I have to call garbage on a lot of those fastner drives, how many have been ruined by looking similar to one another? I cant even see the logic in some of them ,some are so fragile if you happen to use a slightly off size driver .you will strip it out.Reminds me of planetary gearsets ,very good as long as everything engages equally ,but let one of the little undersized pieces happen to get a little extra torque,ka -ping !(usually if you are careful though you can limp with the balance of the planet gears ) I almost want to pull my hairout when the torx screws wring out before final torque because I only have one size,and what was the supposed advantage of posi-drive or clutchead ?
Trip Square isnt a bad drive method…its just …different. Like @ok4450 commented…you usually are in the middle of something and BAM… What tha? You dont have what you need…and never knew you needed it.
VW is rife with this sorta thing… My Cylinder Head Bolts…Trip Square…Assorted trans stuff…Trip Square…along with my Door Hinge bolts…and Axles…etc…
Its a fine drive method as far as grip or hold goes…but I haven’t met the soul who was overjoyed by stumbling upon one unexpectedly as of yet…and methinks I never will. Ha…the joys of doing mechanical work, My God how much money do I have in tools? Ugh…I could flatten my mortgage if I had all that money back in hand…and then some.
I need to make a Will n Testament cause my tools shouldn’t wind up at anyones Yard Sale after I’m pushing up Daisys
Blackbird
I participated in a local radio show about 10 years ago that checked the tire air pressure of about 100 cars parked in a local shopping mall. The results were dismal. About 80% of the cars and trucks had high or low air pressure and a small placard with the results were stuck behind the driver’s side windshield wiper. The placards were supplied by a local tire store. I’ll bet that the 80% who flunked the test also had fluid checks that were neglected as well.
If it ain’t broke don’t fix it… It seems to work for some people.
missileman: I’ll bet that about 100% who flunked the test threw the card away and continued on their lack of maintenance road to disaster. I check oil, brake fluid, and coolant levels weekly. I do a visual check of tires prior to driving and a pressure check monthly. This was taught by my Father. I have been doing it since I was 15 years old (49 years).
British vehicles which “commoners” could afford had a terrible reputation for reliability. 1950s-1960s American vehicles with regular oil changes were nearly trouble free. British and the already mentioned early Japanese cars required a much higher level of (somewhat different) maintenance plus requiring some non U.S. standard fluids. Fortunately I was made aware of this before I bought my first one. I was able to own 4 British cars which with proper maintenance ( a couple needed some maintenance “catch-up”) were nearly trouble free. The “bad reputation” didn’t bother me as it resulted in very low purchase prices.
“I think owners are becoming more reluctant to bring their car in for routine maintenance for fear the shop will discover something super-expensive needs to be fixed, or the shop will misdiagnose and break something that was otherwise working, due to new car complexity.” - George
George, I agree 100%. Putting one’s car in the hands of a shop is an adventure in anxiety. This past Tuesday mine got state inspected, and even that was mild anxiety. It passed, as it always does, but one never knows what evil lurks in the hearts of another.
I guess I never owned this Japanese vehicles that required more maintenance then my GM vehicles.
The only exception was the PS fluid for our Hondas. We bought our Hondas before they required special tranny fluid.
Seems to me like a semi-circular (D drive ) would be able to stand a lot of torque and be fairly forgiving (at least in my mind games ) sort of wish they would standardize on 2 or three types.
In woodworking a Robertson drive (square drive ) is much better then a phillips one advantage the phillips had over the slotted was self centering,the square does too and seems to able to transmit more torque.
Now I really dont see much advantage with a pozi drive it supposedly will transmit more torque then a plain phillips ,the only thing I ever show them on were Mack trucks and Ford products.The only time I ever ran across clutchhead was on older Chevrolet pickups.It seems Ford was an early adopter of Torx . The Allenhead screws dont seem that good to me if your size is a bit off or you have a worn wrench they seem to "cam " out about as easily as a phillips.
Come on what are youse Guys favorite fastner styles ,on autos ,etal ?
I used to work around people who if they didnt like a particular make of vehicle they would try to tear it up and say ",daggone (fill in the blank ) see they are no good " I try to coach novices and neophytes to ease up and take care of the vehicle(mostly on deaf ears ) amazing how much cheaper something operates when you dont have to repair it.And when I am bitchin’ bout something ,I try to keep in mind the worst now is on par with the very best years ago .
I’m not a member of the forum but on a Nissan forum not many years ago there was a complaint from a young lady about her new Nissan Altima.
The car was purchased new, she never changed the oil or checked it, and the engine grenaded at 30k miles.
She complained on the forum because the dealer and Nissan correctly refused to warranty a new engine for her. After 3 or 4 pages of posters telling her this was all on her and no one else she finally conceded that she should have changed the oil regularly.
However; she still insisted that Nissan manufactures shoddy engines and that the engine should have lasted no matter how much she abused it.
Happens all the time. I know someone who owned a Tercel. Did nothing to it, including checking oil. Eventually the headgasket blew and it overheated. He just kept dumping coolant into it and running it, putting oil in every time the oil pressure light illuminated. Swore Toyota made bad engines. He now drives a Mini that requires premium fuel, and swears it’s a farce and uses regular to save money.
Oh well, it’s his money. I say nothing unless asked.
Why do these stories pain me so? Thats what I want to know…
Maybe the same reason it drive me nuts when someone says they wait until the OLM is at 2% to change oil, or never wash or wax their cars, etc. Someone went to a great deal of effort to make these things and gave up part of their lives to do it, so we should at least take care of what the made.
This is not spam but the Rockauto newsletter this month talked about the variable valve timing solenoid and how important it is to change oil to keep it clean. Here’s part of the article:
Typically the best way for a vehicle owner to protect one of those ingenious VVT systems is to religiously change the engine oil and use the oil viscosity (0W-20, 0W-40, etc.) recommended by the engine manufacturer. VVT systems typically use oil pressure for control. As can be seen in the photo of a Variable Timing Solenoid, small orifices and tight screens can easily be blocked by dirt or oil that is too thick (wrong viscosity).
Honda Blackbird: I check my oil, brake fluid, and coolant every Saturday even though they are always on the full mark. Last month oil was down about a pint. Dealership found a leaking oil pan gasket (warranty repair). I also check tire pressure once per month even though I have TPMS. Decades old habits are difficult to break. I also know of several catastrophic failures caused by lack of simple preventive maintenance. It’s in the owner’s manual! They get what they deserve.
I know…Right? @sgtrock21 you sound like me… Yesterday I was down at the beach having fun under a house in the crawl space…just me…fallen, wet, fiberglass insulation and about 6 inches of water at my feet…all in the confines of about 3.5ft of vertical clearance. Not what most people think of when they are at the beach eh? In that process of the 200 mile round trip… I lifted my hood twice…Gasp ! I checked my oil before I left …then again…also before I returned home…
Such a simple thing…and it occured to me on the second lifting of my hood… This behavior is so ingrained in me that it has become second nature. I mean…you are operating a machine…that puts its livelihood entirely in your hands… It took a lot of time and effort to build this machine…and you are its operator and caretaker. For me…its just what you are supposed to do while operating any machine…it has needs that it cannot fulfill on its own, it has basic requirements…and it doesn’t really ask for much. But what it does ask for…it BEHOOVES YOU…to ensure that it has these things. It all seems so logical to me…But I am told that I am an idiot semi daily, so who knows… 
These things just seem like a natural progression…You operate a Back Hoe…it does a tremendous amount of work for you, it even makes you money…wouldn’t you ensure its operation as best you can? Check your Hydraulic Fluid, your Hydro Lines, look for leaks…Check the boom, the bucket…the controls, the tracks… WHATEV… I don’t even operate a Back Hoe…and I bet I just listed more items to check over or be concerned with than a Back Hoe Operator checks “On the regular”…
I’m mechanically minded, always have been. Ever since I realized the freedom and adventure that a 3.5Hp Briggs n Stratton and a minibike or go kart could afford oneself…I have been forever grateful to machines and feel a kinship with them. These devices rely solely on the attention you give them…to allow them to function…they need care… I guess some people “Care” more than others…and I cannot understand those who “Dont Care” in all of that phrases manifestations.
Funny thing is…this mind set or methodology…transcends machines…a lot of it spills into life in funny ways.
Blackbird
I talked my daughters into checking their own tire pressure when they first got their cars, even though they al have TPMS. After doing this for a while, it became clear that the TPMS and the hand gauge were reading the same level. After that, they just use the TPMS.
Over the years, I have lost count of how many people I’ve encountered who complained about their “crappy” car, but then when I asked them about their preventive maintenance regimen they gave me a blank stare.
I have actually heard a few people say, “All I know is…I put gas in it and it goes”.
Of course, how long it “goes” if you ignore everything other than the gas gauge is another issue entirely…
LOL, yeah VDC, I’ve heard that one a few times myself.
To each his own!
Honda Blackbird: Thank you for explaining why I am the way I am. My Father was obsessed with preventive maintenance for everything. He explained to me at a young age that it was far less expensive to maintain something as opposed to replacing it.
“Funny thing is…this mind set or methodology…transcends machines…a lot of it spills into life in funny ways.”
Yes. I even care about people until they convince me otherwise.