Here’s my question: why SHOULD the Model 3 or the rest of the EVs be popular? CO2 emissions? It takes anywhere from 3 to 8 years for one to recover the CO2 emissions from making all those batteries. And that’s compared to an ‘average’ gasoline-powered car. I think a ‘regular’ (non-plug in) hybrid is the ‘sweet spot’ in minimizing car emissions.
Oh, but hugging trees makes one feel terrific and giving back to the planet is so responsible in the age where Man-Made Global Warming, er sorry… rather Man-Made Climate Change will soon drown all polar bears and flood the cranberry farms (I have one near me!)!
We all want to do our part, right? I’m always looking for ways to give back and save the planet. 
CSA
And I’m saying even if CO2 emissions are a priority, are EVs the answer?
For the same reason the Model T should have been popular. It didn’t do anything a horse and wagon couldn’t do. The accelerator and brake were a lot harder to operate than the controls for a horse. You had to stop all the time and pour expensive, foul-smelling liquid into it to keep it running, but the horse only needed hay and oats. When it overheated you just sat on the side of the road until it cooled down, whereas the horse had much better thermal regulation.
If you got stuck, you could just unhitch the horse from the wagon and keep going. Can’t do that with a Model T. The horse could comfortably transport you along the narrowest deer trail, but the Model T required wide roads and if the roads weren’t maintained well it bogged down.
When the horse broke down you called a vet and spent a little money for him to come out and fix it. When the car broke down you had to hitch it to a horse and pull it into town to a garage and pay a lot of money for the mechanic to fix it.
And so forth.
The real story is that the Model T was in many ways superior to the horse, just as EVs are in many ways superior to gas cars. Are they superior in every way? No. But neither was the Model T superior in every way to a horse. Overall you came out the other side with something better, and that’s why people adopted the automobile and relegated the horse to leisure activities.
You do know that the phrase was changed because of dopes who can’t manage to wrap their brains around the concept that localized weather is different from climate and therefore just because it’s snowing in January in Minnesota does not mean global warming is a hoax, and they also couldn’t understand the concept that overall average temperature increases can lead to temporary cooling effects due to higher evaporation and cloud formation rates, right?
The science didn’t change. The branding changed to try and accommodate dopes. I don’t personally agree with that branding change, because I think we should leave the dopes behind and get on about the business of fixing what we broke, but trying to explain things in terms dopes can comprehend does not invalidate the science no matter how much you may wish it to be so.
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You keep repeating that figure of 300 miles. Where did you get it? The expensive model? Forgetabboutit, few can afford that car…
For the most part, those numbers put out by the EV manufacturers are likely to maximum, under best case scenarios. There is real world data that shows about a 30% reduction in range for cold climate operation in the Bolt and Leaf. Now factor in that advertised range is when the battery is brand spanking new as well. The capacity of the pack will degrade over time. If we take the Tesla 3 with a 250 mile range, it drops to 175 miles for cold temp operation (heaters, battery efficiency, etc). Now factor in headlamps on during both sides of your commute in winter, some aging of the pack, etc and that number gets closer to being a concern for quite a few people. It’s not such a huge margin anymore…
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How, exactly, is a Model 3 better than, say, a Prius?
edit - with regards to pollution or to CO2 output, that is. A 3 is simpler, in that there’s no IC engine (but I’d pick the Prius over the 3 on reliability, at least based on other Teslas). But that’s not what Tesla sales are all about, is it? They’re selling the ‘green’ of it all…
It’ll be better for me because I’m sure I’ll have way more Tesla Dealers near me than I do Toyota Dealers… Oh wait! I don’t have any of those, either. 
Part of the magic of GM cars for me is that they actual have a usable dealer network. I have many GM dealer choices here. The other part of it is that folks around here don’t buy foreign brands. 
CSA
Thanks for the science lessons. 
I didn’t just fall from the turnip truck! 
I didn’t recall that from my 70s university Environmental Science classes that I took when the earth was cooling and we were entering the next ice age (which are cyclical, by the way).
Now we are heating up at an alarming rate! It has to be man that is causing it. Soon we’ll be cooling again, but no matter, we’ve got it covered now… Voila! Climate Change!
CSA
Because the Prius still uses gas. Which is fine right now, but even a Prius owner is going to be hurting once gas is 5-7 bucks a gallon. Meanwhile the guy with the Tesla is paying about what you’d pay to dry a couple of loads of clothes to charge the car up for another 300 miles (and yes, I’m going to keep saying 300 miles because that’s the version people are going to buy).
Oh - just saw your edit. Well the pollution thing is kind of impossible to quantify. A lot of the power where I live comes from nuclear and wind, so if I had a Tesla in my garage I’d be causing less pollution than the guy in Kentucky who’s powered by coal.
But it should probably be pointed out that the Kentucky Coal Mining Museum is now 100% solar powered, which should give us an idea of where high-polluting power generation technology is headed.
And the cool thing about EV is that it can only become less polluting as time goes on. As coal plants are replaced by less or non-polluting alternatives, then the pollution generated in service of powering the EV goes down. The Prius will never pollute less than it does the day it leaves the dealership.
All that entirely aside, while I am pleased at the potential for environmental friendliness, I’m also honest enough to admit that I don’t make that a priority in my car buying decisions. I bought an Acura TL. I could have gotten an Insight or a Prius for what I paid for the Acura, but I got the Acura because I liked it better. Not polluting isn’t going to be a driving factor in my next car buying decision, especially since one factory is going to belch out a whole lot more pollution than an entire neighborhood worth of cars.
But not having to pay exorbitant prices for gas - now that’s an attractive proposition. Not having to get oil changes. Not having to change brakes as much. Eliminating most of the maintenance/repairs I have to deal with today because the parts that I have to maintain and fix aren’t in the EV. All those make EVs a very attractive idea.
That’d be more like 10 loads, since you apparently can’t wrap your brain around the concept of “a couple.”
;-]
Fair point, but I think my overall point stands that when you can “fill the tank” for 11 or 12 bucks, that’s a lot cheaper than what it costs to fill the gas tank.
Well, I’ve been easily driving 300 miles in my Insight for $12.00 all summer.
;-]
Still gonna be able to do that when the price of gas doubles?
Don’t hold your breath on that. It could be years, shale oil has changed the market.
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Frankly, my ideal “S[paghetti] Hits the Fan” vehicle would be a 1/2 ton pickup, with something like an IDI Ford, 12V 6BT, or other mechanical Diesel engine installed. You could run it on veggie oil, motor oil, or really any combustible non-polar. (Of course, this might not be strictly kosher, as appropriate “mother may I’s” have not been uttered, and certain forms not filled out in triplicate, but none of that really matters in a SHTF scenario.)
I know a place that buys WMO for $0.25/gal, and (for now, at least) I imagine they’d gladly sell it for double. As it is, they use it to run an aluminum smelter…
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Honestly, when there’s a Tesla that duplicates or near as duplicates a Subaru Legacy 3.6R in terms of AWD, power (I think they did this and better in the Model 3), trunk space and room, Eyesight (do they have a Autopiliot lite?), handling (again, I bet Tesla already beats it), ~300 mile range, but most importantly price point, I’ll be hard pressed to stay a Subaru fan (been a Subaru guy for 3-4 cars now depending on how one counts (first was my parents))…
Getting away from gas station trips, oil change trips, worrying about CVT / trans fluid, etc etc would be really enticing. I could see my “shop trips” dropping to yearly inspections and replacing tires. Gas stations would basically be “rest stops” for food, bathroom, drinks…
And while I’ve budgeted for up to $8/gal gas, I certainly don’t mind paying less. I got close to that on a trip to Finland, and certainly didn’t love it.
I’m totally used to charging things nightly, one more thing wouldn’t be a problem, because it’s not a special trip. And I only drive 45 miles a day to work and back and playing around, and double that on weekends, with an occasional 200 mile trip recently for unusual issues. All handled by the ~300 mile range desired. So I could see this working well for me, whenever the cost comes down.
I found out where they got the idea for the dash…a 1961 custom MGA:
You didn’t learn that much in that science class. What University was that?
One of the first things you learn in science is that our understanding of science changes. As we grow in our knowledge and techniques and instruments we learn more and more. That’s the very basics of science.
Here’s a refresher course…
Naaa… the speedo is right in front of the driver where it belongs. That’s not the case with the Model 3.
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Well this is a bit interesting. Looks like the Bolt vs Tesla test has been done, although not the Model 3.
http://insideevs.com/chevrolet-bolt-beats-tesla-model-s-become-consumer-reports-range-champion/
Interesting that Chevy over-delivers on their mileage while Tesla under-delivers.
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