@texasas NOT Sorry if you were offended by a quote from previous president Roosevelt.
@texasas NOT Sorry if you were offended by a quote from previous president Roosevelt.
Interesting. I guess I can post any quotes that pointedly insult large groups and as long as I didn’t say it, no problem…
A quote by me would have no merit in your book, a quote by a former president is not worthy? Dish up what you think is a proper response, or contest what has been previously posted. Talk on and enlighten me.
That is .,what do we do now with the estimated, 12 million immigrants who are here illegally ? OPEN BORDERS IS NO WHERE TO BE FOUND IN MY QUOTE
You may not have said it…bu that’s the outcome. Anyone who gets here ILLEGALLY…let them stay for a while…then give them citizenship. That’s what you’re proposing. So we give them citizenship…then start the process all over again…more illegal immigrants…then after they’re here a while we give them citizenship.
Wow Guys,cure for open borders-restore state sovierngty and annex Mexico ,BTW",TRICKLE DOWN '" in my experience has been "trickle up " the people who have enployed me(good republicans all) now have so much they are very unhappy and want more-while they cannot come close to taking care of what they posses,while I’m getting poorer and becoming more content(forget it Folks,“the shirt of the contented man” is not for sale)-Kevin
@mikeinnh, Two things you keep making up…citizenship and open boarders. You seem fixated on two things that YOU have an issue about, and are trying to find a way to skew the discussion to these topics. I don’t want to sound condescending, but legal status can be temporary work permits or long term and may or may not include a pathway to citizenship. Without legal status, non federal govt. officials often have their hands tied, let alone local hospitals, police and fire depts etc. You need to wrap your mind around the logistics of running state and local municipalities with out comprehensive federal laws to deal with illegal immigration. And, as yet, you still avoid the main point of my original quote. What else do you do with 12 million illegals here, most of whom are established, many with immediate family members who are citizens…huh? Still waiting while we convolute open boarders, your fixation.
“You may not have said it” , heck , I never said anything about open boarders and citizenship. Those are faux news sounding arguments designed to simplify the problem so much so, nothing gets solved.
You want a wild eyed suggestion…pay at least fed minimum wage to make more jobs attractive to Americans, then restrict businesses to the number of legal only aliens they can hire for designated jobs only on temporary work permits. If you do things like this, you restrict access to jobs and lower the number trying to cross illegally.
Otherwise, let’s just rebuild the great wall of China with machine gun implacements…
@mikeinnh, Two things you keep making up.....citizenship and open boarders. You seem fixated on two things that YOU have an issue about, and are trying to find a way to skew the discussion to these topics. I don't want to sound condescending, but legal status can be temporary work permits or long term and may or may not include a pathway to citizenship
Your right I did say citizenship…could also mean permanent resident. But either way…the same thing is happening. What you seem to be proposing is that we allow people to enter this country illegally…and then after a certain number of years we give them access to obtaining permanent residence. How is that NOT open borders???
Please STOP saying I said something when I didn’t. It’s really beneath you.
No where did I say ANYTHING about boarders…Please show me…
You want a wild eyed suggestion.....pay at least fed minimum wage to make more jobs attractive to Americans
Sure I have no problem with that…when did I say I didn’t.
then restrict businesses to the number of legal only aliens they can hire for designated jobs only on temporary work permits
No problem with that either…
I NEVER said anything about tightening the borders…NEVER EVER. Making it less desirable for illegal aliens from WANTING to come here is the BEST way. Make it HARDER for companies to hire illegal aliens…and to make it very very expensive for them if they do.
The Republican Party has no intention to eliminate, extradite or discourage illegal aliens from across the southern border. All the flag waving and humming “Stars and Stripes” while making speeches about border security is just political hoopla. Illegal Mexicans are a gold mine for US small businesses and an anchor on wages for everyone who actually works for a living.
Illegal Mexicans are a gold mine for US small businesses and an anchor on wages for everyone who actually works for a living.
EXACTLY…The way to stop (or really slow down the crossing)…is to make it extremely difficult to find a job here. I think there should be MAJOR fines for companies that hire illegal aliens. So much so that the second or third offense the fines will run you out of business. If your business model can’t survive by hiring people with a LEGAL status here…then you should NOT be in business. Border patrol is NOT working. And probably never will work. You want to stop illegal immigrants…stop the businesses that hire them.
@Mike “What you seem to be proposing is that we allow people to enter this country illegally.” first, let’s get this out of the way…there is no ambiguity in my quote…I NEVER MENTION OPENING BORDERS OR CITIZENSHIP FOR ILLEGALS OR ALLOWING PEOPLE IN HERE ILLEGALLY>>>quote it if you can, but don’t read my mind. I have a wife that does that and don’t need anyone else doing it. It’s you that kept asking me about open boarders, it’s your hang up, not mine…Now, I hear you are accusing me of this “you seem to be proposing that we ALLOW PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTRY ILLEGALLY” Couching accusatory statements behind “basically” and “seem to” makes it difficult for me to really focus on what you mean…just ask if you don’t get a statement.
Instead of saying, it “seems like you mean” or “basically you are saying”, which really POs someone if you’re are wrong (which you are about my quotes), just ASK, "do you mean…or “what do you mean about,exactly” ? Otherwise it becomes a CJ.
But still, the 12 million that are here NOW need to be addressed. To ME that is a separate issue. Borders are both physical and political and illegals need to be addressed, humanely but fairly at the same time you decide how to tighten borders physically and politically.
"Illegal Mexicans are a gold mine for US small businesses and an anchor on wages for everyone who actually works for a living. " What @rod says is absolutely true.
Opportunity of lack of it is the biggest contributory factor in human behavior. Un employed paper mill workers in northern Maine would love to cross the border daily and work work in Canadian paper mills and would willing accept lower wages to do it. They can’t because there is no opportunity to work there ! Their businesses actually cooperate with their govt.
Still asking, for the THIRD time, this is my simple question… what do we do with the 12 million here NOW ?
What you seem to be proposing is that we allow people to enter this country illegally." first, let's get this out of the way...there is no ambiguity in my quote...I NEVER MENTION OPENING BORDERS OR CITIZENSHIP FOR ILLEGALS OR ALLOWING PEOPLE IN HERE ILLEGALLY
But by keep allowing the ones who got here illegally to obtain citizenship or permanent residency is effectively the same thing. They come here illegally…then after so many years they are no longer illegal…then the process starts all over again. When and HOW does it end???
I’ll support giving the 12 million already here illegally…IF AND ONLY IF…we put stronger laws in place to go after the companies that are hiring them…which in turn makes it lucrative for them to come across the border. We can’t keep repeating this cycle…
Still asking, for the THIRD time, this is my simple question... what do we do with the 12 million here NOW ?
If we stop businesses from hiring them…then we will probably see a whole bunch of them leaving.
seems to me that the biggest losers of increased immigration have been the kids, young men mostly, coming out of high school and looking for a job. these kids used to get hired as helpers in one trade or another and succeed or fail, according to their abilities and work ethic. now employers have the choice of hiring some kid who knows nothing, but thinks they know everything, or hiring a 26 year old Spanish fellow with 10 yrs work exp , for the same wage. for many people, the bottom line takes precedence over altruistic feelings or long term benefits to society. the same principle as spending an extra dollar for a product at the local hardware store, who s owner supports the local little league, etc., and shopping at Wal-Mart. we, as a nation, no longer stand together.
“I’ll support giving the 12 million already here legally, if and only if we put stronger laws in place to go after the companies that keep hiring them…”
That my friend IMHO, is what the word “comprehensive” is all about when talking about immigration reform. It’s not about one thing alone and why the past efforts have failed. The problem is, lip service is given to securing the borders physically first by the GOP which is a red herring as securing the borders politically by dealing with hireing practices and jobs as well as those here now is also part of border security. There are few physical borders between Maine and Canada because the political borders are more effective.
Every physical border you put up, creates an opening and problem somewhere else. Boarder control needs secure and well funded points of entry and strong monitoring over easy access areae, not just for illegal immigration but for oher trafficking alone. But, to make that as the sole answer is a recipe for failure. With the thousands of miles of coastline and hopefully, our humane nature, we are never going to succeed by stressing one aspect alone, then move on to the next.
Comprehensive: covering a wide area, every eventuality. the Teaparty mentality that the federal govt. can’t do it or anything right , flys in the face of one undenyable contradiction. They are the only one who can.
That my friend IMHO, is what the word "comprehensive" is all about when talking about immigration reform. It's not about one thing alone and why the past efforts have failed.
And from everything I’ve read in the bill … the bill does NOT have enough teeth or punishment to stop businesses from keep hiring illegal immigrants.
FIRST pass a bill that takes away the incentive for illegal immigrants to come here…THEN pass a bill (IF NEEDED) to give them a path to permanent residence. The problem with these comprehensive bills is that after it goes through the endless number of committees…parts of the bill gets watered down. So instead of having a bill that you’re arguing for…instead we have a bill that just allows illegal immigrants a right to permanent residency…and the incentive to come to the US is still there…and we start the cycle all over again.
The GOP will only give the problem lip service. The answer to end the illegal alien problem has always been to punish those who employ them but that simple solution has been slipped under the rug by Republicans who wrap themselves in their Uncle Sam suits and parade through the streets shouting how we need to be STRONGER at the borders. Such a joke.
That’s what happens when you allow too much influence from the private sector into our government. And the debate goes on !!! An immigration bill is not something you can compromise on one aspect and expect the rest to work.
An immigration bill is not something you can screw up in one way or aspect and allow passage of everything else in tack. It's tough because every thing must be included.
Which means the problem is never fixed…and the cycle continues.
Yep…look at the economy too. They never learn, they just compromise. It runs in cycles as well. Regulation to deregulation to…oops, that didn’t work, back to regulation. But, it’s impossible to get everything right when half your time is spent butt kissing.
Take all the illegals and put them in the military, send them to the middle east, bring our boys home. After 4 years or more, if the illegals have survived, they are granted citizenship once their tour is over