UPS jumps onto the tech bandwagon

General Discussion
21

I suppose if service is cut back then a robot has a fighting chance (that would be a cost savings), but that’s not really acceptable.

Delivery by humans could be scaled back too, right now (that would be a cost saving), but that would not be acceptable, either.

I read the article and I don’t see that curtailing service is the aim of robots, but rather “The test is trying to determine if autonomous delivery improves efficiency or customer service.”

“UPS is exploring automated and autonomous technologies to enhance network operations,” said Scott Price, UPS chief strategy and transformation officer. “Getting packages to our sortation facility sooner and more frequently, while also creating an opportunity for later drop-offs for next-day service, can add enormous value for our customers.”

It seems most of the benefit comes from using electric vehicles and using robots to shuttle packages to sorting facilities, better service, not less service.
CSA
:palm_tree: :sunglasses::palm_tree:

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22

In my opinion, the dirty little secret is that as workers doing menial jobs, that could be done by a machine, make unreasonable demands for higher wages, it makes corporate investing in the machines (robots) more desirable.

McDonalds is utilizing robot kiosks, Wal-Mart is utilizing inventory/order control robots, Amazon utilizes warehouse robots, UPS…

The standard discussion between business owners here in Florida is how difficult it is to hire employees who continue to show up, show up on time, etcetera. I hear it over and over. there is a cost to large employee turn-over and missed shifts.

Robots are quite dependable, showing up as scheduled and work long shifts without a break. They usually don’t carry signs, either. It all makes sense from where I sit.
CSA
:palm_tree: :sunglasses: :palm_tree:

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23

I agree, but as a society, we need to determine how we handle the unemployed people. No viable plan could mean a lot more crime. My wife has a cousin that runs a successful company in Nicaragua. He rides around in a bulletproof limo and has to be constantly aware of personal protection from robbery, kidnapping and murder for not just himself, but his wife, children, and grandchildren. I think we are years from that, but I don’t want American society to move in that direction.

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24

Unintended results are usually more significant and ultimately very expensive compared to the intended results and we virtually slide back 2 steps while stepping forward 1. Consider the CAFE standards to decrease the use of gasoline and diesel fuel. We now have standards lobbied into oblivion resulting in station wagons being reclassified as trucks and allowed to burn more than double the earlier standard. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg. And to think that 40 years ago the oil companies warned US that the world supply of oil was fast disappearing resulting in the ever growing price of fuel. And today the oil companies want to convince US that the supply is endless and the environment will take care of itself.

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25

My Tuesday evening Men’s League golf partner/friend, when I’m back up north, has a daughter who married a guy from Brazil. They spend some time in Brazil and some here. My friend has even visited them in Brazil. He explained that in that area of Brazil there are two groups in society, “the haves” and “the have nots.” His daughter’s husband is a “have” and lives in an estate with high fences and some other forms of security.

While his daughter and husband were there and outside in the rear of the house, some have nots broke into the residence and somehow came out and confronted them. One intruder had a gun and the husband scuffled with the gunman and was shot, seriously, but it was not a life threatening wound. The robbers left the scene. It seems this is common there and law enforcement is overwhelmed. My friend now lives in fear when his daughter goes to Brazil.
CSA
:palm_tree::sunglasses: :palm_tree:

26

If UPS goes automated, that would be a shame. It’s one of the few places where someone who doesn’t have a high school diploma can get a job, provided he or she is willing to take GED classes and get a GED or diploma at the company’s expense.

I’ve personally seen UPS lift a lot of families out of poverty through its adult education program.

27

Oh they’ll do it, but it’ll be less convenient for you. The package drop zone will be standardized. Upper-unit residents and people in hard-to-access clusters will have to go get their package from a drop-off zone, much like many apartment residents already have to do because the UPS guy isn’t allowed into the residential parts of the buildings.

And with drone delivery you may or may not have to set out a special miniature “helipad” in an open area, but either way, you’re gonna have to go onto the lawn to get your package which is going to get interesting with automatic sprinklers.

One thing that’s remained fairly consistent throughout modern history is that if a large organization wants to make things more convenient for itself, it will, whether or not it’s convenient or good for its customers. See: outsourced customer service.

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28

They do it now in automated factories. One company I worked for back in the 80’s had a robot delivering mail to the all the office centers in one building.

29

That question gets asked every time a job gets automated. It was asked when switchboard operators were made obsolete by automation. It was asked when elevator operators were made obsolete by automation.

The answer is that the economy adapts. People retrain for jobs that are in high demand, particularly those in service industries.

Would you prefer to live in a world where companies are required to employ switchboard operators and elevator operators? I wouldn’t. I’d rather live in a modern efficient world where technology improves our lives.

30

I have already mentioned robots in the Amazon warehouses.
Ha, ha… it would be rather amusing watching a robot trying to successfully operate our elevator and get off on the right floors and find their way around. :joy:
CSA
:palm_tree: :sunglasses::palm_tree:

31

As a whole it’s better for the economy, but that doesn’t mean that groups are not adversely effected. Been working in Computer Software and hardware field as and engineer/architect and management for over 45 years. I’ve seen the direct result of software I’ve written that caused the layoff of several hundred workers. I’ve had relatives in factory jobs loose their jobs because of automation. Real tough for a 58yo with a High-school education get a job in the Tech field…especially when they’ve never seen a computer before.

My brother-in-law is a retired plant manager for Chryco. He saw the automation of the 80’s and early 90’s at Chryco displace thousands of jobs that destroyed peoples lives and even small towns. The alternative was for Chryco to fold and displace thousands more. Damned if you do and Damned if you don’t.

The US steel industry is case study of waiting too long. Back in the 70’s the Steel Workers union threatened to strike if the owners automated. 10 years later they were BEGGING the owners to automate before everyone lost their jobs. Too late.

In the long run technology is better for everyone as a whole. But there are still thousands of people adversely effected by it every day.

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32

In historical terms it wasn’t long ago that the world’s population, including America, was predominantly involved in subsistence farming. Everyone had a job digging and scratching out a living hoping to stay worm and dry and well fed ‘off the grid.’ Can we get the county divided up and provide every family with 40 acres and a mule? Will everyone be happy then I wonder.

33

The point I was making was we had robots in factories delivering mail and parts decades ago when the best mainframe computers of the time had less processing power then an Apple Watch and cost several million dollars.

You get a new elevator or you can upgrade the elevator so the robot can interface with it. It’s not difficult.

Robots finding their way around in a building or apartment complex is several hundred magnitudes easier then an autonomous vehicle navigating on a busy road.

34

The difference once robots become sufficiently capable is that in the past, there were other jobs to jump to. Once robots can do almost all of the jobs, there won’t be.

Horse-drawn coach builders could jump to building bodies for cars. Typewriter manufacturers started making computers. And of course, anyone whose job became obsolete could go back to school and get training on a job that wasn’t.

But if machines are performing 80+ percent of the necessary jobs, that’s an awful lot of people looking for work in a market that mainly “hires” machines.

I’m with you - I embrace future tech too, including full automation of daily tasks. But with that enthusiasm has to come the recognition that it’s going to put a lot of people out of work.

The rational course for society to take would be to let the machines do the work while we do what we want - we don’t need to worry about money anymore because sufficient automation would bring us close to a scarcity-free society. After all, we no longer have to pay miners to dig the ore out, or foundry workers to smelt it, or factory workers to turn it into a car, or dealership employees to sell the car, or mechanics to fix the car and, hell, we don’t even have to drive the car anymore! Meanwhile farm labor is virtually free (yes, you have to buy the robot, but once you do, you don’t have to pay it), the labor to produce equipment and supplies for the farm is virtually free, repair robots will fix the farming robots for free, etc etc.

But history tells us that’s probably not what will happen.

Computers were supposed to reduce the workweek by at least half because we would become so much more efficient that we could get the work done in 20 or fewer hours per week. Instead what happened was that business owners wanted us to do twice as much work, or the same amount of work with half the workers. Or, increasingly common, do twice as much work with half the workers.

Given the choice between producing more output with less input and therefore making more money, or doing the thing that’s good for society, business will pick more money almost every time. There’s no particular reason to think that won’t happen once most jobs can be done by machines, and it’s something we need to be thinking about now rather than waiting around until the jobs are gone.

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36

I believe the biggest piece is the same day or even 2hr delivery is piled onto Amazon trucks. I believe they use them also for the 2hr grocery delivery related to Whole Foods.

Amazon went as far as leasing 10 or so cargo jets also. They can afford the Proof of Concept (POC) of doing your own delivery.

Amazon delivery is not everywhere yet, in my town where home is I see Amazon delivery at neigbhors/my street in another town.

37

Re: Amazon delivery times, I’m sure I’m not the only person whom they try to pressure into paying for faster delivery and/or opting to pay an annual fee for their Prime credit card in order to get free delivery. I reject both options, and I always choose their–supposedly–more time-consuming free delivery.
Even though their standard free delivery is supposed to take a week or more, I almost always receive my package within 3 days.

A month or so ago, my free delivery took place within two days, and I just received an e-mail from Amazon stating that the stuff I ordered at 9:30 this morning has already shipped, and I will receive by tomorrow afternoon. That will make just a bit more than 24 hours for my free delivery to reach me.

38

Sixty years ago in a town of less than 15,000 there were 3 grocery stores that delivered groceries and the majority of their sales were from the home deliveries. And the same obstacles that cause problems these days were problems back then. I delivered groceries for 2 summers in the 60s and often knew where the owner hid a key, otherwise the groceries rode with me to all the other houses and was checked when returning, then again on the next run. But back then laundry, milk and eggs were delivered. Of course a great many things were different then when clothes driers were rare, 1 car was the rule, child day care was virtually non existent and house wives were usually often busy all day being house wives.

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39

Coincidentally, I’ve started getting my groceries delivered.

I still pick up fresh veggies a couple times a week on the way home from work, but I no longer have to spend my weekends standing in line at the store and hauling the groceries in from the car.

Look who’s creating jobs!

40

I don’t like the self scan check outs in grocery and other stores. I tried the self scan and I hated being insulted by the unfriendly recorded voice in the machine. If I am not scanning the items fast enough, the voice in the machine says “Speed it up you old geezer. There are others waiting to scan their items”. It will sometimes say “Get that unscanned item out of the bagging area you crook, or I’ll summon security, the police and the FBI”. Sometimes when I try to pay by cash, the machine screams “I don’t have change. Get with the rest of the world you senile old fart and use your credit or debit card”. When I finally finish, it says “Thank you for shopping at XXX. Get some smarts about scanning machines before you return”.
Well, perhaps I exaggerated slightly, but I really prefer a checkout line with a real person. Many of them recognize me as a regular customer and greet me. The items I purchased are bagged and put in my cart. In the self scan lines, the plastic bags stick together and are hard to separate. Finally, I hate to put somebody out of a job, even if it’s a minimum wage job.

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41

I think that voice is in your head, not coming from the machine.

When is the last time you had a brain MRI?

When I use the self-checkout lane, there is always an employee there to verify my age after I scan a bottle of wine, so I don’t think anyone is getting put out of a job. The restrictions are even worse if you’re buying glue. Besides, I appreciate not having to stand in line, or getting to stand in a shorter line because people like you don’t like to ring up your own groceries. It’s a win/win for both of us.