When a Daewoo pulls into the driveway those tools get put away and are forgotten about.
To be honest, Iāve never personally owned a Daewoo or even known anybody that did
Iāve seen very few of them on the road
If I recall correctly, they were only sold here for a few short years . . . ?
That OTC fuel injector tester has the correct plug to test these fuel injectors. The fuel injectors are accessible once the decorative cover is removed from the engine, however to actually remove the fuel rail and replace any injectors, the throttle body must be removed. Is there any specific fuel pressure test kit youād recommend? I searched on Google, but most of them have several bad reviews complaining about poor quality.
As I said, there are several brands
Since your fuel rail has a test port . . . I read that correctly, didnāt I . . . the otc 5630 would do just fine
If you want something with more adapters, otc 4480 might be right up your alley
Astro also has plenty of automotive tools, but Iāve never owned any astro tools, so I canāt comment about the quality. I own several otc tools, though, and have no complaints
On a Daewoo? I donāt think so. Iāll check at work tomorrow. As far as aftermarket scan tools thereās a Solus Ultra, a Solus Edge, a Verus, a Genysis, and an Autel, and I donāt think any of them will access a Daewoo outside of generic OBD-II. If someone needs service requiring more than just nuts and bolts on a Daewoo, we politely decline and refer them to the dealer. Thereās no money to be made working on those cars.
I have a Solus Edge . . . I just looked, and Daewoo doesnāt even appear on the list
Weāve established the brand wasāt very popular here . . . GM marketed them here for a short while?
I never said there was
I guess this whole discussion is a good illustration of why you should think twice about buying an āorphanā car
I just looked on wikipedia . . . apparently opās Lanos is considered a predessor to the Aveo 
Just for kicks and giggles, Iāll check our old Tech 2 at work on Tuesday to see if Daewoo appears as a choice for the 2002 model year
FYI, Daewoo produced the Chevy Aveo from 2002-2011. I would use the Aveo as an alternate source of information, tools and parts.
I find this statement very interesting. There is, or should be, money to be made working on ANY car, as long as the owner is interested in having it repaired correctly, and willing to pay your shopās prices. And your shopās management and technicians should be willing to work on ANY vehicle for a willing customer, as long as it is in safe condition.
The fact that someone owns a low-value economy car does not necessarily imply that they are not a good customer, and there are many people own luxury-type vehicles but lack the ability or willingness to pay for a proper fix. In fact, we hear on these boards all the time about people who own luxury models which are still new enough to be under warranty, and they donāt want to pay for the recommended fuel.
So I got off work early today, and bought the OTC fuel pressure gauge, and a new fuel filter (WIX brand).
The car was last driven Saturday night, and when I hooked up the pressure gauge it was at 0 PSI. I turned the key directly to āonā without starting the engine, and it went to 38 PSI. I started the engine, which took several tries, and it was running really rough, and the pressure gauge had dropped to 36 PSI. I moved the throttle to simulate pressing the accelerator, and the fuel pressure dropped to 34 PSI. The engine has been off for about 10 to 15 minutes now, and I looked at the gaugeāit had dropped to 31 PSI.
I guess itās time to try the replacement fuel pump and change the fuel filter, so I will post back once that is doneā¦
I think you are missing the point. It is not about whether the person will be a good customer . It is that an old orphan vehicle could take a long time to find parts and other issues could show up. The shop then has an impatient customer , a vehicle in their way and possibly a repair charge that the customer does not agree with.
The fuel pressure spec is 41 - 47 psi key on, engine off
Hereās a few more things you can check . . .
with the engine off, remove the vacuum hose from the fuel pressure regulator. Does the hose smell like fuel, or does fuel drip out? If so, you replace the fuel pressure regulator
If you have a handheld vacuum pump, try to pull a vacuum on the regulator. Does it hold?
Hook everything back up, including the fuel pressure tester
Start the engine and let it idle
Now pull off that vacuum hose from the fuel pressure regulator
Did the fuel pressure indicated on the gauge change?
Uhhh, no. You yourself have found that factory level scan tools are $3000 for a used one. I see a Daewoo in the shop maybe 3 times a year. I charge $120 for an engine performance diagnosis. If out of that $120 $60 is profit I can use to pay for that tool, I would recoup my money in 16 years. How much of my money am I supposed to spend to fix your car?
Letās say I do take the car in and find a failing widget. Now I can get a widget for a Camry, a Jetta, or a Silverado in an hour or two, but widgets for Daewoos are made of unobtainium. So now the car is tying up space while weāre waiting for parts. Another reason to pass on the job.
Thatās not to say we donāt work on Daewoos. Just that there are certain areas of service and repair that we pass on.
I am both management and tech at my job, and I have the final say as to whether we punt on a car. Letās say you bring us a Porsche, you tell us itās not running properly. I tell you that the shop does not have the proper scan tools to access your engine control system, that the shop does not have the proper hand tools to work on your fuel injection system, and none of the mechanics here have ever been under the hood of a Porsche. Furthermore since we donāt have the proper tooling and experience anything we do is likely to take twice as long as the dealer, so I will have to charge twice the price. And last I will not be responsible for anything that goes wrong as the result of lack of equipment or training. No competent manager would take on a job like that and only a fool of a customer would agree to it.
Working on makes of cars for which the shop is not properly equipped is bad for the shop and bad for the customer.
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So I installed the junkyard fuel pump, and a new fuel filter today. The reason for the delay was because I had to manufacture a custom tool that would mate with the lock ring and apply sufficient torque. This took a lot of time and frustration to get it right.
Anyways, replacing the fuel pump did not give the improvement I had hoped for, though the fuel gauge now works. The misfire is still there.
With the engine idling in āPā and fully warmed up, the fuel pressure pulsates from 35-36 PSI. I had my wife get in and press the accelerator, and rev up the engine a little, the fuel pressure dropped to 34 PSI steady. If I remove the vacuum hose from the fuel pressure regulator, the pressure increases to 43 PSI, and the additional air being drawn into the engine doesnāt make it run any worse. With the key turned to āonā and the engine not running, itās 40 PSI.
After I had my wife rev up the engine for maybe a minute or so, the check engine light was blinking, and stayed blinking until I turned the engine off. There are two codes stored in the computer: P0300āRandom/Multiple Cylinder Misfire Detected and P1618-- PCM/ECM Internal SPI Communications Fault.
Any ideas?
The fuel pressure data seems improved compared to what you were reporting before which seemed too high. Has the negative % fuel trim data improved as well?
As the engine warms up, the fuel trim goes more and more negative, eventually reaching -15.6%. With the engine turned off, after 10 minutes the fuel pressure bleeds down from 36 PSI to 31 PSI. So nothing has changed, other than the fuel gauge now works. BTW, this fuel pump is an Airtex E8514M, same as the one which was in the car. I have heard a lot of people complain about the quality of Airtex brand fuel pumps, but all of the fuel pumps available for this car are no-name brands.
The -15% LTFT indicates thereās a pretty severe problem remaining somewhere. Google what a negative fuel trim means. That will give you some clues where to look. One cause of that is too high of fuel pressure, but apparently that wasnāt it for your case.
Have you tried swapping the fuel injectors yet?
I discussed my findings with a friend of a friend who is a professional mechanic. He is familiar with this engine, as used in the Chevrolet Aveo. According to him, the used fuel pump is defective, as it only reaches 38 PSI (spec for this car is 41-47 PSI), however he does not believe that a defective fuel pump and/or fuel injectors could cause the RPMs and ignition timing to jump around. He also thinks that on this engine, it is possible to damage the camshaft position sensor while changing the timing belt.
His advice was to purchase and install a new fuel pump, new camshaft position sensor, and new crankshaft position sensor. He also suggested that after replacing the fuel pump, I should disconnect the ignition coil for safety, pull the fuel rail out of the cylinder head, turn the key to āonā to pressurize the fuel system, and see if any of the injectors drip fuel. If not, then donāt replace the injectors.
That advice seems a step in the right direction.
From what I see that spec applies when the ignition is āonā but the engine is not running. When the engine is running it will be less. I donāt see the spec for the fuel rail pressure when the engine is running however. Whatever it is, it should be very steady at idle.
Note that the fuel pressure spec for the 2004 Chevy Aveo 1.6L engine is 55-62 psi for the same conditions. Not the same as your engine.
An injector stuck in the āonā position could cause negative fuel trims & a lower than expected fuel pressure. It could also cause the engine rpm to wander. It might make sense to do the final test as the first step.
The ignition timing will change when the engine rpm changes. That part is normal.
I once fought with a car that was running poorly but only intermittently. It sounds like these conditions can be replicated on your car so what I am about to say may not apply.
You might check and clean the sensor grounds for this car. Unbolt them and clean all the surfaces, then re-assembly after coating with silicone grease to prevent future corrosion. I cleaned then with fine sandpaper and wiped down with a rag soaked in carb cleaner, then applied the grease and put it back together. I fought with strange problems for months and it was all fixed in less than 10 minutes! I was mad but happy at the same time. This sounds like some type of electrical/communications problem so is worth a try.
Definitely try not to get the car up to the speeds/RPMs where the check engine light is flashing. A check engine light isnāt good but a flashing one can mean imminent damage is about to occur.
My GF had the Suzuki Reno/Forenza and this thing had a few electrical gremlins I never quite tracked down and took car of before she got rid of the car. Her battery was started to get weak and that may have been the issue. You might check the battery voltage and make sure the charging system is working properly as well. I doubt the fuel pressure is the whole deal as it isnāt that far out of spec. Donāt just start throwing parts at this thing. I would suspect an electrical/sensor problem before anything else, especially with the timing and all jumping around.
As for people not wanting to service something like this, I can see several reasons why people donāt want to do this.
- The $3000 piece of equipment may never be used again. This isnāt like buying something specific to an F-150 or a Camry. That would be a different story as they are extremely common. The transmission range sensor/neutral safety switch went out of the GFās Reno which was a common issue with those. There was a $200+ alignment tool which was nothing special you were supposed to use during installation. I chose not to buy it and instead eyeballed the position based off the position of the old sensor. This was obviously 99% correct as about 1/100 times a ātransmission sensor calibration codeā came up. This was solved when she would put the car in park, turn it off, and restart. Obviously my eyeballing method was pretty close but not quite perfect. It was a nuisance but definitely something that could be lived with. I figured any attempts to solve the issue myself would just make it worse.
- Lower end cars/equipment often have owners who donāt want to pay but expect great service. This seems to be an issue around here and I suspect it is that way all over. I service IT equipment and have far more problems with people who have bought a computer from Wal-Mart than something of a better grade. Every industry has āthe Wal-Mart gradeā and mechanics may see this as āa Wal-Mart car.ā For this reason it is a good idea to work on it yourself. If you plan to keep it a while and fix it up, the special scan tool might not be a bad idea. This car may be your baby but the mechanic might not see it that way.