I need help understanding how the vacuum system works on my truck. 40+ year old Ford, 4WD, 302 V8, C4 Automatic, Motocraft 2150 carburetor. Is there any rhyme or reason to how it all fits together? What is the purpose for those two vacuum temperature switches? Why the involvement with the transmission?
The transmission has a modulator which helps the transmission decide when to upshift. The ignition retard probably won’t work if the engine is too cold.
All I know is that I want no part of any vehicle built between19 71 and 1990. They didn’t even run good back then.
It all had to do with emissions during the initial engine warmup. Shift points were altered a bit and ignition timing retarded for the first few minutes of operation. This type of thing was common back in the day.
Thermo or time operated valves were also used to lockout the overdrive function of a transmission, lock out the secondaries of both 2 or 4 barrel carburetors, prevent EGR operation during engine warmup, etc, etc.
Those Honda CVCC engines were a real nightmare.
On that old Ford the transmission modulator is a critical input. If no vacuum is applied the line pressure would be extremely high and upshifts would be extremely high and harsh.
What year truck? I had a 77 ford for several years. From what I recall I removed the non sense of the excess vac lines under the hood when I replaced the carb with an edelbrock. I recall the temp vac distribution center sticking out of the thermostat housing as well as the vac switch in the heater hose. I took all that stuff out. I think I only had a vac hose that ran from my carburetor to the the distributor.
I don’t know if you live in a emission state or not. I doubt that removing that stuff would matter on a 40 year old truck.
Mine was a manual transmission so I did not have the automatic vac shifter contraption.
It also seems like there is a vac line that goes into the dash and controls the vent ducts???
Are those two vacuum lines going to the transmission independent inputs to the transmission? One from the intake manifold, and one from the carb base? Or is there a vacuum switch inside the transmission that connects the two lines together inside the transmission in certain situations?
I had a 72 ford pu untill 1990, never recall messing with the vacuum lines.
I’m just curious how it works is all, why they are configured like that. What’s the purpose of that configuration?
This is ancient history to me but I believe the reason for 2 vacuum lines was because Ford used a dual-diaphragm modulator valve that was supposed to help shifts and in turn aid emissions.
This used both manifold vacuum and ported vacuum from the carburetor body and did not work too well. I believe some people actually did away with the ported line and just capped it off.
They used timing retarding to control emissions back then, especially at idle.
IIRC the thinking was that when the timing is retarded, more of the flame front is exposed to the hot cylinder walls and removing the quench area variable during the burn.
Others here may have a more clearer memory on the ignition retard details. But it was definitely emissions related.
LOL…Rod Knox mentioned the Honda CVCC… My money is on the fact that there was at LEAST 3 MILES of vacuum line on that thing. I used to just stare at those and thank God they used high quality rubber line. There was some serious Vacuum Voodoo going on in that engine bay.
I guess you need to be old enough to recall those engines… Trust us…you wanted NO part of that carburetor or vac line operation. LOL…Good Times.
When we purchased a new 1985 Ford Crown Victoria 302cu in with throttle body EFI I examined the incomprehensible “rat’s nest” of vacuum lines and realized I would only be doing oil and filter changes.
That 3bbl carburetor was a nightmare @Blackbird. One of my competitors disconneced all the vacuum lines to replace a head gasket and like they say “all the kings horses and all the kings men…”
There is absolutely nothing on Earth worse as far as vacuum lines and associated widgets than the Hondas mentioned by Rod Knox.
Those would drive a man to drinking very quickly. An entire rubber plantation devoted entirely to Honda vacuum line manufacturing…
It can also lead to some problems if there is a driveability issue and the amount of billable time spent performing countless checks and tests on all of that garbage.
That was my point on the 1985 Crown Victoria. I knew the technology was beyond my training and experience. EPA kept raising the bar on emissions and fuel mileage and still do. If internal combustion engines (which are close now) exhaust cleaner air than they intake the EPA will insist it is not enough. A government agency established in 1970 that has grown from a mouse into an elephant will never admit they have accomplished their goal and are no longer needed as regards internal combustion engines.
The vacuum lines to the transmission tell the transmission’s vacuum modulator how hard the engine is working. Low vacuum means it’s working hard, because you have the throttle open more, high vacuum indicates the engine is not working hard because the throttle is closed more.
This information when compared to the transmission’s internal governor tells the transmission when to shift. Remember, there were no electronics involved back then.
Thanks @JayWB … I’m aware that there’s a vacuum line input to the C4 transmission from the intake manifold, for use by the vacuum modulator or vacuum valve I think is what Ford calls it. That makes sense as the transmission shifting points have to change based on engine load. But I was curious why there were two vacuum lines going back toward the transmission, instead of just the one. One of the posters above thinks it may be a second input to the vacuum modulator. Could be, definitely a possibility. But I see nothing about that in the C4 Workshop book. I was wondering if it might be some kind of vacuum output from the transmission? Used to affect the ignition timing. Or that second line is indeed an input, and used to determine when to downshift, like when passing a car and you need extra ummpth. The other possibility, maybe it doesn’t even go to the transmission, used by the evap system or something. I’ll have to crawl under there at next opportunity and see exactly where that second vacuum line goes.
There’s no vacuum output from the transmission, it has no way to generate vacuum. There are some instances of vacuum modulators with two inputs.
I really like the simple vacuum routing of my Camry.