What I’m saying is the Automotive Manufacturer Engineers are saying the Automatic is stronger then the MT…thus the higher towing capacity.
I had a buddy that towed his 15,000 lb 5th wheel trailer with his 3500 Chevy truck. Not a dually, a single with a 454 V8 and a 4 speed manual transmission with a granny low. Never had any problems with the clutch or transmission overheating.
He agonized over getting an automatic in the next truck but bought 3500 dually with a Turbo 400 automatic. No problems there, either. It had a huge factory cooler. Oddly, his turbo-diesel Ford 4500 truck with a 4R100 automatic had transmission problems. Not cooling, it broke 4th gear!
The documentation for that statement could be interesting reading. If they they can prove that with ducumentation, I’m all eyes. Here, both trans’s mostly are equal and in a few cases the a/t has a lower rating, but nearly all has special requirements about cooling (money) with re. to a/t’s - all set by the manufacturer. That is for vehicles sold in Europe.
As we don’t have those “freighters” over here, I cant speak with confidence, but your reply reinforces my feeling: Stay with the m/t.
This towing manual versus automatic will go on forever all I know is that launching a boat on a trailer and taking back out again is a lot easier with an automatic transmission .
I’ve seen some awfully small cars pulling caravans in Germany in the far right lane at about 6-70 kph heading off on Holiday. I’d guess most have manual transmissions, probably in 3rd gear, given the speed, trailer size and noise I was hearing from the cars.
Saw a diesel Mercedes E-touring (wagon) hauling an open trailer with 2 race cars on it at the Nurburgring around 1999. It had a manual, I looked! I was surprised the TUV didn’t stop him considering the trailer length and weight.
There are manual transmissions and there are manual transmissions. Years ago, you could specify a heavy duty three speed manual in a pickup truck over the stsndard equipment light duty three speed manual. The heavy duty three speed manual had a floor shift while the regular lighter duty had a column shift. For even heavier work, a four speed floor shift manual was available. I had a 1950 one ton Chevy pickup with the four speed manual. I found out that my truck had originally belonged to the water works and, no doubt, towed big air compressors for jackhammers, trailers loaded with water main piping and who knows what. After the truvk.wsd retired from the water works, it went through a series of farmers who, no doubt, pulled heavy loads. I used the truck to stretch wire fences. The clutch and transmission were up to these tasks. I certainly would not have attempted to.use a half ton with a light duty for this work. As I understand, pickup trucks are no longer available with manual transmissions. The automatic transmissions that took.the place of the manual transmissions in.pickup.trucks must be able to stand up.to.yowing heavy loads.
This argument of automatic vs. manual transmissions won’t end when we go to battery powered electric vehicles. The motors will.have different windings for different speeds. The automatic vehicles will have a computer to select the motor winding. The manual electric vehicles will have s floor pedal that operates a switch that disconnects the power to the motor while nthe driver selects a different winding. The windings will be selected by a switch shifted by a lever. When changing windings, one kills the power by depressing the pedal that controls that switch. After another winding has been selected, the pedal.is released and power is restored to the motor.
LONG LIVE THE DEBATE BETWEEN MANUAL vs.AUTOMATIC.
Well, a car can be 12 meters here and a car with a trailer can be up to 18 meters, which means that your Toyota Aygo ( 3,6 meters) as a single vehicle can carry a 12 meter flagpole on the roof (horizontal, not vertical) - marked accordingly of course, and (if Toyota allowed the Aygo to tow anything, which they don’t) you can tow a trailer so the whole “roadtrain” reaches 18 meters.
My Minor has net. weight of 1650 lbs, gross weight of 2750 lbs. Allowed gross trailer weight on top of that without brakes 1100 lbs, with brakes 1760 lbs. so I can reach a total of 4510 lbs legally and I’m NOT gonna admit that I have exceeded that numerous times with the brutal force of my 58 hp engine.
The 1100 lbs no brakes limit is general. If you have a Porche Cayenne, no brakes will be 1100 lbs, but with brakes it will be - well, I don’t know, but probably around 5000 lbs.
Btw, there are strict speed limits in Europe when towing.
For good reasons.
Though France haven’t figured that out yet. There you can do 81 mph with a 2 axle trailer on the motorways. Frigging insane and scary.
I tried to look up the german specs for towing on the C-class -99. Only result was for the 115 to 155 hp models of unknown years which was:
No brakes = 1640 lbs.
With brakes = 3960 lbs
As a general rule in my country, your towing capacity for an ordinary car is 90 % of the road wéight of the car (full tank, 155 lbs in the drivers seat, spare wheel and all the essentials (not your mil). For 4-wheel drive cars, it’s typical 1,5 times net weight of the car.
All depending on manufacturer.
Keep in mind that Euro-spec trailers have different weight distribution from US-spec trailers. You tend to see higher ratings over there because they have lighter tongue weights, and it’s expected that they won’t be bombing down the road at 75mph while towing a trailer.
CLOGGING up the road at a blazing 75 KPH maybe!
And what detrimental effects will happen to the other drivers by that?
will they get a substantial amount of time later to their destination?
Will somebody die due to to the delay?
Isn’t it time for all of us to realise, that it it is better for us, your family, the society, the welfare for all of us and for You, personally to slow down a bit and get a more balanced life, which will benefit all. If everybody is so much stressed up by a !"#¤%&/()= trailer - then maybe they should take a serious look at their life.
Easy, easy! Don’t get too wrapped around the axle.
But it is easy to tell me to relax when you aren’t headed down a clogged 4 lane autobahn with both lanes rolling 75 kph because one caravan is running 75.5 kph in the left lane passing while trying to make an international flight home on a Friday evening.
Hah, my back is reinforced with steel and too stiff to get wrapped around anything
I understand Your situation, but I was talkin… WRITING in a general matter.
All too often people (me included) gets upset over something we shouldn’t get upset about.
Over here, it’s time to say good night, but i’ll wish for all of you a pleasant and delightful day.
Hmmm. Loves the Mustang… Speaks like an angry Brit when talking of “caravans…”
… You’re Richard Hammond, aren’t you.
Ya got me!
I was very fortunate to own and drive a lot what I consider the best M/T. My 1963 Ford Galaxie 406 cu in/405hp tri power super high performance came factory stock with a Borg Warner super T-10 aluminum case 4 speed with factory Hurst shifter. It was perfection. I understand why Carroll Shelby insisted on discarding the Ford top loaders and replaced them with this transmission for his 1965 Mustang GT 350s. For work I towed a heavy trailer with a 1,000 pound piece of equipment behind a loaded 1963 Ford utility box pickup. 292 cu in 4 speed compound low M/T. No problems.
This is what it comes down to. If you have a manual that’s designed for heavy use and a proper low/first gear to start in it is an entirely different animal from the light duty manuals that most cars have today. Ditto for automatics. If they are not properly designed and properly cooled they won’t last. The majority of tractor trailers in the US are manual, so one can’t argue that a manual isn’t acceptable for towing, but those are properly engineered for the task and they are starting to convert over to automatics, too (Semis, last of stick shifts, are going automated)
Here in the states it’s getting very difficult to find manuals at all. Even Audi is shipping the last manual-equipped A4s. Part of it is preference and part of it is the fact that newer automatics are better to drive and get as good if not better economy than manuals.
As for electrics, most people don’t realize that diesel locomotives are actually electric, so an electric motor can tow quite effectively, if designed for the task.
…and this is what matters to me. I learned to drive on a manual and drove one for years, but as a practical matter, an automatic is better for my purposes.
At this point, what I have more or less decided to do is pay a company to take the boat out, winterize and store it in the fall, then bring it back in the spring, leaving our odyssey to tow only a small flatbed with light loads around 1000 lbs when needed.
M/T is 100% preference for me. I can drive an automatic with no problems.
The shift to automatics in tractor trailers in the US is not being driven by and mechanical superiority for the automatics, but by the extreme shortage of drivers especially for lower wage carriers and they are trying to entice young people and women into the field most of whom have never driven a manual anything and have no willingness to try. Besides with a mostly rookie work force the toll on transmissions and clutches would probably be pretty high.