The Libertarian Utopia would seem to be the WINNER TAKE ALL/SURVIVAL OF THE FITTEST model. Where does that model leave all those who come in second place and below?
Sorry Kevin…my apologies. @kmccune
I must have misread the, " I may be a Liberterian, but…" with Liberterian in caps. I though you were a member of the Liberterian party with an understanding of their core beliefs. I was just on a fact finding mission. As an independent, who thinks Democrats are sold out conservative lights, I find I have a lot in common with “some” Liberterian beliefs; those with respect to some forgien affairs posture. I just wanted a little more linkage to the real world of the working poor.
As far as meddlesome govt. no two situations demonstrate the meddlesome nature of govt. then a study of the two bailouts in contrast, between Bush over the Banks and Wallstreet and Obama over the auto industry. Both sought a rightful roll in tax payer dollars from keeping theses two institutions from going under. The difference? Tax payer Credit was sign over the banks with little or no accountability while tax payers took stock in the auto industry.
The outcome over the next three years were demonstratively different as heads of Wallstreet were given bonuses and auto heads were fired. We have yet to see the funds in Wallsteet Banking be fully implemented into our economy while GM has taken over world leadership in sales. So meddlesome govts. when protecting your and mine tax dollars…are ok by me.
I’ve had this conversation with my BIL and he would say why should he pay for someone in their old age that has been irresponsible in their youth? They didn’t invest in themselves in education, didn’t save their money, and so on, and then need someone else to pay the way.
I don’t agree with that but some people are fed up with having to bail out people that make bad decisions. Single parents by choice, building on a flood plane, not buying insurance, etc. Like I said in North Minneapolis there are still houses with tarps on the roofs from a tornado some time ago because they didn’t have insurance. They are waiting for help from someone to put a new roof on. My roof will be replaced no problem because I have insurance.
Just saying its a fine line between a life preserver and encouraging irresponsibility. For some reason the war on poverty from 1970 didn’t work and we need to figure out why.
Raise minimum wage to $13.00 and see how things improve.
I don’t necessarily disagree with the minimum wage but for me, no one would have hired a high school kid to wash dishes at that rate and that’s how I paid for college. Unintended consequences abound.
Ayn Rand’s “Objectivist” cult was pure lunacy. Any modern humanitarian society believes in supplying education, health care, defense and police protection, some federal infrastructure work such as those of the Corps of Engineers, and some form of old age security and support for those who cannot fend for themselves. These things all have to be paid for with taxes, of course.
So, if we eliminate pork barrel farm support, subsidies to industry, federal make work projects, any military spending other than pure DEFENSE, foreign aid, cultural subsidies, energy subsidies and any other tax funded programs other than the the above we can actually find a trillion dollars.
Many programs, once started, have just stayed and oulived their usefulness. I advocate a reurn to zero-based budgeting.
@docnick
Good observations. My only concern with eliminating any for defense that isn’t pure defense, and my question to Kevin about Libertarian views, is that in my experience in the military, they have a huge educational complex, support ROTC in our schools, provide funding for education in return for service and generally support having a well educated populace to draw from. In my minds eye, national defense spending is much more complicated then shooting guns. It’s engineering, psychology and yes, entomology, and just about ANYOTHER ology you can think of…and, national defense has a huge interest in arms manufacturing as well as just about any contractor they deal with.
@dagosa Good observation; I almost got my university education through ROTC; that type of training replaces regular state or private university. Of course defense reseach needs to be funded to stay technically up to date.
During the 30s Depression, US defense spending was down quite a bit, but not cranked down to be ineffective. When WWII broke out and the US was invaded, industry was marshalled into the largest arms production in human history.
Total defense spending could probaly be cut in half without losing its effectiveness. The only unhappy people would be state governors who see less military base activity or complete closure and the United Nations who want Uncle Sam to forever cough up resources.
I have a fondness in my heart for what FDR and his Chief did to help the country through some lean times,I know we cant keep everybody but through judicious spending and marshalling of resources I believe at this present time we have enough to go around,but for some the freeride must must end,you heard what happened in Lewiston-Maine,I believe it was, a certain group of people searched for the best welfare benefits and it turns out Lewiston was the most generous-so this group of people settled enmass there,poor town.We need to be on our toes,a lot of peoples woes we didnt create and we are not responsible for-Kevin
Although it sounds arrogant for me to say it, there seems to be a significant segment of the population who are unable to regulate their own lives without significant intervention. A great many people are overwhelmed dealing with the pressures and demands and responsibilities that life throws at us all these days. Many, if not most of those people could enjoy life while supporting themselves if the predators who rob them were better regulated and a somewhat paternal bureaucracy were established as a back stop short of homelessness. For sure, the entitlement system we now offer the poor is failing miserably.
Wow RK,wonderfully said-sad as it seems despite our growing knowledge and contacts,there are still many who believe in the “Law of the Jungle” if they get thier way someday they may awaken with no one to empty their chamberpots,it might take another bubonic plague to get the rights of the producers restored-Kevin
@Docnick
"defensive spending could probably be cut in half"
Are you saying it’s possible to cut spending so instead of leading the world in defense spending we could still be leading the world in defense spending ?
Guess that shows how much we are presently leading the world.
Our Pentagon is a “good ole boys” club that makes millionaires of politicians and their friends in return for fighting off the woolly mammoths, saber tooth tigers, and Muslims with Weapons of the Massively Delusional. Kuwait was a setup for the Pentagon to be the stars of a reality tv show. The current Gulf War is, like most sequels, a great disappointment despite the cost.
Lyndon Johnson did not trust the military saying something to the effect that the military has to have battles to create heros. You can’t be a hero without a battle. That was just before Ike and Westmoreland suckered him into sending 150,00 more kids to VietNam to fuel the military industry.
Lyndon Johnson did not trust the military saying something to the effect that the military has to have battles to create heros. You can't be a hero without a battle. That was just before Ike and Westmoreland suckered him into sending 150,00 more kids to VietNam to fuel the military industry.
Johnson was a horrible wartime President. He had no plan to win the war. He said we are just there to help South Vietnam. You don’t send our sons and daughters into a war without a plan to win the war.
Let’s go over the cliff is due to diametrically opposed philosophies that used to be solved with compromise, but now has turned into no compromise no matter the cost.
LBJ’s biggest problem with the war was Robert J MacNamara.
Lyndon admitted he was no war time president, said he was too sentimental to make the hard calls, which is why he relied on Ike for counsel. He thought the whole thing was a quagmire that couldn’t be won but Ike said if you are going to fight you have to fight to win-at all costs including nuclear. Before he sent in the 150,000 additional troops that Westmorland wanted, he consulted with both Ike and Truman who both said he had to go for it. If either one of them would have said pull out now before its too late, he would have done it.
A good book is “The Presidents Club”. Its a behind the scenes look into decisions made from Hoover on and provides a different view based on transcripts than we’ve sometimes been led to believe.
@dagosa Yes, the US spends as much on its miliatary as the next 7 countries COMBINED. That includes Russia, China, Britain , France, etc.
Those costs are not research; they are a huge military staff all over the world as well as too many military bases. The French, for instance, do a lot of development, as do other countries.
There are also a lot of very expensive programs driven by industry, using scare tactics, and not necessarily critical to US security. Even Eisenhower warned against the Military-Industrial Complex.
I wonder how many of these bases could be repositioned here at home, not cut, just brought our shores so expenses could be reinvested. How many would it take to pay healthcare for the millions uninsured, provide tuition to those who qualify and increase the minimum wage to where it should be ?