Very simple, for most Urban & Suburban drivers a SUV is simply a replacement for the Station Wagon “Family Truckster” or the Minivan “Mommy Van” but with a much better image.
Marketed as a vehicle to “Take you into the Wilderness or to your Ski chalet” most of these vehicles actually spend almost of their time taking you to WalMart or the kids to the elementary school. Often based upon a less expensive sedan or minivan platform, these SUV’s offer the buyers the opportunity to become more profitable while offering worse mileage, handling, space and less features with no additional off-road performance or towing ability.
A station wagon can have better fuel economy, more roll over resistance, be less dangerous to others on the road, cause less damage to other’s bumpers in parking mishaps, possibly have better handling, and be short enough pull inside a garage with a rooftop carrier mounted.
Our duck boat slid right in the back of our 61 Chevy wagon. Stuck out a little but easy loading and unloading, and the guns and decoys fit right in the boat.
If you’re comparing a standard station wagon to a LARGE SUV, then I’ll agree. But that’s not true for mid to small SUVs. And I the station wagon my dad owned (Chevy Impala) wouldn’t fit in my Garage.
As a kid I used to watch the canning factory ceo drive buy every night in his 61 Chevy impala wagon. The guys that worked with the experimental plots a mile away got new Chevy wagons each year too but they were the biscayne model. The impala and biscayne were essentially the same except for interiors and maybe springs, full wheel covers, whitewalls, auto trans, power steering, etc. maybe they had v8 s. Our biscayne fit in the garage but it was tight.
I remember the first-generation RAV4. Around here, in southern AZ, they still exist, though any time one comes on the used car market, it’s got over 200,000 miles on it. The styling of this generation still turns heads, more than 25 years later!
In 2003 this daddy wanted an SUV to replace our Windstar. I liked the Trailblazer and test drove one. While on the test drive the salesman asked who the car was for. I said my wife and that she wanted another minivan. He suggested I get her what she wanted, and we bought a 2003 Silhouette. That was a great minivan for us. It rode like a limousine. We liked the utility of the minivan so much that we bought an Odyssey to replace it.
Our daughter bought a Pilot and we’ve noticed that it is considerably less roomy for both people and cargo. Her two sons are still in car seats. Whenever the six of us go someplace together, she crawls into the rear seat through the back hatch. That wouldn’t be necessary in a minivan.
Agree completely. I am likely to replace my truck with a minivan in the near future. I don’t tow anymore and a minivan can carry a 4x8 sheet of plywood or 2x4s.
We suggested a minivan for my brother’s family, the Pacifica worked fine as a vacation rental but their Sequoia meets all the needs and wants except for MPG, they use the Legacy wagon around town as much as possible. Got the “you and what army?” response to a minivan along with not a chance in hades.
While the rear row folds flat, the middle row has to be removed to fit big stuff in. Those middle row captain’s chairs are heavy. A roof rack would solve that. We had a roof rack on the Silhouette but not on the Odyssey.
That is useful information! I was considering a used Toyota Sienna or Odysee. The Honda has a timing belt and the Toyota a chain and they sell for the same money at about 90K miles. The cost of a timing belt should drop the price $2K but nooo.
I am not sure but I think the Sienna rear seats all fold flat… not into the floor flat, but platform for a sheet of plywood flat. Maybe another forum member can confirm or deny that?
They Ody seat backs fold forward and you’d have to lay the long stuff on the seat backs. The Chrysler/Dodge products are the only ones with fold into the floor seats in the middle row. The Pacific hybrid uses the floor stowage area for the hybrid batteries. I test drove a Pacifica hybrid (and not hybrid) and liked them a lot. We trusted the Honda to be more reliable and bought it. We didn’t look at the Sienna in 2019 because it was a very old design. MY2021 was the first year of the 4th generation. Our neighbor has a 4G Sienna and she likes it a lot. I think it’s hybrid only.
I’m a holdout for driving a mid-sized sedan because it’s what works best for me. But I did test drive and seriously consider multiple small and mid-sized SUVs when car shopping in the past. And if I ever need to buy another vehicle I will again look at SUVs along with sedans.
I only need a reliable, comfortable ride that can haul groceries and commute to work on a daily basis. Mid-sized sedans have a longer wheel base and therefore smoother ride than small SUVs.
The same ride and cargo capacity I find easiest for me has cost less to buy and operate in my mid-sized sedans than it would have to get a mid-sized SUV.
But I have noticed over the years the increasing prevalence of pickups and SUVs and the comparative decrease of minivans and sedans on the road.
I have a 2012 Ody and can attest to the weight of the seats. However, that’s why they are like a living room couch for long trips I don’t have trouble lifting them out but there is a learning curve on the most efficient way to liberate them from the latches. I just took both seats and the center console out to bring an e bike home in it. Takes me minutes to do. I would make it an equivalent effort to put sheets of plywood on the top with roof racks as to remove the seats.
I have driven home with the rear hatch open before. Honda makes this extremely aggravating as the alarm constantly sounds the entire time. At least my GM barks for a bit and gives up figuring you’ve been warned.
One thing I hate about the Ody is the VCM contributes to significant vibration felt in the vehicle. My wife isn’t bothered by it but it’s almost intolerable to me. It’s worse with the windows closed. I’d suggest any car guy ride in the van and pay close attention to when the ECO light comes on
Another gripe is the mileage. It’s nowhere near the advertised mileage, even when it was new. I think the mileage I do get is reasonable for the size and weight but irks me they had some extremely optimistic (unrealistic) numbers when we were shopping for it.
Seems my lean towards the Sienna is a good one. I have driven a couple vehicles with VCM (or their alphabit) and thentransition is pretty noticeable… and annoying! The 4th Gen only being a hybrid sounds like a bonus.
I share your approach and recently purchased a small SUV.
As expected the midsized sedan provided more a more comfortable ride, more seating space and more cargo space, except for bulky items.
What surprised me though was that the V6 sedan actually got slightly better MPG than the 4 cylinder, AWD SUV.
My conclusion is that around town, either of the vehicles are fine but for a longer trip I prefer the comfort of the sedan. And for those occasions when I need to haul sheetrock, plywood, mulch, etc., better to rent a pickup and let someone else deal with the scratches and mess.
I’ve been driving a sedan for years but now have an suv in addition. The suv only hauls cargo on a trip. My sedan has fold down rear seats now so I can haul 8 or 10 foot lumber with a minimum sticking out the trunk. I am limited to about 30 landscape blocks at a time which is rarely a problem. When I need to haul plywood, tree limbs, furniture, etc., I use my small trailer set up for a 2000# payload. I have moved my whole belongings including appliances twice, with nothing else.
I’ve been doing thi# with a sedan for over 40 years. I have no need for a $70 k pick up truck at this point. Just sayin is all. If I have to buy a new lawn mower, I may have to replace the trailer with one a little wider. But for now, drive it up the ramps and off again if I need to transport it. Over the years I’ve probably spent less than $2000 in trailer upgrades and repairs. New tires are $100. Bearings $50, get my drift?
We have a 2014 Sienna. It’s very practical for both people and/or cargo. The rear seats fold down easily. The middle row seats are removable.
We rented a 2023 Hybrid Sienna for a week, and averaged over 40 mpg. The middle row of seats are not removable, though they are supposedly removable in the 2024 8-seat model.
I believe on the 8 seat the center seat is stowable as the Odyssey has had for years but the other seats can be removed but it’s not a simple process. The Airbags in the seats are the big reason along with the sliding tracks for the middle row.
I don’t have trouble lifting them out but there is a learning curve on the most efficient way to liberate them from the latches. I just took both seats and the center console out to bring an e bike home in it. Takes me minutes to do. I would make it an equivalent effort to put sheets of plywood on the top with roof racks as to remove the seats.