I will also second mountainbike’s recommendation about checking transmission fluid; especially if your car has an automatic. This means check both the ATF fluid and the hypoid gear oil in the final drive. There are 2 dipsticks. The hypoid stick is on the passenger side way down low and hiding out near the halfshaft.
Many a Subaru transmission has been ruined by botched oil changes involving the transmission which was drained by mistake.
I should add in a Caveat here on the Subaru troubleshooting of Head Gasket issues. I will freely admit that even I was getting stumped by some of these vehicles…they way they would manifest their symptoms wasnt in line with what I was used to and I never quite figured out how the engines fooled me as long as they wound up fooling me.
Seems Subaru engines somehow on one hand make you think the head gaskets are bad and the next day they lull you into a sense of security that they are not the issue. I recall many an instance where I went back n forth of whether I thought it was a gasket issue…and or something else.
I think what threw me a few times was that the engine would randomly overheat…and sometimes it wouldn’t…and to this day I dont know how or why this was happening.
But in the end…with these engines history of head gasket failures…I used historical knowledge to finally admit there was a Head Gasket problem…because trust me…I dont just jump to conclusions…I always try to get difinitive data before tearing any engine down… I never just assume its the gaskets.
But the temp needle is a BIG Clue…and it points to Air pockets in the cooling system. Perhaps the system was never properly purged of air? If it was purged properly…there is only one place an air pocket can come from. Hard to diagnose from my computer…but you do have some “not fun” symptoms manifesting… But of course…Test and Retest prior to committing to a HG failure…Im all for that…always.
Now to comment on your test above… That coolant level is definitely LOW…and as such…means there is more than likely air in your system…it should be solid coolant. Your level under the cap should be touching the cap. What has happened here is that your system purged its liquid coolant Out when hot…and never pulled it back IN when cooling down… A faulty rad cap can do this…it allows coolant out…but is not making a proper seal to then pull the coolant back IN.
It would be great to use a new cap here to omit this as a possible issue… Hopefully…its just your cap not sealing properly… ? The symptoms you are seeing could be that simple… If the HG failed and is introducing air…you should see periodic bubbles in the res…if that is not present… Change that rad cap.
Blackbird
Honda: a wild guess… could it be that the head gasket leaks only under high power operation, eg, accelerating up a hill. Thus the test the OP just performed at idle would not show any bubbles. Of course such a HG problem will only get worse.
Yes…High rpms will definitely tax the HG’s ability to seal in compression… This does occur, Yes. It is probably one of the most common ways this engine will fool you…you dont see the bubbles while you are driving or at high loads. One of my tactics? Install a nice long overflow tube and a clear jug of coolant or water INSIDE the car…drive it hard and watch for bubbles.
OK, all. Thanks for all this information! Here’s what I think I’ll have to do…
Order a new radiator cap, and see if that affects the level of coolant. ( @“Honda Blackbird” – Do you mean that a busted radiator usually does not make a temp. gauge dance?). Also, should I get an OG or aftermarket? If the latter, which aftermarket is best?
Monitor my levels of coolant frequently.
Check the oil dipstick frequently re: weird textures. --If it is leaking somewhere, it would be directly under the engine block, yes?
Anything else I should be mindful of?
Be mindful of the coolant level obviously…but more importantly…the lack of AIR in the system…you dont want ANY… A properly functioning cooling system will purge itself of air…if so designed…the ones that cannot do this on their own have bleed nipples to evacuate air.
Most vehicles will purge the air by multiple Cold to Hot…to Cold cycles…usually takes two or so do accomplish this…it does this by allowing Hot coolant and air to escape into the res…then upon cooling it siphons coolant only back into the rad. Takes a couple cycles to accomplish this…AND if your system has a burp nipple (Subarus commonly had them on top of the radiator and looks like a round plastic cap with a cross in the top…to allow a flathead screwdriver to remove this plug…this is common. But they change things all the time…just be aware of this possibility and or look up Purging air from your models coolant system.)
Once the rad is properly full and purged of air…the tests can commence…if you cannot ever purge the system…where is the air coming from? Yup…the HG… So its important to start properly before testing and or suspecting.
Your temp needle should be slow n steady…No drastic jumps…jumps equal AIR… Which is Bad…
Blackbird
Coolant does not necessarily leak into the oil with a failing head gasket.
I’ve ordered a new radiator cap; coming in the mail.
Is it bad to mix coolant? I need to buy some, but don’t know what the mechanic used.
“Is it bad to mix coolant?”
Uh oh, here we go…
I’d just buy Prestone or Xerex “universal” or “compatible with all vehicles” type.
LOL… @insightful I actually started typing prior and erased it… I was thinking the exact same as you…
Hi all,
I finally got this checked out with my mechanic, and he confirmed that it is a Head Gasket leak.
The $2k estimate is out of my budget right now, and am seeing if ordering the parts from a third-party supplier is worth it? Also, are head gasket sealants, like BlueDevil, even worth considering?
Thank you!
Ryan
As a general rule, when the OEM headgaskets from Subaru’s of this era are changed, the second set lasts far longer than the originals, but since you blew a radiator, that rule may not apply.
Use the new factory headgaskets and add the Subaru coolant conditioner.
Using third party parts means if there is a problem most mechanics or the shop they work for will not warranty the parts. If they fail you are back to square one. This is not the way to save money.
If you want to return your Subie to daily driver status again & eventually, I wouldn’t add any magical engine sealing chemical treatments. Likely to cause more problems than it will solve. Most of that $2k estimate for a new head gasket is for the shop time, some for machine work, but very little of it is parts cost. If you want to save money, focus on areas where a savings is possible, like shop time. Unlikely at a major chain shop, but an inde shop might be willing to make a deal, strike a bargain with you. Maybe they have some work needing to be done that you could do for them for free, & in return they’d do some of the work you need for free. No harm asking anyway.
When I was a poor college student and very tired of dorm food, I asked a local restaurant, a rather expensive one, if I could come in at night and do some cleaning in exchange for some meals. They said “sure”, 4 hours cleaning equals one meal. And as long as you eat your meals in the kitchen, not in the dining room, you can order whatever you like. I have to say I had some very good meals there. I guess they told some of their fellow restaurant owners about me, b/c a few months later I started getting calls from other restaurants offering me the same deal … lol …
Mail order rad cap? U can buy them at dealer. Or is nearest dealer 200 mi away?
“am seeing if ordering the parts from a third-party supplier is worth it?”
Bear in mind that Subaru changed the composition of their head gaskets after your car was manufactured, so getting head gaskets from a 3rd party supplier may wind up getting you head gaskets that are not of the new design. I would suggest getting ONLY genuine Subaru “factory” head gaskets, and also using ONLY the genuine Subaru coolant, which contains a conditioner designed to improve the durability of the gaskets.
This is not a situation where saving a few bucks on parts is likely to be cost-effective in the long run.
Ace responses. Thanks all!
Ryan
You might try getting a quote from a Subaru dealer. Their mechanics are more experienced with this engine and sometimes the dealers have competitive rates for this. Check out this forum for Subaru’s and ask for opinions on costs for a head gasket job but I have seen some claim they had theirs done for $6-800 at dealers.
FYI, the Subaru conditioner is sold separately, it is not included in the Subaru coolant. If you have this done at a dealer, they will use the Subaru coolant but you will have to ask for the conditioner.
@keith, thanks for the tip. The shop that gave me the $2k is so far the cheapest (and has a good reputation around here).
While I’m sure that the first shop which replaced the HGs did the work (I did drive out it from CA to CO last year), I’m thinking that he didn’t use genuine parts, hence the failure. This is partly my fault for not insisting on this, but anyway – another option I was thinking was trying to sell this vehicle w/full disclosure of the issues.
What do you think?