The vehicle needed a new fuel pump. A new relay did nothing. I put in a new Delphi fuel pump and it boosted the pressure from 31 to 45. Hopefully this will take care of the P0171 and the no start when hot, but still have the P0507 to contend with. Put it thru the idle relearn procedure after installing new FP, but idle still higher than expected. The dash tach shows about 1,100rpm at idle when in park, and the computer threw the P0507 on their way home from my place. New throttle body and PCV valve did nothing to change that.
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EDIT: NVM, I guess you already covered most of thisā¦ lol
Check for vacuum leaks as well as the ECT (coolant temp sensor), you will need to be able to read Live Data to see what the ecm sees, need to see what it reads before starting the vehicle and then what it reads while running at operating temp alsoā¦ With the vehicle overnight cold basically, the ECT should be very close to the true ambient temp outside or in the garage it is inā¦ If it reads -20* when real temp is 40*, then you found a problem, start thereā¦
Donāt forget to check for vacuum leaksā¦ lol
Possible if it has a power steering pressure switch and it is defective, that could trick the ecm into thinking you are at full pressure and needing the engine rpms to raiseā¦ (for a lack of better words)ā¦
Thanks, I have a code reader that displays some live data. I have used it only to check what DTCs that the ECM has recorded. I will see what else it displays and look into upgrading to something more versatile if that seems advantageous.The first thing I did for all that ailed this car was change the ECT sensor and check visually and audibly for vacuum leaks. Later I cobbled together a very serviceable smoke machine but found no leaks in the engine bay. I want to check to see if any vacuum lines travel anywhere that is out of sight.
Thanks for that tip. I will definitely look into it.
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I was able to capture 35 items of data with the code reader. I took pics of the data with KOEO and KOER. Is there anything in particular that might help? I can upload photos.
I would look at the ECT as mentioned above, I would also look at the throttle body/throttle pedal %'s with both the KOEO/KOERā¦
ECT showed 92c KOER with engine not yet fully warmed up.
TP KOEO - 17.3%
TP KOER - 13.7% (idle in park)
These last two values have no meaning for me. Will have to look them up.
OK, I looked them up, percentage that the throttle is open. Does anyone know what percentage the throttle should be open with KOEO, or how to find this info. Is it possible to change/adjust this? Seems to me this is a baseline setting.
Jack
Have you checked to see if there are any tears in the bellows between the air filter box and the throttle body to the left of the MAF sensor?
Some people arenāt careful with these when it comes time to change the air filter.
Tester
Need to see what the ECT shows KOEO and vehicle cold, after sitting for 3 hours or so, the ECT should basically be the same as the outside tempā¦
Several times, looked very carefully, bending the bellows this way and that to reveal any cracks in the valleys, saw nothing. Smoke test also showed no leaks. I plan to smoke test it again.
Got the owners son on that with his scan tool. He will do it in the morning.
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Found this posting dealing with the same issue on the same engine:
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I would have the engine running and spray everywhere (not at once, a little at a time, donāt need a bombā¦ lol) with brake parts cleaner (make sure it is flammable) to find the vacuum leakā¦
Or use a propane torch (NOT lit) as I think someone else may have suggested and look for vacuum leaksā¦
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As I have two tanks of propane on hand and no brake cleaner, propane is on the menu.
I noticed the tach action today when the car was here earlier. On a warm start the tach shot up to 2000rpm and then settled down to 1,100. From there it hiccupped to ~1,300rpm and settled back to 1,100. Did that twice as I watched. Owner said this was pretty common. On putting the trans into gear the tach dropped to ~900rpm and held steady.
little propane hand held torch types, donāt need to blow anything upā¦
Yeah, for sweating copper pipe, not for torch-down roofing.
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Tester
Thanks, that video is confidence building.
You may want to replace it anyway. They lose flexibility over time and become very difficult to work with. I replaced the bellows on my 2005 Accord after about 8 years and should have done it sooner.
From the behavior of the tach at idle, occasionally going from a steady 1,100rpm to bouncing up to 1,300rpm and settling back to 1,300rpm, I am wondering if the evap system may have a vacuum leak somewhere. Clamping off the vacuum hose to the evap canister should tell me something. In fact, clamping off each vacuum hose as close to the intake as possible should be just as valuable as a smoke test.
The car was dropped off and I did some testing. I clamped off/plugged the hose to the evap purge solenoid, the main vac hose going to the booster, the hose from the valve cover to the intake bellowe and the hose to the PCV valve.Vacuum increase from 21 to about 21.5, and the rpms dropped from around 1,100 to around 980-1,020.
Another thing I discovered using a cheap scan tool is that the ECT is reading 100c at full warmup and there is zero pressure in the cooling system. I suspected that to be the case and confirmed it when I opened the rad cap and absolutely no pressure was relieved. Then it got cold and dark outside so I put the car in the garage and shut it up.