The engines and trannies on these vehicles seemed to be fine…But things like rear windows popping out…
Even though Chryco sold MORE K-cars in the 80’s then Toyota sold Corolla’s…I still see Corolla’s from that era driving around. I can’t tell you the last time I saw a running K Car.
I Made A Daily 74 Mile Commute In A K-Car For Over 15 Years (North Of The 45th Parallel). I Never Had Problems With Windows Or Anything, Else. I Was Never Stranded, Never Got Stuck, And Never Needed Assistance.
I did have to stop for an elk, once in while and I was struck in the door by a ruffed grouse (it exploded in a ball of feathers !), but those babies were reliable and very, very, inexpensive to own and operate. They were easy to drive, also.
There are still some K-Cars operating here. I still see the last one I sold, years ago after I was done with it, my son drove it as a 16 year-old, and then took it to college. However, there are no Toyotas. The nearest Toyota (and I think Nissan, maybe) dealers are over 100 miles away.
CSA
I don’t think past history, such as the reliability or unreliability of the K-car has much bearing on the OP’s question. Back in the late 1940s through the mid 1950s, the Plymouth was the car of choice of many cab fleets. The most trouble-free car my Dad ever owned was a 1947 Desoto coupe he bought in 1954 for $325.
It seems that every model of every vehicle has a particular weakness. Toyota products have a reputation of being reliable. However, we purchased a new 4Runner back in 2003 and I almost made the dealer buy it back under the lemon law. The serpentine belt would chirp. The dealer changed the belt three times and the chirp would always come back in a couple of days. On one belt change, the technician put the belt on wrong and it pulled out the crankshaft oil seal. It turned out to be the springs in the belt tensioner. My wife liked the vehicle so much that she wanted to take it to our local independent shop and pay to have the problem fixed properly. I was afraid it would invalidate the warranty. After the dealer’s service department figured it out and solved the problem, we never took the 4Runner there again. My 2011 Toyota Sienna has a problem with outgassing from the battery and corrosion forms quickly around the positive terminal. The service manager at the dealership where I bought the vehicle (not the same dealer that sold us the 4Runner) told me that he had seen a lot of Toyotas with this problem. Rather than pay $15 buck to them to clean the battery cables, I do it myself every two or three months and have installed the red and green felt rings under the cable clamps which seem to help. The tires on the Sienna only lasted 35,000 miles even though I rotated the tires every 5000 miles and kept them inflated. Maybe Toyota should jump on Johnson Controls about the batteries and Firestone about the tires. On my 2006 Chevrolet Uplander, I had to have the intermediate steering shaft and the sending unit for the fuel gauge replaced. Fortunately, it was under warranty. On the other hand, the tires on the Uplander lasted 50,000 miles and I never had corrosion on the battery terminals.
My advice to the OP is to choose whatever car you like the best. I think it’s next to impossible to determine which car will be the most reliable.
I’d shy away from the Dart simply because it is an Italian design. Fiat and Alfa Romeo were notorious for their lack of quality. That is one of the reasons they left the US market. The Dart is a first year model… generally a big no-no. Go with the Altima.
The original Dart with the Slant-6 was an EXCELLENT vehicle. It took an act of congress to kill those vehicles. The only problem I ever had was the ballast-resister. I probably replaced that every 3-5 months.
The reincarnated Aspen in 1976…was no where near as reliable as the Dart I owned. Brother owned a Volare’ and Dad owned an Aspen. I was constantly working on them…carb problems…warped flywheel…starter problems…and many others.
At One Time We’d Go To The Annual Demolition Derby At The County Fair.
The winning cars were usually either heavy, large V-8 FWD Cadillacs/Oldsmobiles or Chrysler cars that had the Slant Six. The GM behemoths got traction in mud, even with blown tires and had lots of space between the front bumper and radiator/engine.
The Chrysler cars with the Slant Six would blow a coolant hose or get the radiator knocked out and just continue to run for the duration, while other cars would quickly overheat and sit steaming for the duration. The radiators and cooling systems on those Chrysler Slant Six cars seemed to be optional.
CSA
Both are new for 2013, and that normally means more problems. The Altima is redesigned, and should share some components with the last generation.
My vote is for the Altima as it has a track record and the Darts are completely new to the scene.
The new Dart owners are lab rats and part of the experiment at this point. My gut feeling is that the new Dart will not last but I have no factual basis for that feeling; other than Fiat…
There’s still a fair number of old K-cars around here and a surprisingly large number of Pontiac Azteks.
Mitsubishi had their hand in a large number of Chrysler products other than the mini-vans and K-cars… Talon, Ram 50, Omni, Challenger, Sapporro, Aries, and I think the Tourismo and Colt as well as a few others.
Neither; a Mazda3, Toyota Corolla, Hyundai Elantra or Honda Civic would be my choices. All the others have technical shortcomings or are unknown Quantities. The Dodge would be at the very bottom of my list.
The OP seems to have narrowed down the choices to the Dart and the Altima. I know nothing about the Mazda3, but the Corolla, Elantra and Civic are smaller cars. For me, the Honda Civic does not have a good seating position. I’ve had to drive a Honda Civic Hybrid from my institution’s fleet on a long distance trip and found it uncomfortable. My wife was assigned the Civic Hybrid when she went on a recruiting trip and after that requested another make of vehicle. She also had an Elantra as a rental and did not care for it. On the other hand, my wife drove a Dodge Challenger (I think that was the model and I think it was a 2011) 800 miles to Washington, D.C. and thought the car was o.k. This was the last road trip she made for our institution before she retired. My last trip was in a 2010 or 2011 Ford Fusion and it was very satisfactory. Both these cars are about the size of the Altima and probably the Dart.
The Altima is mid-sized, but the Dart is designed to compete with the Corolla, Civic, etc. It is maybe a hair bigger than some, sort of like the Chevy Cruze (and new Corolla). I don’t know how he ended up with that shortlist, but it had me scratching my head from the start. They are very different cars. Maybe he just likes their styling. Of the compacts, my favorites are the Elantra (plush interior, interesting styling) and Mazda3 (drives well, seems put together well). The recent upgrades to the Civic seem to have been effective. The interior materials are certainly nicer. The Corolla is bland, but good. Likewise the Impreza. I wish the Focus reliability was better, because it has a lot going for it. The Cruze reliability has improved, but I don’t quite trust it long term. Will it still be going strong in five years? No idea. Hope so, for all the people who bought one.
The intermediates are mostly good cars. Choosing one would be tough, and I doubt it would be an Altima, though there doesn’t seem to be much wrong with. The current Accord is the best in many years, just right. The Kia Optima is a beauty, but it has to compete with the gorgeous Ford Fusion and elegant Mazda6. Then there’s the frumpy but indestructable Camry, the slightly odd, but also very good, Sonata. And so on. It is a very good category.
One other factor in making the decision between the Dodge and the Nissan is the dealer. I live in an east central Indiana community of about 60,000 and our Nissan dealer just went out of business. Before this dealership opened, the Nissan had been coupled with a Buick dealer. I don’t know anything about the overall sales picture for Nissan, and the lack of a dealer could be unique to my community. There is a state university in my community, but we no longer have a VW, Mazda, or Subaru dealership. There is a Kia dealer and a Hyundai dealer. However, the same Dodge dealer has bee here for at least 30 years.
I mention this because the town I lived in when I attended graduate school had no Rambler dealer and I owned a Rambler. The independent shop had to have the parts sent express from a dealer 60 miles away and I had to wait a day and pay shipping charges.
Back in the day the cars that burnt to the ground around here were mostly Chrysler cars and my experience with the K-cars was less then sterling,it seems they had a problem with the egr system going out on the bulletproof 2.2 engine my poor widowed neighbor got one used and couldnt hardly afford to keep it going,not to mention my brothers 75 Charger,that car was horrible.My current Dodge is doing pretty good(knock on wood) seriuosly doubt if I will buy Dodge products again,probaly wont buy Nissan either,they seem to take one step forward and two steps back,thier marketing ploys finally got to me-GM seems to be the only company thats actually doing logical things(not going to mention what I see along the road with the hood up in this hot weather-interstate gives you a fairly good cross section on reliabilty) and the local shops give you a pretty fair idea on what to avoid also-Kevin
You can’t really compare a car built in the 70s or 80s with a current vehicle. Would you buy a GM car based on GM’s experiences with the Vega? All manufacturers had some dark days in the 80s when they were just learning about fuel injection and computer controls, and were forced to implement slapdash emission controls. Chrysler like every other manufacturer has made some bulletproof cars and some lemons, and I suspect that management cutting corners is to blame far more than the engineering departments.
Look at the LH/Intrepid/Concorde platform that Chrysler started with in the 90s–these were possibly the best effort Chrysler ever did. With the exception of some early transmissions that had a design flaw fixed later on, they were world class cars that could go up against anything. (with the possible exception of the 2.7L engine) Searching this board for people that have had problems with this platform will yield barely anything. Same with Ford’s “Panther” platform or GM’s Chevy Impala/Caprice of the 90s. Searching for Subaru, Ford Aerostar/Windstar, or 2.7L Dodge on the other hand will give a lot of returns.
I’m optimistic for the new Dart, and like I said, it seems to be a pretty solid little car, but get the turbo.
All manufacturers had some dark days in the 80s when they were just learning about fuel injection and computer controls, and were forced to implement slapdash emission controls.
Some had a lot more then others. You’ll see the biggest break from American vehicles during that period. The big-3( or 4) were very slow to change. They had far more problems then Toyota, Honda or Nissan during those years. Remember GM’s 8-6-4 dismal attempt. Cut costs…cut corners…maximize profit. And in doing so they lost many loyal customers (like me and many others). And I haven’t looked back since.
I beg to differ about foreign cars in that period having far less problems. Different problems maybe, but not less. My friend had a Toyota that the gas tank fell out of due to rust, and eventually it was junked as the frame rusted enough that the car would flex under torque. Let’s also not forget the miles of vacuum tubing on Honda feedback carburetors either…
Yes…Asian vehicles did have RUST issues. But that wasn’t a factor if you didn’t live in snow country. Mechanical issues were so less frequent with Asian vehicles at the time.
“Mechanical issues were so less frequent with Asian vehicles at the time”.
I think that the comparison between all domestic nameplates vs. Asian nameplates at the time doesn’t make sense. The Datsun F-10 (its front wheel drive model) had troubles with the manual transmission. I have a friend who bought a new Toyota Corona (not a Corolla) and it wasn’t any gem for being trouble free. I bought a new 1985 Ford Tempo and it was trouble free, but we did trade it in 3 years later for a Taurus because we wanted a larger car. I knew two different people who owned Toyota Camrys back in the mid 1980s and had so much trouble with them that each owner go rid of his Camry after a year. Both owners had an oil consumption problem In one case, the dealer had the engine down twice to replace the rings. After the first time, the oil consumption was even worse than before. The second time, a factory representative came and supervised the ring job.
I do presently own two Toyota products–a 2003 4Runner and a 2011 Sienna. We bought both vehicles because they fit our needs. Interestingly, the 2003 4Runner V-6 models received a poor reliability rating from Consumer Reports for that model year due to fuel system problems. My 4Runner didn’t display that problem and by 2005, the 2003 4Runner was back on the high reliability list. I bought the Sienna because it fit my needs for a minivan. It is no better than the 2006 Chevrolet Uplander we sold to our son who just completed a long trip with the Uplander and had no problems. There are some things I liked better about the Uplander than the Sienna–for one thing, the seats were more comfortable for me.
I do subscribe to Consumer Reports, but I don’t hang my purchase on the reliability records CR reports.
" I do subscribe to Consumer Reports, but I don’t hang my purchase on the reliability records CR reports. "
Exactly. That makes two of us.
As for Asian badged cars and U.S. badged vehicles, I think it makes a difference where one lives. There is no Asian car dealer support anywhere within a hundred miles of my location - no dealer parts, service, or warranty work. Hardly any are on the road, locally.
On the other hand, I can go 20 - 25 miles in almost any direction and find GM, Ford, and Dodge/Chrysler (Fix It Again, Tony) dealers.
When warranty coverage is as good or lasts as long as it does on GM vehicles, you never know, you could possibly need a dealer for warranty issues sometime during that 5 years or 100,000 miles ( I believe Cadillac is even longer).
CSA
I think that the comparison between all domestic nameplates vs. Asian nameplates at the time doesn't make sense.
That’s NOT what I said. Of course you can find some Asian vehicles that had a lousy record…but the number of American vehicles with a lousy repair record were running a lot higher. The percentage of people who use to buy American vehicles and then switched to buying Asian vehicles was never greater then in the late 70’s through mid 80’s. American made vehicles had a dismal repair record during that period. My brother-in-law was (retired plant manger) was a General manager back then. He was attending workshops sponsored by the Big-4 to determine why the Asians were building better products. They adopted many many changes in production in the mid-80’s to address these issues (like just in time inventory). This helped them eliminate millions of dollars in parts that have proven to have a design flaw. It allowed them to quickly make design and manufacturing changes without scraping millions in inventory. Another new process they added was allowing the person on the line to stop production if there was a problem with the line. Both of those changes came directly from the workshops.