Tire dealers should have access (by subscription) to a database that gives them the procedure, just as full-service shops do.
Did you stop by the dealer’s parts window and ask for the initialization procedure? As a part of prepping new cars, the dealers have a check list of initialization procedures to set all the computer-controlled systems, of which the TPMS system is one.
It depends on what is needed. Back when I owned a 2008 Accord (which had sensors inside each tire), the only way to register the TPMS sensors to the car was at the dealer, since it required a laptop and $2,000 worth of software. Needless to say my TPMS light stayed on all winter when my snow tires were on the car. I refused to pay the $50 each tire changeover to register the “new” TPMS sensors. That’s 100 bucks a year!!! That was the only car I ever owned that made TPMS issues so difficult. I was so happy when I got my first Mazda and it was indirect TPMS.
That’s a different system than the OP described. The one described has tone rings and sensors outside of the tires.
I know. Just an illustration of how car makers can make simple functions darned difficult to work on. Oh well. I’m just being a grumpy old guy again…
1 Like
I emphatically agree. The most amazingly unnecessarily difficult thing I’ve ever done was replace the headlight bulb on my daughter’s 2001 Civic. Honda in particular seems to have a “difficulty engineer” whose function it is to make the simple things as difficult as possible.
The only vehicle I owned with a TPMS was a 2009 Saturn.It was fine during the 6 years I owned the Saturn. I realize now it was a direct system which recorded tire pressure in each specific wheel. Despite a one time road hazard blow out and tire replacement ;at lest one 4 tire replacement because of wear and several rotations I never had a TPMS re-calibration problem which required going back to the dealer. I shall never buy another vehicle with a indirect system unless the dealer or manufacturer warranties lifetime re-calibration . Life is too short for this kind of aggravation .
With a direct system I understand how a 25% reduction in psi in one tire sets off a direct TPMS warning but I do not understand how a difference in one of 4 tire’s rotation sets off a indirect TPMS. What % difference in psi; rotation; tread wear; tire circumference or rotations per mile sets off the indirect system?
I am not sure if anyone replied with the correct answer, I did not read all the post.9 years ago I bought a new Nissan Versa, and when it got cold, (I live in New Hampshire) the low air pressure sensors would drive me nuts. I took the car back to the dealer, and they suggested, that they take the air out of the tires and fill the tires with Nitrogen instead of air. It stays more stable, and they charged me $40. to do it. The next Nissan I bought from a better dealer, and I asked them to install Nitrogen in the tires, they said we have done that to every car that leaves the dealership, since the low tire pressure alarms were installed. They were tired of dealing with irate customers, so they just did it automatically. And after I purchased this new Nissan I of course went to a gas station to fill the tank, and it would not take any gas. I went back to the dealer and asked it I was doing something wrong with the nozzle, they pointed out to me, that every vehicle that they sell also comes with a full tank of gas. These guys are great, and I have purchased 5 cars from them in 7 years.
They have this neat thing on the dash that is called a gas gauge, it reads from E (empty ) to F (full ).
Also just plain air or nitrogen makes no difference to the tire pressure monitors. They were feeding you a line so they could sell you nitrogen.
5 Likes
Volvo is entirely correct. Use of nitrogen is bogus.
2 Likes
@Egide_Beaudoin, air is about 80% nitrogen. The 20% oxygen will behave the same as the nitrogen at any temperature yo see in NH.
Nonsense. Nitrogen is no more stable than air.
Well believe it or not, my sensors no longer go off, and it was almost a daily occurrence before the switch.
And I would like to know your background concerning tires?
Are you a manufacturer, salesman, or just opinionated?
I sold tires for 4 years for Firestone tire and Rubber company, and I learned a lot about ply separation, belt slipping, and Why for the longest time Michelin never made a snow tire. Back in 1970 if you bought a set of Michelin tires, and went back to the dealer in say November and asked for snow tires they would laugh at you, because with a good quality radial tire you do not need snow tires. I was around when Firestone first tried making steel belted Radial tires, and they had miserable failures.
They made a fiberglass belted radial tire, but wanted to get into the steel belted radial tire market for more mileage.
It took an engineer to point out to the designers that the reason the belts were slipping and causing blowouts, was the steel belts were not adhering to the casing.
So they added 1 fiberglass belt above the casing then the steel belt to that and then molded the tread onto the new tire and it worked well from then on.
Firestone sold to the Japanese company Bridgestone, and I am willing to bet you the reason that the Ford Explorers were having so many blow outs years ago (after the Japanese took over the production of the tires) was because some smart economist at the company thought we could save $1.00 per tire by taking out this fiberglass belt.
So if you live in a cold climate, and your low tire sensor keeps going off. Go to your dealer and ask them to put Nitrogen in the tires, it does not expand and contract as much as air does.
It worked for me in 5 vehicles so far.
I worked for a major company, and got to know the mechanics that fixed all the equipment in this company. This was a weaving and knitting company.
One mechanic use to have his own garage and had a steady supply of satisfied customers, but he wanted to make his life less stressful. NO more book work, no more payrolls to make out.
But when he stopped working as a garage owner, he built a large garage next to his home, and he installed a car lift in it, so he could at least work on his cars. Word got around, and he was soon working on people’s cars that worked with him in this company. One day a dad brought his daughter’s new VW to him to change the oil and filter. He could not do it, because VW had made the oil pan nut in such a way that only VW mechanics could change the oil. At that time not even Snap On had a replacement type wrench to take the nut off of the oil pan.
They probably reinitialized the system.
My background isn’t in tires. My background is in 20+ years of engineering followed by 17 years as a college administrator. .
The nitrogen game is a scam. Ambient air is about 77-78% nitrogen as it is, and nitrogen atoms and oxygen atoms are almost exactly the same size, right next to one another on the periodic table of elements.
Besides, after a tire is mounted it contains ambient air. Ask them how they remove the oxygen from the air in the carcass before backfilling it with nitrogen. Watch them dance their salesman’s dance.
Race teams use nitrogen for safety. Oxygen would feed a fire in the pits. Nitrogen will smother it.
Dealerships and tire store use nitrogen for a sales gimmick. Many are convinced that it actually makes a difference. The only difference it makes is to their revenues.
4 Likes
None of the above, just informed.
3 Likes
This is exactly wrong. Besides being 80% nitrogen, the rest is almost all oxygen, which behaves exactly the same as nitrogen with regards to temperature. They are both behave as ideal gases (PV = nRT) at normal temperatures and pressures.
2 Likes
That’s funny. I was on my second car, a '64 Fairlane, in 1970. Being told about 1970 lacks a certain authority for those that were car owners in 1970… and prior.
And exactly what does your lengthy explanation have to do with your concluding sentence?
By the way, what’s YOUR background? Ever had any physics? Chemistry? Anything technical? You asked us, we have a right to an answer from YOU!
1 Like
If my TPMS went “off”, I would not be concerned, as that would seem to indicate that a low tire pressure situation had been resolved.
However, I would be concerned if my TPMS went “on”…
1 Like
I want to talk about nitrogen inflation, but in order to get Egide’s attention and to establish some creditbility with him, I am going to comment on something first:
[quote=“Egide_Beaudoin, post:52, topic:110645”] … I was around when Firestone first tried making steel belted Radial tires, and they had miserable failures.
They made a fiberglass belted radial tire, but wanted to get into the steel belted radial tire market for more mileage.
It took an engineer to point out to the designers that the reason the belts were slipping and causing blowouts, was the steel belts were not adhering to the casing. [/quote]
Ah … Mmmmmm … That’s not how I remember it:
The so-called bonding agent used in the belt skim of the Firestone Radial 500 tires which contributed to an acceleration of corrosion in the presence of high humidity is called HMT (hexamethylenetetramine). This agent produces amines which, in the presence of water, can accelerate corrosion. It was eventually replaced by a similar agent called HMMM (hexamethoxymethylmelamine).
This is a quote from my webpage on the Firestone ATX problem about August of 2000. At the end of the page I talk about the Firestone 500 problem from the 1970’s.
That web page is here: Barry’s Tire Tech: The Ford/Firestone Controversy
Note the lack of anything about a fiberglass belt. Yup, Firestone’s competition didn’t use one - and 20 years later, neither did they.
So now onto nitrogen inflation: Barry’s Tire Tech: Nitrogen Inflation
And here are my credentials:Barry’s Tire Tech: My Credentials
So, yes, I am (or was) a manufacturer - or at least, I worked as an engineer for one.
7 Likes