Insightful thread!!! 
I take my Honda to the dealer that I bought the car from after about 6 years of use because the ac wasnāt blowing cool air. Cool air is important in Phoenix, Arizona. The car is out of warranty, so what do they tell me? āYuz need a new compressor and that will be $1,200ā I donāt think so. I take it to a known Honda repair place and they tell the system just needs new freon. I think it was $200 or less. It has been awhile so I am not sure about exact cost but I think I am close. So anytime I get the āitās the compressorā line - I take it somewhere else to make sure. I have not taken anything to that dealer again. I know some dealers are good and some are bad, but I really think twice about trusting those guys. Itās like,āBut you bought the car from us - you have to trust us because we are your friend.ā Right.
Discount is where I have been going for years. They fix flats for free. I get the impression at least that they are honest and realize the safety issue if they make a mistake because it truly is all about where the rubber hits the road.
But, if you needed freon, that means you have a leak. The original garage may very well have been getting to the root of the problem, whereas the second garage was only masking the symptoms temporarily.
Itās one thing for people to get ripped off, but itās not a scam just because you donāt want to hear how much a true fix will cost.
Youāre better than I. I wouldāve stormed into that garage and kicked some butt, then alerted the local media that a garage was preying on disabled individuals.
Like, I said, without seeing the tires, I cannot comment for sure. However, saying that all 4 must be replaced because they are radial tires is a scam.
1990 Mazda Rx7 fuel pump replacement. In March 2002 my car failed to start. I could not hear the fuel pump operating so I had it towed to a repair shop (Budget Motors, Salem, OR). They agreed that the fuel pump was at fault but it would take 3 to 4 days to get a new one. 2 days later I received a call that the pump arrived sooner than expected and the car was ready. $669 including 4.5 hours labor but the car ran fine. 4 days later the car would not start with the same symtoms. During this tme I had received a shop manual that I had mailordered. The manual revealed the fuel pump access panel under the rear carpet. It was very easy to reach the fuel pump. Why was I charged 2 hours labor to R and R the fuel tank??? Even worse I discovered that the fuel pump mounting screws had not been touched. They were covered in dirt and rust as was the fuel tank straps and bolts. The only part that showed signs of being touched was the electrical connector. I made a trip to the Mazda dealer and asked if the shop had ordered a fuel pump. Answer no. I also asked what labor flat rate was for this job. Answer 1.8 hours. When I confronted the crooks they swore that they had installed a new pump and that the job required removing the fuel tank. They offered to do the job over. Ha! Ha! I had cleaned the electrical connector and zip tied it together. 8 1/2 years later the car still runs fine. When I reported this to the State Department of Justice they looked at photos and agreed that the repair was not performed. Surprisingly all they could do was write a nasty letter to the scammers.
Ricky L. Coursey
Iāve fallen for a few myself, but I think that mostly I can figure out when Iāve been hadāeventually. Any time thereās a leak you are vulnerable. Who really questions the seiousness of oil spilling or spraying under the car, or the cost to stop it? My son-in-law took his leaking car to a shop I had become wary of. āDeanāsā diagnosis (actual name) called for a new power steering pump. I was going to be in town next day so said Iād take a look at it. The problem was a leaking outlet (pressure) hose. For the same money Dean had quoted, my son-in-law got the problem fixed with a new hose, plus a new water pump and timing belt, and found another mechanic who has treated them well ever since (although he still bears watching!).
Weāre from Michigan. Last year on a trip to South Dakota with our Travel trailer, I had a free brake check at Sears in Rapid City, SD. Just wanted to make sure everything was good on the way back. My brakes were fine but the mechanic at Sears told me that my rear-end was going out on my 2002 Yukon XL. I made an appointment for the next morning to have my rear-end redone at a place Sears recommended before the trip back home. That evening I had second thoughts and called my friend at a GM facility in Grand Rapids, MI to tell him about our dilemma. Sears had told me that the repair would probably exceed $1000. My friend in Michigan just flat out told me that I shuld not concern myself with their advice if I donāt hear any noise from the rear end and the vehicle is driving normally. So I didnāt go back to the appointment in the morning but rather we drove home trailer in tow. I did stop into a GM dealership somewhere on the way home and was told the rear differential was a bit low on fluid and they topped it off. Been driving happily ever since.
Last week I had a vehicle inspection with the same vehicle at Midas in Benton Harbor, MI. I was told that I have a bad battery. Did not get a printout from their machine. Took it in to WalMart for a second opinion and to possibly purchase a new battery. My battery is fine! Got an OK printout from WalMart. Another $90 bucks saved!
Wow, this thread has got to be the longest in Car Talk history.
248 posts. Alot are true complaints. Others are misunderstandings due to communication problems or lack understanding the auto industry.
Its a shame only 11 posts were posted on finding a solution to the way mechanics get paid or how rip-off scam artist qualify as mechanics or shops.
When I posted my question āwhats the solutionā which I could only access through my e-mail for some reason, I thought more people would weigh -in on how to solve the repair scam issue.
If its more regulation and training, so be it. Apathy and frustration will not solve these issues
Good post; there are many reasons for the scams. The worst reason, and this was tried on me twice, is the commission system for service managers and mechanics. Theyāve tried this on my wife numerous times, and she always calls me up when this happens, and I always have to tell her that the car does not need it. She also has Xeroxed copies of all past repairs right in the car, which she shows the guy.
The second source of scams is the seasonal promotion campaigns which are dreamed up by the marketing departments. The service guys are brainwashed into pushing these āsevicesā by scaring customers. Right now the local paper has at least 10 such programs (prepare for winter) advertised.
As a solution I offer getting rid of the commission system, increasing wages for the guys actually doing the work, and some penalty system for misleading and outright corrupt practices. Service writers need more training in how cars actually work as well. In the retail business there are a lot of laws already to keep the businesses in line. Home construction has some tough laws already. āMechanicās Lienā is getting to be an outdated concept. We need something to replace it.
I am an old shade tree mechanic from years back. I hate working on cars so for anything major I usually it to the shop. However, when I do use a new shop I always act like I know nothing mechanical just to see how they respond. The scammers usually show their true colors fairly quickly.
New in this part of town I took my ?88 F-150 to Car-X to get the front brakes checked. Before they even got it off the ground they started finding multiple suspension issues (in their defense one of the several issues was legimate). After checking it out on the lift the manager went over the ?needed? repairs and showed me the different quality of brake pads they could install. I asked several questions and the BS meter quickly pegged. When I started talking about waiting to get it repaired I saw the manager give a quick, short nod to the mechanic who came running in immediately to tell me that my rear brakes were in bad shape and also needed replacing. Dropping the ignorant act I asked to see the back brakes but was told the mechanic had already put the drum and wheel back on and they only way I could see them was to pay to have it removed again. Had it checked out elsewhere and I did need front brakes and a ball joint, but nothing else. Saved several hundred dollars by not using Car-X
My wife took her ?88 Mustang to Goodyear for new tires (z-rated tires were manufacturer recommended). While replacing the tires the mechanic ?discovered? brake fluid leaking out of a rear brake cylinder. When they showed it to her she started asking questions like 1) why is the leaking brake fluid clear instead of dark like the rest of the fluid in the system, 2) why hasn?t the leaking brake fluid penetrated the brake dust on the backing plate, 3) why isn?t it on the inside of the wheel or the inside/outside of the brake drum, 4) why isn?t the fluid level low in the master cylinder, and so forth. They couldn?t answer her questions. Had car checked at a reputable shop immediately and they found no issues. They had just squirted brake fluid around to imitate a problem. Several months later a friend of hers said her husband had worked briefly for Goodyear and inventing unnecessary repairs was normal.
Wife?s Mustang developed an exhaust leak. Took it to several local and chain shops, each said that the entire dual exhaust system had to be replaced, each quoted a small fortune. A friend recommended a local shop, Southern Safety in Grandview, MO (also in the Car Talk Mechanics File). They found that the cross-over pipe was rusted thru and replaced it for under $20, good for several more years. That was almost 20 years ago and they have had a loyal customer ever since, and many recommendations.
A friend took his small pickup to Goodyear who was having a tire sale. He picked out the tires he wanted from the wall display and they wrote up the ticket. We left and came back a couple of hours later and his truck wasn?t ready. They were short a tire and were waiting on it to be delivered. We were in a hurry so he checked the tire on the wall display and since it was the correct size so he asked them to just use it instead. After several excuses the service manager they finally admitted they were putting on different tires, a cheaper model. He immediately demanded they put his old tires back on so he could leave. They then told him that couldn?t be done as his old tires were gone. He raised hell until they ?found? and remounted them. Unfortunately the service manager wasn?t bright enough to know when to stop the con. He actually tried to charge my friend for remounting and balancing the original tires.
I have also experienced the Jiffy Lube air filter/pcv valve/transmission flush/differential fluid/air conditioner recharge/whatever else shuffle they try to pass off on unsuspecting people. I do agree that often some of these repairs might be needed but the unfortunate way they try to sell them is shameful. My ?88 F-150 has a K&N air filter with the Do Not Replace sticker clearly displayed on the top of the air filter box. Over the years these ?well-meaning? mechanics have also managed to strip/knock off the 3 of the four nuts that hold the air filter cover on. To simplify access I now just use 4 small wire ties thru the bolt holes to secure to air cover top. A wire tie set I bought years ago had 3 different colors in it so I also use all three colors to make a con harder. Even though I ask for an oil change only they almost always come out to tell me how dirty my air filter is. Unfortunately not one has noticed the K&N sticker nor cut the wire ties to actually get to the filter. The song and dance routine they go thru is priceless when I point the facts out.
A possible scam. Another friend who is not mechanically inclined took his 2 year old Honda to Midas, I don?t remember the reason. While inspecting it they found that the brake lines needed to be replaced which he did to the tune of several hundred dollars. When he told me about it I thought he meant the flexible hoses that attach to the front wheels. No. They actually replaced the metal brake lines from the brake master cylinder to the wheels. It seems that the movement of brake fluid thru these lines wears them out. I did not actually see this so I can?t confirm/deny but it sure pegged my BS meter.
Feel free to remove the business names if you need to. I just believe in giving credit where credit is due.
My spouse bought a brand new Mini Cooper S in 2006. Each time she took it to the dealer for general maintenance, they would tell her that the wheels needed balancing or alignment. Whatever. $250 at Mini; $70 at Sears. Now, I have purchased every possible maintenance contract and coverage that Mini had to offer but have now run into the āDealer Recommendationā which is not covered under any of the maintenance agreements. The agreements cover only āFactory Recommendations.ā Last time, it was the fuel system maintenace $500. Yesterday, the cooling system - $275. Today, they get a piece of my mind. It is better for me to have the car breakdown for whatever reason because I have so much coverage. In fact, by following the Dealer Recommendations Iām probably saving Mini a ton of money because they donāt have to fix whatever breaks for free. Iām a frustrated Robopop.
Iāve been told on several occasions that my brakes āare dirty and need to be cleaned.ā My understanding is that brakes are supposed to be dirty, and dirt does not affect how they function.
Our local GM dealership also tried to tell us our air filter needed replacing when we had replaced it recently, as well as the dirty brake nonsense. GM is currently offering free tire rotations and oil changes for GM car owners. Clearly they are trying to make up the difference with bogus repair suggestions. I will continue to go there for the free oil changes, but you can bet I will not have them do any other work with out getting a second opinion from a shop I trust.
A number of years ago, I used to work with a man who was a former Service Manager at a large ābig threeā car dealership. He told me that they pulled a lot of stuff on people. One of the most shocking was that people would drop off a late model high end car for the day, expecting some minor service or an oil change. The dealership would pull the low mileage engine out of the car, and replace it with a high mileage engine! Who would expect such a brazen scam! I could believe it, seeing some of the other rip offs going on.
I have a 1998 Subaru Legacy Outback wagon that I bought new. Iāve been the only owner in its now 12 year life. In 2003, when the car was 5 years old and had 58,000 miles on it, my independent Subaru āexpertā mechanic told me it was time to replace the timing belt. My three previous cars had been Hondas whose manuals suggested timing belt replacement at 60,000 miles, so I didnāt question him. A few weeks after the fact, I happened to look at my Outback owners manual and saw that the recommended mileage for timing belt replacement on this car was 90,000! Suffice to say, I never went back to this so-called Subaru expert. And by the way, I didnāt hit 90,000 until early 2008, almost 5 years later! The moral of this story is READ THE MANUAL.
All 2002 VW Jettaās require a proper VW spec. oil. It does not matter which engine or if it is a diesel or turbo.
You should check the owners manual and it will give you a specification that the oil must meet. Oils that do not meet this spec. will destroy the engine in the long run.
VW has had huge problems with thier engines as of late if people do not use a correct oil.
Besides, $60 is cheap for any oil change that will meet any spec. VW has for this car.
Always remember the manufacturer wants you to have as little trouble as possible while you own the car so you will buy another new one later.
The manufacturers maint. schedule is the one that you should follow. They built it and designed it. Anything the dealer wants to add on to the maintenance that the manufacturer does not call for is not needed for maintenance purposes. It is just a way for them to make a little extra on each visit.
Now a repair that is found during the maint. inspection is a different thing all together.
I dont have a Subaru manual handy, as I havent been around one for quite some time, but isn`t it 90,000 miles OR 5 years?
you are absolutely right docnick
Tech 1906, the scam you mentioned must have happened in 1906. The engine variations and the systems that control them change at a rapid pace today.I canāt imagine a sales or service dept having the money to pay a mechanic to do this , especially if the cab or cradle of a vehicle has to be removed.