Yep. Haven’t even gone here yet. Was very interested in the model and how it was going to be perceived.
Thanks for the reply.
Thanks Beancounter - appreciate you taking the time to reply.
If I was to put the business model, costs, risks and other “backend” tasks aside…out of the discussion for now…
The proposition is to provide a mechanic with a place to work, alongside 4, 6, 8 other mechanics doing the same, out of the elements, with equipment they would not normally have access to, or space they normally have access to. A professional looking building with customer consult rooms, bright lights and clean floors. The mechanic only has to self-promote/advertise and do good work. Let’s say…$400/week for the space. We expect there would be walk-in traffic which would have to be equally divided by opportunity and mechanic, but it is another avenue for self-promotion.
Based on the thread, the overall opinion of the replies read that a new mechanic, or aspiring independent mechanic would not view this option as a valid next step towards an independent shop. Further, customers may not feel comfortable bringing their vehicle to a facility like this.
OK - now it is sounds like marketing research…you win MustangMan.
I am absolutely open to further conversation on this and truly appreciate the feedback from everyone. This forum has been the best in terms of responses and dialogue.
Look forward to any feedback on the above. Thank you.
Let me add to your research . No need to reply to each persons post because your posts are seen by everyone .
I think by now that you would have gathered that your idea is not really that good .
I just do not see this working at all for a number of reasons. I would like to hear more from you in regard to your comment which I cut and pasted directly below.
We expect there would be walk-in traffic which would have to be equally divided by opportunity and mechanic, but it is another avenue for self-promotion.
Equally divided? Equally divided by who? Are you saying that a mechanic who rents a space is going to be subservient to someone else calling the job shots so to speak?
Earlier a mention was made of a roll-around four-post lift for each bay. I have a friend who owns one of those and it is a bear to work under. A two post side hoist is far better.
That brings up another point… A good mechanic can be (and should be) working 2 cars at the same time. Once one car comes apart, if the mechanic finds the need for additional parts, the car waits on the hoist for the parts delivery. That is lost income to a mechanic so they need at least another bay and maybe another hoist. A large shop can spread the mechanics apart with a shared bay between. Also helps to have a second set of hands at times.
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I agree with this. As a do-it-yourselfer working on my own cars, I can afford to leave a car taken apart in my garage for as long as required. I am not trying to make a profit, and I don’t have any customers, managers, or a landlord to be accountable to. If I was doing this as a business, that would not fly. A second service bay would be a necessity.
OK4450 - Walk-ins was a random thought…you’re insight is valid and wasn’t considered in the blurted thought. It is just expected to happen and would need framework around it.
Volvo - Yep…got it.
MustangMan - Great points on 2 jobs at once. Never considered that.
Bcohen - Yep!
You guys are great and thanks for the insight on the wrench side. Business model aside, this is not a helpful program.
Great forum here and great participators. Thank you!
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Really good point about another problem with the hair salon business model. I went to a barber shop once and the lady must’ve just flunked out of barber college because I left looking like Sonic the Hedgehog. I’ve never been back, even though they had something like10 other barbers that probably do a fine job.
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Aside from all the issues given by the many posters above, I think it’s worth mentioning that for a great deal of people out there, what makes a great mechanic and what makes a successful business owner are mutually exclusive. I think not enough mechanics are aware of that. What it takes to fix a car and what it takes to run a successful business are 2 entirely different skill sets, it’s rare to find both in one person.
As to the service bay rentals, 15X25 isn’t enough work space unless you plan to limit the facility to passenger sedans and small SUVs. You need room for tools and equipment. Overhead air reels and exhaust hoses take up space too. What kind of tooling is provided? Car lifts are cheap.
Who provides the high speed internet? Who pays the fees to the service data providers like Alldata, Shopkey, etc. that every mechanic needs? Who buys the subscriptions to factory programming software access? What’s in place for your hazardous waste disposal or do you plan to throw oil filters in the garbage and dump antifreeze down the toilet? The cost for these things are generally too much for one tech to bear alone.
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The uphill grind to opening any business can be a $truggle and auto repair would likely be at or near the top of $struggling professions. I look back at just how lucky I was to have opened with one established fleet customer, an ongoing commercial relationship with 2 local parts stores, a well stocked box of quality tools and at a time when the economy was slipping into a recession and overwhelming the long established shops that I was competing against. And even with all that going for me business was a hit and miss struggle for nearly a year. Believe it or not My best business decision was to toss my effort at having the lowest flat rate in town. I averaged my competition’s prices and added 43c to the average and that resulted in them sending me their overflow. My competitors began to call to ask if I was able to do a certain job immediately and if so they sent their customer over.
But being able to deal with the good, the bad and the ugly customers and handle operating capital responsibly also comes to mind as ‘must haves’ that schools don’t teach.
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I agree with that, and I’m not too proud to suspect . . . I can’t know for certain, because I’ve never tried it . . . I wouldn’t be a successful business owner
I also consider myself to be a decent mechanic by now. It took a long time to get here, though. Nobody’s excellent from day one. Mistakes will be made along the way. It’s how you deal with them and learn from them that is important
On the flip side, I know a few guys that are strong in areas that would be important for owning a successful shop. Such as knowing what work to accept, what to farm out, how to delegate work, how to make sure the guys are actually learning new skills, etc. Yet they’re actually pretty bad mechanics themselves. Interestingly enough . . . but not entirely surprising . . . some of these same guys seem to overrate their own mechanic skills
I’m not going to read everything so this is just off the cuff as a customer. When I need work done I go to the shop and talk to the counter person. In my case it is usually the owner. They schedule me, get the parts, assign it to someone, and I pay them at the end. So one question is will you staff the counter for support such as scheduling, ordering parts, collecting the bill, advertising, as well as other plant support needs like snow removal and lawn mowing? Not having these services is a real negative. Then the idea of having a single bay and expecting to keep busy all day just working one bay will waste a lot of time.
Yeah people with money these days don’t know what to do with it but if you have a building, rent it out. If you want to get into real estate, you just can’t make much of a profit renting little spaces that require support systems, unless it is apartment or office buildings, and you know how that market is going lately. I’d do a real estate trust or mutual fund and not worry about a 2 am call on a water leak.
I currently use a shop that has a couple-a-three people out front. The owner is in the back somewhere. It’s a family operation, and I think everyone up front is part of the family. They do excellent work and I don’t mind paying more for work that is done right the first time. It’s a very large, full service shop too.
There is also a shop that my daughter’s in-laws use that have two mechanics and no front office. They also do good work. I went there for an estimate to replace the timing belt on my old Accord in 2012. When I asked for a written estimate, he tore off a piece of paper from a notepad and wrote it out. Since I knew what the estimate was for, I understood it. Anyone else would not. They cost less, though.
One shop is professionally run, the other is more entrepreneurial. The idea starting this thread could include a front office or not. Everything the building owner provides increases the rent. At some point, the costs will be high enough that prospective tenants might be unable to justify the rent with the money they take in.
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My field is software engineering…but I see mechanics as having the same type of problems.
Many engineers (and mechanics) are great at what they do…but NOT so good at running a business. I’ve see many try and fail because they don’t know the how to run a business. They weren’t trained at it.
A few mechanics seen that worked out were someone else ran the business (like a wife or brother). The mechanic did the work. There are a lot of tools now to help a person do the business part…but you’d be surprised how many people think they can do it, but haven’t a clue.
One question every business needs to know the answer to…“How much money (on average) do you need to bring in every day to stay in business?” You’d be surprised how many people don’t know the answer to that.
I’m not a big fan of Gas-Monkey garage, but I do like their offshoot show “Garage Makeover”.
Growing up in a family owned neighborhood grocery store in the 50s and 60s was quite an education in dealing with customers and money. Recognizing that money in the cash register was mostly business capital and less than 5% was income to spend. Taking things apart to see how they worked and successfully reassembling them was a peculiar trait that my parents allowed even though they occasionally regretted doing so.
And it seemed to me that among the situations that fate presented me with was luckily getting involved with automobiles just prior to the advent of electronic controls. Being quite familiar with all things automotive by the mid 60s and earning a living working on cars and learning to deal with feedback carburetors and knock actuated spark retard made fuel injection and digitally controlled timing actually seem simple.
Today, stepping into the automobile repair business seems drastically more difficult than it was 50 years ago. Maybe franchises and dealerships will soon dominate the market. Of course electric vehicles will soon drastically change the automotive repair landscape.
This is a great forum! Thank you for the replies!
I appreciate the points on mechanic vs. business owner as well as the other key points on software maintenance and a front office for the customer experience and ease of repair.
Very professional group here for not kicking my teeth in and just ridiculing the idea. Great dialogue - thank you.
This certainly warrants a visit back to the drawing board on the overall proposition, but more important is the mechanic point of view from everyone and not creating a model that would set them up to fail within a few months. Again, the principle here was to help a mechanic get started, grow, build a customer base, save and eventually move into their own physical space…or decide they don’t want to without having the the 5 digit investment/loans to get started.
As I said earlier, I posted this on a few forums and I am also reading the more experienced mechanics are quite content working for someone and the younger guys are all about doing their own thing. Age vs. experience is likely the factor here. I am also aware that nobody wins if I fleece a bunch of kids and they get in over their heads and fail. Everyone loses. Absolutely not the goal.
Others have suggested incorporating a mentoring program where a local business owner would volunteer an hour or so to come in and educate mechanics on business aspects…reads well, but likely not a feasible ask of a business owner.
Thank you all again - I am extremely grateful for all of your time and experiences!
Another huge element here - family-owned. Established and trustworthy shops are either corporate giants, or family-owned and been around for decades.
Another forum pointed this out and it only makes it more difficult for “new” guys to get started.
Thank you!
I am repeating myself here . It seems that by now you would realize that what you are proposing is not really a workable plan . Just the fact that the monthly expense of the facility is going to be high , the turnover rate of people trying to make a living out of it will also be high . The Covid-19 threat will be with us for a long time to come . Many established shops are struggling and are offering free pickup or touch free service plans.
Diz , do you not have other people at this start up facility that are researching this other places besides the web forums ?
I figured Rawlings wasn’t the complete idiot he portrayed himself as because he had a successful business. After seeing Garage Makeover, that confirmed it.
He does know how to run a business and more importantly how to market himself. And in that line of work - you really need to. Some of the businesses he helped hadn’t a clue on how to run a business.
What I’d like to know from the professional mechanics who’ve watched the show - Is the equipment that’s being brought in for the shop good or just OK. About the only think I know is they usually set them up with a Havaline Oil account…that’s good oil - although almost impossible to find here in the North East.