Very true! Modern engines with good oils last a very long time. I have seen discussions about this before and the fact that spending extra money on oil isn’t worth it if you let the rest of the car go to pot. As someone said, there are a lot of cars with great engines but the owner hasn’t paid attention to body rust and all. The body is the largest and most expensive part of the car after all, not the engine or transmission. I thought this was a good point that someone made here in the past.
Many here (including myself) have owned several vehicles with well over 300k miles and used synthetic oil exclusively. My wifes 87 Accord was approaching 500k the last I knew.
I wonder how common it is for vehicles run on conventional oils to go this amount of miles. It probably isn’t worth the extra cost for synthetic if you lease or just plan to keep them 5 years or 100,000k or less. If you plan to keep them a while, then the synthetic really pays off.
Common if they’re bought with an eye toward longevity and well maintained.
I’ve had several cars go well into sic figures and have only used dino… acknowledging that I’ve never owned one that had high compression either naturally or artificial aspiratedlly (is that a word? Should that say artificially aspirated? Naw, I like it the way it is.)… and I’ve never worn an engine out. My current one runs like brand new and it has 219,000 miles on it.
Note that I am not averse to synthetic. I’ve just not yet seen any actual data that it actually benefits a normal-compressioned (Look! I made up yet another word! I’m getting good at this linguistics stuff!) engine over dino. I choose to use dino, but respect Mike’s decision to use synthetic. He’s erring on the side of providing a safety buffer, and that’s never a bad thing.
Far more important is good maintenance, paying attention to the fluids and their levels, not beating the engine up, and fixing things promptly when needed. There is no elixir that will compensate for failure to follow the basics.
Everyone is different and even with one owner, as they age, their needs change. When once I looked at “lifetime” roofing as slate and do perhaps metal, at my age, cheap shingles that last ten years would be " lifetime" for me. This is the same with maintenance goals. Once, I wanted a car that would last ten years and 200k , now it’s ten years and half that. Any motor using any oil recommended by the manufacturer with their intervals is good to go and still have enough life left for good trade in value. I have no one who wants my cars in my family as they are all richer and have their own needs. So, synthetics vs mineral along with intervals can be a personal choice.
IMO synthetic oil for many cars is a solution in search of a problem.
Keep in mind today’s “dino” oils are far, far better than they were 30 years ago.
I’ve read that modern conventional motor oils contain some synthetic base oil to help meet the current standards.
I do have synthetic oil in my manual transmission, where I can feel the advantage on every drive.
But, like a lot of products, mineral oil has improved because of synthetics and their development. Enough actual use of synthetics in fleets has yielded enough converters to say they save money, and lots of it by going longer intervals on synthetics. It’s not a problem with no solution…if wanting to use less oil is your problem.
I was rushed on my last post…I only use synthetic oil on my trucks. Mainly for towing during the summer and skiing during the winter were temps in ski country can easily reach -30.
My wifes vehicles all used regular dino oil.
I now have about 900 miles on the oil change. The oil has changed color from super clear to light yellow, almost like a watered-down apple juice, a little easier to see on the dipstick. The mpg increase is for real, not a lot, but up a little . . . between 5 and 10%. No drips, no leaks, sounds somehow more quiet. Perception? Maybe. Anyway, I’m happy with it and I’ll go 5-6000 oil and filter from now on, we’ll see how it works out. BTW, I NEVER had an engine problem related to oil, with the exception of valve stem seals which I don’t feel count. My last daily driver I retired with 585,000 on her, no engine issues whatsoever, underbody rust made me park her after all those miles (and 23 years in the Pennsylvania snow belt, we use a lot of salt and brine here!). Thanks for the comments! Rocketman
I have heard the same about most conventional oils. Most are now mixed with some synthetics in order to meet modern standards. I have heard the Castrol GTX is one of these.
I have also heard that almost all synthetics must have some group 3 oils blended in as these disperse the additives that must be added to the oil. I guess these won’t blend in well with group 4 oils for some reason.
its nice to see that oil is still a popular topic in the car talk community…
i like Wesson oil
I’ll bet you are using a lot more salt than usual this week. How is the weather out there anyway?
me? its cold in the mid-atlantic region, no snow yet tho…
Early race cars used castor oil, it provided better lubrication than the dino oils of the time. It had just one tiny drawback, once it was raced it had to be drained before it cooled because it would gell otherwise.
I wonder if that is where the brand name Castrol came from?
That is interesting. Aren’t some synthetic oils derived from plant sources?
Also, something else I have heard about synthetic and don’t know if it is true. I have been told that the early synthetic gear oils were too slippery and didn’t allow roller bearings to rotate properly, causing them to wear flat spots. I hear later additives solved this. Is this true?
Aren't some synthetic oils derived from plant sources?
Never heard that one. Could you show the source on that?
@oldtimer 11:
One application for castor oil was in early (i.e. WWI) fighter planes.
They utilized rotary engines, where the engine spun, and the crankshaft stayed put. They used castor oil as a “total loss” oiling system, with oil introduced at the crank and flung outward from centrifugal force. This resulted in the pilot being inundated with a fine mist of castor oil, which is where that dashing silk scarf comes in…to wipe down the flying goggles, in order to see! (I’ve also heard it said that inadvertent ingestion of the oil mist had deletrious effects on pilots’ GI tracts, but I suspect that’s just a modern pilot’s attempt at “potty humour.”)
Castor oil is, even today, a damn good lubricant in total-loss systems. (I wonder if it might actually be a “greener” alternative as a 2-stroke lubricant!)
@ MikeInNH
The best synthetic oils are made from PAO stocks which are highly modified ethylene molecules. These come from plant sources such as corn. You can find this on Amsoils many websites. And now we have synthetic oil (Pennzoil Platinum) made from natural gas!
@MT2CENTS PAO base stocks don’t need to be made from plant sources, although they can. This is part of AMSOL’s brain washing story. Most are made from petroleum sources.
High quality synthetics, such as Mobil1, use PAO base stocks, as do other reputable ones.
Most synthetics are synthesized from type lll or type llll dino oil although they used to be made from PAO. They switched to synthesizing dino oil stocks because it was cheaper. Amsoil and Mobil1 are still made from PAO stocks although I’ve read that even Amsoil now makes one of their oils by synthesizing a dino oil base stock.
I was unaware that polyalphaolefin could be made from dino stock. Would love to see a source on that.
Incidentally, many people still think synthetic oil is nothing more than extra highly refined dino oil. Nothing could be further from the truth. They’re confusing refining with synthesizing. Refining just purifies it. Synthesizing changes the molecular structure.