I remember some state made vegetable derivative license plates but quit because dogs were eating them. Pre internet history it seems.
Aluminum plating doesn’t work well on steel. Stainless tubing would have worked better much better. The plastic coating is OK. Washing the car and then driving on the same roads accomplishes almost nothing.
Take away stability control and anti-lock brake systems and we could afford to maintain what we have. We’re too busy fighting electronic fires to prevent real flames from happening. Then there is all the extra brake tubing just waiting to rust through. We can’t solve every problem by adding more parts to them.
@pleasedodgevan: When was the last time you had a major problem with ABS? I finally retired my old 1994 vehicle and while it had problems over the years, the ABS was never one of them.
The Problem Isn’t The Brake Lines.
HELLO! … The Problem Is The #$&*% Salt!
I suppose salt made more sense when cars only lasted to less than 100,000 miles before major mechanical wear made their replacement necessary and salt was cheap, very cheap.
However, times have changed. Cars, mechanically speaking, are able to endure many more miles and therefore many more years. Salt has become more expensive, recently and it’s availability has begun to be problematic.
Time for other solutions to make roads safer in winter driving conditions! I hate the stuff, even on my food!
CSA
Hot dip aluminum plating (Aluminizing) works on steel strip for applications like building panels, but not for brake lines. The Aluminizing tends to pop off when it is bent too much. We tried Aluminizing wire in the late 1970s for wire strand, but it didn’t work. The first time we tried to strand it, we ended up with a big pile of aluminum particles beneath the strander. When we looked at the particles an the surface they came from, we decided no to try that again. Still, there was a good market in building panels, along with galvanized building panels.
I have a chain link fence built wit aluminized mesh instead of galvanized. It is 45 years old and has not rusted yet. The gates and posts were made with galvanized and have had to be painted many times.
Oblivion, ABS problems with 10 year old cars are quite common around here, brake lines are not the only things destroyed by salt. Any kind of sensor no matter how seemingly well protected. Even taillights with no cracks and perfectly intact gaskets have salt inside of them.
The drivers side rear brake pads on my 2012 Toyota Camry were completely worn out by 20000 miles because of corrosion binding up all the parts. The other side that doesn’t get salt splashed as much by other cars looked like new. Salt damage is not covered by warranty. The dealer does offer to clean and lubricate them for $100 per axle every year.
This is a transportation story. A few years ago a local entrepreneur developed a non-petroleum based grease for railway curves, to eliminate squealing and reduce friction. The government had legislated that in National Parks no petroleum products could be wasted, and that included a non mineral lube for chain saws as well.
It turned out the grease on the tracks magically disappeared, the local grizzly bears were feasting on it! The product was modified with a foul tasting (also organic) additive that turned the bears off.
Apparently Volvo and some other European carmakers have been using a 90-10 copper-nickel alloy for their brake line for quite some time. 90-10 copper-nickel is inherently corrosion resistant and superior to coated steel for use in brake lines. Of course, it costs more.
http://www.copper.org/applications/automotive/brake-tube/hydraulic_brake_tube.html
As usual, this “problem” of rusting brake lines has already been solved technically, but the bean counters won’t implement the solution because of cost.
Old timer 11, your fence was probably aluminized after weaving. Aluminizing wire would not take the bends required for hurricane fence without flaking the coating off.
For oblivion, the problem is too many brake lines with the ABS. Not usually a problem but they rust too. There is some inconvenience when you have to bleed the brakes on a car with ABS.
Good story @Docnick. Reminds me of a time I was shoeing a girls horse. She complained the whole hour I was there about the owner of the farm and their chickens. The chickens would walk around every car that parked and peck all the dead bugs from the grill, fenders, etc…
The was the type that much went over her head and I’d sure she was from the low end of the gene pool.
Just as I was packing up, I interrupted her and stated that I had read that the auto makers were adding crushed egg shells to the paint to harden it and that the chickens were just taking it out on her car. She sucked that story up like a sponge and retold that story to everyone who would listen.
Yosemite
Welcome to the rust belt!
I grew up in the BIG rust belt…and lived in the North East my whole life. Never had a problem or ever heard of anyone having a problem with brake lines rusting out from the outside due to road salt. What is GM NOT doing that other manufacturers are?? That’s a rhetorical question.
GM is claiming it’s a maintenance issue…I’ve owned GM vehicles before and never read anywhere in the owners manual that my brake lines need to be replaced after 10 years of driving on salted roads.
Here in Wisconsin many cars older than 10 years will have lines that need to be replaced. I’ve had many that are seized from rust at the flare nut…where the hard line meets the flexible lines.
If I heat them up with a torch, 50% will loosen up, and the rest will just twist the line until it breaks…which doesn’t take make much.
Yosemite
My Dad’s '63 Dodge and my '81 F250 had brake lines fail from exterior rust. Nothing new.
“What is GM NOT doing that other manufacturers are??”
Many things . . .
But just to keep things fair, Toyota is also pretty good at messing up, and trying to hide it
Based on some Rust Belt cars that ended up in OK I don’t see GM as being the sole car maker affected by salt issues.
jtsanders, I believe you are right because there was extra material where some of the links crossed.
Brake lines are bent before they are put into new cars, I don.t see why they can’t be aluminized then.
As far as the NHTSA findings, it is just the same as the rollbacks on truckers hours of service rules. When big business money talks, it isn’t E F Hutton listening, it is your government.
I have not found that it is only GM vehicles that have the problem of rusting brake lines. I find in all makes and models that I work on.
On a side note, I find that most of the rusted through areas seem to be at the flare nut, or a bracket that holds the line in place and supports it. Even if there is a rubber sleeve between the line and the bracket…I still see it. Also much of the major rusting is from mid front door to the wheels.
I also find that many are rusted out worse, when there is a shield protecting the lines. I think that here in the rust belt, the salt laden slush is thrown under the car and through the shield (many are only a grate type cover to protect against stones etc. ). That slush sits, surrounding the lines for many days until the weather warms enough for it to melt and during that time it is saturating the lines in salt.
Yosemite
Based on some Rust Belt cars that ended up in OK I don't see GM as being the sole car maker affected by salt issues.
Agree 100%. In fact GM and Ford BODIES still hold up better then Toyota’s. Japanese vehicles til the mid 80’s were total rust buckets in 4 years living in the rust belt.
What I’m not seeing is brake lines rusting out due to road salt on any Japanese vehicle I owned in the past 30 years. My 98 Pathfinder had the original lines and looked great when my daughter sold it to her ex a few years ago with almost 500k miles. Before she sold it I put a new set of pads on the front.
Never had any issues with brake lines from my GM cars from the 60’s either. So what did they change?? And more importantly…WHY?