The Underappreciated Drum Brake

Yes, because it doesn’t have that… dreaded… ABS.
:smirking_face:

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I guess you are afraid to read my post about a semi vs a car, THEY HAVE NOTHING IN COMMON!!! PERIOD

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If that old Dodge Ram had 22.5" wheels, there might have been enough room for commercial truck brakes. Light trucks are not commercial trucks.

If Ram offered air brakes on their one ton dually, more a few truck bros would be in ecstasy. Turbo Cummins Air Braked Bro-dozer with 22.5s.

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That’s a class 4 truck in the picture

Not much in common with your typical 1/2-ton pickup used to pick up a new fridge at Home Depot

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This statement suggests that appearances were, and are, not the only impetus behind the trend toward wheels big enough to wrap a 737 or A321’s tires around.

I read several years ago that disc brakes gain efficiency and heat dissipation as a function of greater diameters, which would in turn influence rim/wheel diameter.

It is a 3500.

The 4500 cab and chassis have a different chassis, bumper, fenders and 19.5" wheels. They have straight rear frame rails to accommodate a truck body, this why they don’t come with a pickup truck box.

@Nevada_545

Then I stand corrected . . . :saluting_face:that’s an acknowledgement to your superior knowledge in this matter

I’m willing to admit I was wrong, unlike @Old-Days-Rick and @ChrisTheTireWhisperer

We have mostly GM and Ford trucks in our fleet, as far as classes 1 - 7 go. Class 8 is almost every domestic brand conceivable, at least at my location

And some of the class 4 and 5 Ford trucks from earlier years did not have the plastic fender flares

And we do have some GM crewcab class 4 trucks with a pickup bed, btw

I’m just mentioning this, for context

But I stand by my earlier comment, @Old-Days-Rick class 4 trucks have little in common with a Chevy 1500 Silverado picking up a new fridge at Home Depot

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Maybe the 22.5" wheels on the Ram 3500 confused you??
You may have not seen or known that they make wheel adapters to convert any 1 ton dually (basically) over to a 19.5" or 22.5" semi wheel, I see them from time to time and had a customer that owned one…
It is probably illegal in your state (?)…

Here is just one of many company’s that sell conversion kits…

yup

I admit I haven’t been doing a good job keeping up with those regulations

I’m guessing it all has to do with “looks” and bragging rights . . . so with those adapters, you’re now running class 4 rims and tires on a class 3 truck. You’ve got the looks . . . to some degree . . . but not quite the capabilities, afaik :thinking:

You can haul more weight as the tires are no longer the limiting factor, but I also have been told (by owners) that it hurts the stopping power when not pulling a trailer… For working trucks, mainly used for 5th wheels and goose necks… But like you said, most are for looks…

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How does it stop worse without a trailer? I assume because theres no trailer brakes?

Trailer brakes are generally drums which are more powerful and efficient so we just helped prove my argument.

There is a reason semis use drums. I can take a picture of a brand new quad axle dump with drums all the way around. Brand new with beautiful shiney painted drums up front.

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I fo not want to go back to mechanically brakes, however if one did they better be self energizing. I know only of one style brake to do that.

And their is a reason semis also run straight front axles and air brakes, but that doesn’t mean they are better on an automobile…

I will say it again, YOU CAN NOT COMPAIR A SEMI TO A REGULAR CAR OR LIGHT TRUCK, they are NOT the same…

My tow dolly has factory disc brakes BTW for better stopping…

Well sense you clearly don’t understand the differences between a semi and a light truck, semi wheels and tires are VERY heavy compared to LT tires and wheels… The extra weight of the unstrung weight semi wheel/tire makes turning them (acceleration) and slowing them down much harder and slower, so when a trailer with electric brakes and an adjustable brake controller is adjusted correctly, the trailer can almost stop the light truck with little/less use of the vehicles own brakes, so having a trailer in tow helps to slow the extra weight of the semi wheels and tires on the LT truck no matter if the trailer brakes are disc or drum…

You really do just keep showing your lack of knowledge and understanding about how brakes work when you keep making post like this…

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@Mustangman ; Wouldn’t a significant increase in rolling radius from oversized tires/wheels require more braking force (hydraulic pressure) on stock brake systems?

I suspect Nevada has it right, but the greater diameter rims should have greater diameter discs. But I would guess most people would use the stock (OEM) brakes.
I my tiny brain I toy with my ideas for a ‘sleeper’ restomod. On one of the auto sale site saw a 1958 Ford two door sedan with factory 352. My ideas get a 428 block but keep the 352 valve covers and air cleaner housing with fresh 352 stickers. Then upgrade the brakes to disc. 14 in disc brake kits are available but I would like larger. But then finding a rim/wheel covers that still look like ‘58 OEM.

Oh well, not gonna happen

Yes, it would. The larger the diameter, the more brake torque you need. So without changing anything else, you need more pressure at the caliper and master cylinder. Takes more foot pressure on the brake pedal.

Most don’t consider the “flywheel” effect of those big wheels and tires. There is a lot more braking effort required to deccelerate those 4 or 6 big wheels that is combined with the truck’s weight. Takes a big, heavy stomp from your boot to start to get that big rig slowed.

And a heavy foot on the throttle to get them rolling.

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So drum brakes are substandard unless they are on a trailer? I’ve not seen a trailer with disc brakes, i feel thats rare.

From a top expert…..

Advantages of Drum Brakes

Low Actuating Forces: Drum brakes require relatively low actuating forces to initiate braking. This is due to their internal strengthening, which is measured by the brake coefficient. The coefficient of friction is typically two to five times higher than the required force.

Particle Protection: Drum brakes have a closed design that protects the brake shoes against coarser particles. This makes them particularly suitable for off-road vehicles and construction sites where there is a higher risk of encountering debris and dirt.

Reduced Rim Abrasion: Drum brakes design features reduce the amount of abrasion, such as brake dust, that comes into contact with the rim of the wheel. As a result, the rims stay cleaner and are subjected to less wear and tear.

Durability: Drum brakes are generally more durable than disc brakes. Reccomended maintenance inspections and removing the brake shoes in a double interval, indicating the long-lasting nature of drum brake systems.

Disadvantages of Drum Brakes

Laborious pad replacement: Replacing brake pads in drum brakes is more labor-intensive compared to disc brakes, requiring additional steps and disassembly.

Sensitivity to friction fluctuations: Drum brakes are more sensitive to changes in friction coefficient, particularly in older cars with front axle drum brakes. This sensitivity can cause unpredictable braking behavior and impact vehicle stability.

Increased weight: Drum brakes tend to be heavier than equivalent disc brakes in trucks, affecting weight distribution and potentially impacting fuel efficiency.

Limited heat dissipation: Drum brakes have poorer heat dissipation capabilities, especially under high-load conditions, due to their enclosed design. This can lead to increased brake fade.

Fading under high thermal load: Drum brakes are more prone to fading during prolonged or intense braking, resulting in reduced braking efficiency and longer stopping distances.

Why use drum brakes for trailers?

Rust Resistance in Long Downtimes: Drum brakes are preferred for trailers that experience extended periods of inactivity as they are less prone to rusting compared to disc brakes. This makes drum brakes a suitable choice when trailers are not frequently used.

Cost-Effective Purchase & Maintenance: Drum brakes are more economical to purchase and maintain compared to disc brakes. They typically have a lower initial cost and require less maintenance, making them a cost-effective option for trailer applications.

Enhanced Braking Force: Drum brakes are capable of generating a higher braking force with less expensive hydraulic systems. They can provide effective braking performance without the need for complex and costly hydraulic mechanisms.