They just discovered a massive oil field in Australia. They’re working a massive new oilfield in North Dakota right now (the one that the Republicans are desperately trying to get the voters to allow them to throw away to offshore corporations, which worked so well for Louisiana, but that’s for another thread). In short, we’re not going to run out of oil any time soon, and if we continue to get smart about searching for alternate energy sources, we won’t run out of oil before we have transitioned to other fuels anyway. The environmental concern we need to worry about is global warming, not global oil starvation.
Having lived in VA, and currently living in MN, I can tell you that we put a lot more salt on our roads than you do As for the meaningless signage, we could use some, apparently, because our drivers are much worse than yours. At any rate, even assuming new technologies and traffic patterns do not require expansion/new construction in 50 years, designing a bridge to last longer than 50 years would be pretty cost prohibitive. Even if you took steps to mitigate salt erosion, there’s nothing you can do to stop thousands of cars and trucks from rolling over it and vibrating every component of the bridge, or weather from lashing the bridge, etc etc.
I am sure they use more halite in MN(its axiomatic)( bridges lasting ? look at railroad bridges or the few and far in between stone arch bridges these things have to be demolished usually,why in the devil do you want to buils a multi million dollar bridge and destroy it with deicing chemicals? And by the way ( not totally relevant ) they use a heck of a lot more salt now then they did when I was a youngun,the buzz about the OCD on the primary roads has to do with strategic routes (somebody is thinking about this all the time ) when you have to evacuate someplace like DC and the coastal areas (high military value ) air travel will not suffice in bad weather,theres a trens going on in these so called resort communities ,in the area where I reside you can control traffic movement in a few minutes with scarcely anyway around it.
As to the stream of dirty hydrocarbons being wrest out of the ground ,do we want to keep evaporating this stuff back into the atmosphere? While CO2 isnt the worst so called greenhouse gas,it has an effect.
It used to be pretty quite around here ,now all you can hear is the annoying drone of a riding mower or the hideous buzz of a string trimmer during mowing season(I have seen some people mowing grass that had a light coating of snow-crazy or what ?)
I have seen by the sidebar this topic last reply was about 3+ years so dont resurrect if if its annoying)
@missileman No it wouldn’t be cost prohibitive, and in fact there are many homes that are already built to survive a tornado, but, and there’s always a but, the home is underground and they do cost a little bit more. The whole thing come down to trade offs. If you want a tornado proof house then you must live this way, if you want a two story home then you can’t have a tornado proof home. You could for about a 10% to 15% premium make a tornado resistant home that is poured concrete that would survive a F3 or a F4.
The Interstates. Our first one opened in 1959 with the standard 4 lanes (both ways). 20 something years later in urban areas they needed 6 lanes. A huge expense was extending all the overpasses. I’m pretty confident that someone in the 1950s knew that would be needed. Of course in the 1980s they extended the overpasses to accommodate 6 lanes. Did someone know that eventually they would need 8 lanes? Of course. Unfortunately many politicians are aware that spending money on things that are not a current emergency could be the death of their career. The future will be someone else’s problem. “What, Me worry?” In 1948 my parents won a brand new Philco (Ford) freezer in a raffle/drawing. I grew up with it humming away in the utility room. In 1973 I was grown and gone. My Father retired and they sold the house and moved to an adult mobile home park. They gave the freezer to my Cousin’s family who had livestock and were avid hunters. They could use more freezer space. The last time I saw/heard it still humming away was 2012.
The purpose of insurance is to cover losses that cannot be economically avoided!!. Safety is a concern, of course, but you cannot completely storm-proof or earthquake-proof your house.
Building codes specify what needs to be done to cover obvious safety needs, but can never go far enough to cover all eventualities.
The San Francisco earthquake caused 50-60 deaths, in spite of its severity.
A similar strength earthquake in Turkey caused many times more (over 1000) deaths because of unenforced building codes and sub-standard construction.
You don’t need to tornado proof the whole house, just one interior room. It would add to the cost of the house but no where near what it would cost to do the whole house.
You don’t get any warning for an earthquake, but earthquake proofing isn’t as expensive as tornado proofing.
I don’t know why we’re talking about this but I noticed the huge damage of the earthquake in Italy and wonder if part of it isn’t all the stone buildings. I wonder if there is little flex in stone buildings rather than wood frame for withstanding the shaking? Tornadoes no, but you can get a lot of damage from a tornado in a stone or concrete building such as roof, windows, interior damage, yard damage, etc. Yeah the house is still standing but a lot of work to do.
My house here in Mexico is rather earthquake proofed. But, the big problem with earthquakes and stone houses, or I guess any kind of house, is resonance. An example of resonance is when you hum at a guitar, you can feel the vibrations.
Earthquakes have random frequencies mostly from less than 20 hz to 2000 hz. My house has reinforced vertical and horizontal beams made by creating a network of 1/2 inch rebar wired tight, and put in forms then filled with concrete mix.
Okay, that is strong. But, the distance between the beams has to be short enough that the wavelength of the frequencies do not resonate that section of the house.
Resonance will literally shake a building to pieces, even if somewhat strongly built.
When we have an earthquake, I saunter to the door, but not until I have my pants on. This house is not going down unless the area is totally flat.
Those stone buildings in Italy perhaps do not have any vertical and horizontal reinforced beams, though that is a guess knowing about buildings here built that way.
In the Italian quake, near 98 % of the demolished buildings were older than 200 years, many of them were build in 14-hundred-something. They didn’t know much of “quake-proofing” buildings back in those times. Though, a school build in 2012 was also flattened. That situation is under investigation as it should have been a safe building.
A major problem with stone and brick buildings is the mortar can’t handle the shear stresses created by earthquakes (the side to side shaking), so the walls just fall apart. Wood is much better, as long as the frame is firmly attached to the foundation.
My house here in Mexico is rather earthquake proofed. But, the big
problem with earthquakes and stone houses, or I guess any kind of
house, is resonance. An example of resonance is when you hum at a
guitar, you can feel the vibrations.
Earthquakes have random frequencies mostly from less than 20 hz to
2000 hz. My house has reinforced vertical and horizontal beams made by
creating a network of 1/2 inch rebar wired tight, and put in forms
then filled with concrete mix.
Okay, that is strong. But, the distance between the beams has to be
short enough that the wavelength of the frequencies do not resonate
that section of the house.
Resonance will literally shake a building to pieces, even if somewhat
strongly built.
When we have an earthquake, I saunter to the door, but not until I
have my pants on. This house is not going down unless the area is
totally flat.
Those stone buildings in Italy perhaps do not have any vertical and
horizontal reinforced beams, though that is a guess knowing about
buildings here built that way.
[Bing] While I was enjoying my stay in the "Governors School for the
Gifted ) we had an earthquake,the prisoners were smart enough to
vacate the shoddy pods ,but the CO wanks made us go back inside
,stupid is as stupid does .Another way to to quake proof buildings is
to decouple the structure from the substrate or make it energy
absorbing( like the sea grasses in the wind )
I don’t know why we’re talking about this but I noticed the huge
damage of the earthquake in Italy and wonder if part of it isn’t all
the stone buildings. I wonder if there is little flex in stone
buildings rather than wood frame for withstanding the shaking?
Tornadoes no, but you can get a lot of…
Well back to cars and roads. On bridges they have bearings that the structure slides on to compensate for expansion and contraction. If they were fastened, I suppose they would buckle. I guess I read the same for earthquake design in Japan that the foundations are on large sliding bearings so there is a disconnect between the earth and the structure. In Minnesota we’re more interested in tornadoes but explains why those old structures in Europe would come tumbling down-and they laugh at us for having temporary housing made of wood.
At any rate safe rooms are gaining in popularity but they like the heavy doors to swing out not in for safety. But I’ve always been concerned that as the house comes down around you, the debris would block the door and you’d be trapped inside the safe room.
Our cabins in MN we have a storm cellar, also houses water heater and main electric panel. Sure we could get buried in there, but hopefully not. The door is a 3x5 plywood lift up thing with concrete floor all around, and there is a window also. If a tornado comes that is where we are,
When you install or build a saferoom in your house, you report it to your local fire department. If a tornado comes through your area, the fire department coordinates search and rescue. Knowing that you have a saferoom and where it is located will help them to find you quickly.
There are other standards about roads that change with time. Here in MO we have lots of older roads and bridges. Some are about destroyed by the deicing chemicals as mentioned but still function. Some of the old depression-era WPA construction is still standing and in service. They used LOTS of cement in that concrete and it seems to hold up well. They also have slanted curbs which throw cars back into the road and into oncoming traffic. This also channels water and turns them into an open water storm sewer during a storm. One of the most intact portions of roadway I can think of like this is a beautiful section of Route 66 near Devil’s Elbow, MO. It is fun to drive but not so much during a big rain. This was built to 1930’s standards just before WWII. It still works but is neat for nostalgia but isn’t the safest. You can bypass this with modern I-44 or an even older Route 66 section if you like.
Then we have quite a few old bridges, even on some of the major river crossings. They seem to be replacing one of these every few years but some of them are quite narrow and have restricted weight limits. These are 1920’s-1930’s era steel bridges. Maintenance has become more of an issue with age because of the corrosion and all but this as well as the fact they don’t meet modern traffic standards has triggered the replacements. Also, the area has more of an earthquake hazard than was realized when these were designed and constructed. They were demolishing an old bridge across the Mississippi River in Cape Girardeau a few years back and the entire thing came down when they were intending to just blow one span into the river, blocking barge traffic. There was apparently absolutely no reinforcement in one of the piers and the stresses from the blast caused it to just topple. Keep in mind that this is in Cape Girardeau, MO which is right on the New Madrid Seismic Zone. This bridge would have almost certainly fallen during a major earthquake. The replacement is a neat looking cable stayed design intended to withstand a large quake.
I have to say that I think these old bridges are neat and will miss them once they are all gone but completely understand why they are being replaced.
With cars, some of the entertainment systems and such are designed to work with certain devices and applications. Will your current car work with your Apple or Android phone 5 years from now? Some of this stuff is a little over the top if you ask me but almost all features of some of the newer cars are computer controlled. You put the car in gear and everything is electronic. There is no mechanical linkage to the transmission.
There was a discussion I started about this because I see how most consumer goods such as lawn equipment and electronics is just being made more and more disposable. The consensus seemed to be that cars are one exception overall except for concerns about the increasingly complicated electronics. As for the mechanics, they are better than ever. Even cheap cars these days use timing chains. Belts seem to be something of the past at this point. IT isn’t that belts are bad but many people don’t change them and with an interference engine, the car is essentially a disposable once the belt breaks. Interference engines are designed that way because the piston/head design in them is more efficient and provides better economy/emissions. I think the move to chains is a good idea in such an engine.
If an engine is toast, because Mr. Cheapskate KNOWINGLY decided to ignore the maintenance schedule, then he might as well point the finger right back at himself
Cars are basically appliances
Treat them well and they’ll do their job
Ignore that at your peril
I have no hatred of timing belts. In fact, I kind of like them. Every so many years, you replace them, and EVERYTHING else under the cover, and you can rest easy until next time.
If you cheap out and don’t replace something, you’re rolling the dice, and one of these days, you’ll lose
I think in the next couple of years, gas powered lawn and garden equipment will be phased out for cordless equipment. I have a cordless chainsaw that I am very impressed with. I’ll never go back to gas.
I’ve been trying to get Mantis to make a cordless tiller but they have resisted me so far. It will probably be longer before riding lawn mowers go electric.
OK. Maybe I’d better buy a couple extra now then to have on the shelf. Electrics are perfectly suitable for little lawns but when you start trying to do an acre every 4-5 days and pull stuff around, they aren’t likely to be there for a while. Of course the feds could always mandate that too and as long as they don’t outlaw goats to take the place we’ll still be OK.
As for the meaningless signage, we could use some, apparently, because our drivers are much worse than yours. At any rate, even assuming new technologies and traffic patterns do not require expansion/new construction in 50 years, designing a bridge to last longer than 50 years would be pretty cost prohibitive. Even if you took steps to mitigate salt erosion, there’s nothing you can do to stop thousands of cars and trucks from rolling over it and vibrating every component of the bridge, or weather from lashing the bridge, etc etc.
