Where are the Diesels?

Urea? I just know I’m gonna hate myself for asking this, but where do they get the urea from?

Good question, I did find this on one of the websites:

“AdBlue is a made from a chemical called urea (sometimes called carbamide) dissolved in pure water. Urea is a synthetic product, generally manufactured from natural gas, and is used in chemical fertilizers, plastics, and cosmetics. AdBlue is not made from recycled agricultural products.”

They are legal. You just can’t buy them in the state new. It’s been this way for a few years now. A good friend of mine is a mechanic at a VW dealership; they can’t sell any, but they can service them. In 2008 we should be ok though.

As far as not being able to buy diesel cars blame states like California with their ridiculous environmental laws .

That’s because they have ridiculous polution…thus the ridiculous laws…I don’t know about you…but prefer breathing air…not polution.

It would seem the “Bluetec” emissions system and the need to “Adblue” (urea) to keep it operating, plus the need for high-priced fuel, will surely put a damper on diesel sales in the U.S.

Diesel is way higher in price compared to regular

Where do you live…

Right outside my window at work…Massachussetts

Unleaded - $2.75
Plus - $2.90
Super - $3.10
Diesel - $2.88

That sounds about right for this time of year (home heating oil in the east), diesel prices are someplace between regular and premium. I guess that sounds expensive if you happen to own a car that uses regular gasoline. In most cases the price difference in the fuel will be more than offset by the mileage difference. The real issue is the payback of the initial purchase price difference. If a diesel (with all the current emission stuff) ends up costing $5000 more than a similar gasser it will be difficult to justify (at least on a low end car).

That sounds about right for this time of year (home heating oil in the east), diesel prices are someplace between regular and premium.

During the spring when gas prices had stabilized a little…Diesel was CHEAPER then regular unleaded…almost .30/gal.

True, but diesel had been about the same or higher than regular for the previous couple of years. It’s anyones guess which will go up the fastest in the future.

How often does the urea reservoir need to be filled, and how much will it cost? Is this something that anyone could do, or will it be a dealer-installed canister that costs $150 every year or so?

You asked a very good question! Because this is another problem.

In order for the SCR system to work, it must have urea. Those diesel vehicles on the road now must go to the dealer to have the urea tank filled. And yes, there is one! Has anyone seen an urea pump at the service station yet?

But the real problem is, if you put a lot of diesel vehicles on the road that require this urea in order to keep the emssions under control, how do you ensure that the urea tank is filled when it requires it? Do you make it so the engine doesn’t run if the urea tank empty? Like running out of fuel? I don’t think that’s going to fly!

So these are the issues the automakers are facing. And I don’t blame them for not jumping in with both feet when it comes to diesel powered vehicle, and the emission requirements that reach out to 2011.

Tester

In order for the SCR system to work, it must have urea. Those diesel vehicles on the road now must go to the dealer to have the urea tank filled. And yes, there is one! Has anyone seen an urea pump at the service station yet?

According to a recent Scientific American article (I think that’s where I saw it), the urea tank should last the life of an oil change (i.e., not something you’d do at every fillup).

But the real problem is, if you put a lot of diesel vehicles on the road that require this urea in order to keep the emssions under control, how do you ensure that the urea tank is filled when it requires it? Do you make it so the engine doesn’t run if the urea tank empty? Like running out of fuel? I don’t think that’s going to fly!

Hopefully there will be some sensor to prevent running the engine with no urea. You know that most people will conveniently “forget” to get the urea refilled when they go to a quick oil change place. Hey, why spend extra money on some stupid pollution control thingy? Unfortunate but true!

The tie in between Detroit Diesel and VM Motori is Roger Penske .

What I’d like to know is why Chrysler sells a diesel (Dodge) minivan in Europe but it is unavailable in the U.S. Are our emissions standards more restrictive? What gives?

To me, diesel is great for this reason: the potential for using alternative fuels is unmatched (ie. biodiesel and vegetable oil), and although this site doesn’t seem too hot on the idea (see alternative fuels link) I think it holds a lot of promise for the future. Lower emissions, renewable fuel, less dependence on foreign oil–it’s a win-win everyone should love (except, of course, Big Oil).

It isn’t air quality or politics, its economic. Diesels have higher production cost because of the larger engine block that is required for high compression ratios. This results in higher price tags. Consumers aren’t willing to pay a higher price tag so diesels are limited to production in areas that require long lifes, like semis. If the demand existed manufactures would produce the trucks.

Dodge does sell a Diesel van in the US, it’s the Sprinter. You can get a long and tall version that averages 25 mpg overall, 19 in town and 28 on the highway. My Airstream RV, which weighs 8,000 lbs, averages 22 mpg overall. The same RV on a Ford or Chevy platform averages 8 to 12 mpg. Think how much oil we could save if everyone moved to diesel powered vehicles.

That’s true…but since the 4Runner Diesel being sold in Europe gets 50% better gas mileage then my gas powered 4Runner. So Diesel gas prices would have to be OVER $4/gal for it NOT to be more expensive. At their current price it’s far cheaper to run a diesel.

The ideal solution to the diesel emissions problem is the Homogeneous Charge Compression Ignition, HCCI, engines. The technology is still under development, but I believe we will start to see these engines, at the very least in military applications, within a few years.

The NOx emissions are very low, due to low combustion temps. The CO and hydrocarbon emissions will still need to be dealt with, but can be easily handled with a catalytic converter.

When I filled up tonight in southern Minnesota, unleaded was $2.65 and diesel was $3.09. That’s a significant difference. Maybe different in other parts of the world, but that’s Minnesota.

Diesel distribution is set up for the trucking industry. The average truck can hold 150 gallons of diesel fuel. At 8 miles per gallon, a truck can go about 1,400 miles between fill-ups. The average car can only go about 300 miles between fill-ups. If I had a diesel car right now, I would have to drive way out of my way to buy fuel. However, I can get gasoline easily.

We need to expand diesel distribution before it becomes practical for everyday use.