners. Theyâre simply people using the systems for exactly what those systems are intended to do in a civilized society.
If you intentionally make a racket and someone complains to the authorities, donât blame the complainant. Blame yourself.
Ok4450, on this issue I strongly disagree with you. And would add that those that refuse to comply with laws regulating these issues such that society can remain civilized are themslves the ones that need to grow up. If those who call the authorities instead confronted those making the racket, society would quickly become a violent free-for-all. It might be fun, but it definitely would be uncivilized.
Delray Beach, Florida was going to try it a few weeks ago. Cooler heads prevailed. Iâve heard of other communities that either proposed or enacted motorcycle bans. As far as I know they all got knocked down or rescinded, so far . . .
People used to go across the US with 500cc BMWs. I owned one that was as quiet, if not quieter than any car. With that in mind, to state that a Harley with a much larger engine has its power penalized by a muffler is not a valid argument in my view. Also, most people do not live near airports and those that do, knew the consequences before they bought or else could not anticipate.
Noise from motorcycles and other sources such as small airplanes, lawnmowers with no muffler, and large trucks with bad mufflers or straightpipes are a quality of life issue similar to other things that can be repaired such as air pollution. It will happen; noise abatement is on the way. Part of the evidence to me is the OP. Such a post has been rare if non-existent in the past. I am glad to see that undesirable and unwelcome environmental noise is finally becoming an issue.
There sure seems to be a lot of anti-Harley comments on this thread. What I would like to know is how many of you actually own, or have owned, a Harley? Add your name to the list.
Comments about HDs being broken down all the time is utter rubbish and is an old myth that was started back in the 70s by the Honda crowd. A gentleman up north (Wisconsin) has a 1947 HD knucklehead and I believe he has an honest half a million miles on it.
Iâve ridden HDs on cross-country road trips with no more problems than a crummy load of gas and a flat tire; neither of which is the bikeâs fault.
Harleys are âdesignedâ to be loud and âdesignedâ to vibrate? Ridiculous. Their exhaust is designed to muffle that large displacment engine as much as possible and even then itâs a power killer.
As to vibration, HDs have a ârumpety-rumpetyâ sound at IDLE. They do have a vibration to them at IDLE. Itâs an air-cooled engine and is not designed to sit and idle. Itâs made to be moving and in HDs case, itâs made to be an open road bike.
If anyone knew anything about Harleys they would know the engine design was done to allow large displacment in a compact space. In the interest of simplicity, even back 90 years ago, they used a single set of points that fired both plugs in the âwasted sparkâ system.
Front cylinder fires, 315 degrees later the rear fires, followed 405 degrees later by the front one again. Itâs an irregular firing order so of course itâs going to have a shake at idle. To think the vibration is put there on purpose is ludicrous.
Ride a new Softail or Road King up to 80 MPH and then tell me how much vibration there is.
I have yet to see a comment regarding my statements about someone being âselectively offendedâ by a Harley as compared to the local air base.
Two minutes of noisy Harley is irritating but 15 hours straight of very low altitude jets and turboprops are not?
Are you equally offended by your neighborâs yapping dog, leaf blower, screaming kids, or the kid across the street with a riced out Honda Civic (see, leaf blower). If so, have you complained to them or the city about this? If not, why?
âI have yet to see a comment regarding my statements about someone being âselectively offendedâ by a Harley as compared to the local air base.
Two minutes of noisy Harley is irritating but 15 hours straight of very low altitude jets and turboprops are not?
Are you equally offended by your neighborâs yapping dog, leaf blower, screaming kids, or the kid across the street with a riced out Honda Civic (see, leaf blower). If so, have you complained to them or the city about this? If not, why?â
I have nothing against harleys, I even think some of them look pretty nice. I donât particually want to own one (I donât buy american made vehicles anyway). I understand why they were originally designed that way, and that the sound was originally a byproduct of the non-symetrical design. I also understand that they have done everything thay can to maintain that design (including the sound) because that is part of their appeal. I also have no problem with the sound of a harley or any other bike with a stock (or at least street legal) exhaust. I have never put an off-road exhaust on any street bike/car myself. I am actually more anoyed by most of the other sources of noise polution you listed. I would not choose to live next door to them either (especially the âair baseâ).
ok4450, when I look back at the comments, I donât see anyone except the OP attacking Harleys. H-D came a long way in quality since the company was bought out by its workers from AMF. I donât prefer Harleys because they are more expensive than metric cruisers and in my opinion, they are not any better. They are unique, but these days it is hard to call them American-made when most of the parts come from China. I do like my H-D motorcycle boots (also made in China). If I had enough money to collect motorcycles, I would like to have a Harley in my collection, but since I can only afford one, I think my Honda Shadow Aero gives me more for my money. It is a smooth-running liquid-cooled v-twin, which I like.
Harley riders get a bad rap because ther are a lot of cruiser (both metric and H-D) riders that install custom (loud) exhaust systems. Most of the people who complain donât know the difference. A lot if people who donât know any better look at my Honda Shadow and think it is a Harley because it is styled like an American cruiser. So when a loud customized Kawasaki Vulcan or a Yamaha V Star blows by, you might hear some ignorant person say âThose darn Harleys should be outlawed!â
The truth is that, for the most part, those who install custom pipes enjoy antagonizing the old farts who donât know a Honda from a Harley. Go to any biker bar and see it for yourself. The local air base doesnât deliberately antagonize its neighbors. At Naval Air Station Jacksonville they schedule most of their exercises during the day. My neighbor doesnât make his dog bark deliberately. He might be inconsiderate, but he doesnât deliberately amplify his dogâs bark seeking attention. This may not be true of you, but I bet you know at least one jerk who enjoys annoying people with his loud pipes. I have personally met more of them than I can count on my fingers and toes. So donât act like you are being personally persecuted. The âloud pipesâ croud, for the most part, covet the negative attention that they get for their loud pipes. You know itâs true.
In regards to the air base no one has a choice. The entire city and outlying area is blanketed by the flight pattern; at least the short pattern. The long pattern goes out for a 100 miles. The area south of the base is open farmland with a few houses.
However, no matter which way those T-38s take off, even south, the afterburners can be heard for miles. When a heavy duty plane like a B-1 or F-15 nails it then those can be heard when theyâre 20-30 miles out.
My point is that a number of people in town complain about a few minutes of motorcycle mufflers and yet have no objection to day and night rumbling caused by aircraft. If they can tolerate 24/7 airplanes then why so upset over a bike?
They also seem to have no problem tolerating the noise from oil field equipment passing through on the highway and much of this equipment is horribly unbaffled. Some even drowns out the airplanes.
I own 2 Harleys, old ones, and both are louder than new ones even with original mufflers. One is a 50+ year old police bike with the original police muffler (along with siren, red lamps, and speedometer lock) on it. Should this bike be ticketed for excessive noise?
Speaking for myself, I do not like straight pipes and some of the guys who use them are doing it for nothing more than to be noticed. If they get a ticket, so be it. I just donât agree that modifying a muffled exhaust system to gain a bit more power, even if it causes a bit more rumble, is a reason to want them all legislated and ticketed off the road.
I would much rather listen to a deep rumble from an HD than my neighborâs leaf blower, which runs for hours while he vaccums up a truckload of leaves from his maple tree.
If someone has a neighbor next door or across the street running a straight pipe Harley day and night then I donât blame them for being upset. In that case, call the police.
Hell with Harleys! How about those with the jacked up 4X4âs with the so-called performance exhaust systems? All they do is perform noise. They donât add anything to performance.
I get a kick out of those people. Youâre driving down the freeway and one comes rumbling along side you in the next lane. Then they hit the gas, and the engine roars like hell, and they gain like 5 MPH in speed. I just drop my 4 cylinder Nissan pickup in 4th gear, and keep right up with them. And I can still hear my stereo.
Jeremy, I agree with you that there is a percentage of HD riders who run straight pipes as an attention getter; or âprofilingâ as itâs called. I know many HD owners who have modified their exhaust, along with carburetion, intakes, etc. and very few of them were doing it for attention. They were doing it to squeeze that choked down performance out of them.
A friend of mine ran straights for about 3 weeks in an attempt to dial in a âtoo much carburetorâ situation (Dual Throat Dellorto) that he was told about from the get-go. He finally converted to a decent carb and added mufflers.
I do respectfully disagree that the AMF and prior bikes were junk. The majority of problems were owner inflicted by owners with no mechanical ability who spent their time tinkering with something they knew nothing about. Iâve owned several AMF era bikes and one of them was the bike I mentioned riding cross-country and my best friend was putting 40k miles a YEAR on an AMF Sportster, and getting 60 MPG doing it. I donât remember if I mentioned it, but a guy up north has a '47 knucklehead with an honest half a million miles on it.
Tester has a great point as usual. For every noisy Harley you hear, how many noisy trucks are running around? I hear a noisy HD about once every week or so, maybe, but I hear trucks all day long, every single day.
I was down at my sonâs house last week looking his Camaro over (whacked by a moron who made a left turn across 3 lanes of traffic) and one of those noisy trucks went by. I have no idea what kind of exhaust he had on this truck, but it was ârappingâ loud; VERY loud. My son and I honestly could not hear each other talk and we both had to plug our ears.
That truck was louder than any Harley Iâve ever heard in my life, straight pipes or muffled.
My point is that if someone is seriously and honestly enough bothered by an occessaional noisy Harley that it irritates them to the bone and they want legislation, then why not feel the same way about riced out Honda Civics, the noisy trucks as mentioned, and leaf blowers/chain saws? I hear way more of those than noisy Harleys.
Maybe thereâs something Iâm not getting here, but I canât see as how someone who lives under a perpetual parade of jet aircraft taking off can complain about Harley exhaust pipes. The only thing it can be is that theyâre âselectively offendedâ. Theyâre conditioned to the aircraft noise, the norm, and the HD exhaust is abnormal, if not near as loud.