I check it weekly people. I don’t wait for the light. I try to keep track what I’m adding weekly. That is hard to do just short of pouring it from a graduated cylinder each time. Oh wait - GOOD IDEA. It has not been more than a quart low. One time it hadn’t lost any. See wut I’m sayin?
This entire post sounds pretty bogus to me…No dealer is going to rebuild an engine because it burns a quart of oil every 3000 miles…They especially are not going to do anything since you have gone WAY over Honda’s service interval…10,000 miles??Forget any warranty coverage…perhaps you should have Mobil Oil rebuild your engine…But they won’t either since there is nothing wrong with your engine…
Honda engines are seldom “rebuilt”…They use Alumasil blocks, not readily rebuilt, dealerships generally install a factory long-block when they need to replace an engine. In your case, that’s not going to happen… Again, the entire thread sounds like a fairy tale…
I’ve seen trolls before but this guy is taking it to a new level…
I really think we should concentrate on how the engine is going to be put back together. Since your oil consumption rate was never out of specs. your cat. will be fine. Will you even consider a different oil change interval? Stands to reason if cylinder deactivation is not used mpg will suffer. Can you get any more info. on this theory? it would be interesting to discuss.
We think alike. Don’t be worried.
I did not want an overhaul. Dealer insisted. We haven’t “called corporate” or made any threats. I was just considering the effects of oil consumption and the rich running. Cats aren’t cheap. Last set I sold was $4k. The MIL will come on when it can’t adjust anymore trying to maintain a Stoicheometric combustion. There are no recommendations for checking oil in manual, unless it is in another language. I would bet that it would be a matter of time before a cyl missfire or cat efficiency code popped up. Oil fouled or carbon fouled plugs don’t work so good.
Can you explain?
Cast in liner dude!!! They bore they hone!! 2.4 look it up!
Honda is learning…But rebuilding engines in the field for disposable consumer products is a thing of the past…
I will give my opinion on all the questions posed in the original post, in the order in which they appear.
- Oil consumption rate is normal, but may have been made worse by the episode of running the engine out of oil, triggering the light to flicker, and continuing to operate the car. I am in the practice of monitoring the oil level vigilantly on a new-to-me vehicle, without prejudice to age of the vehicle, until I know its rate of consumption to avoid this scenario.
- I don’t think I could bring myself to go 10k miles between oil changes, no matter who said it was okay, unless I hated the car and wanted it to die.
- If it passed a dry test, a wet test is not really necessary. Wet test is normally given if compression is low or very uneven across the board to determine if the rings are the cause of the imbalance or low readings. If it passes a dry test, the wet test will be okay. You may have been thinking backwards on this issue.
- An overbore will not affect anything as long as it is kept within spec. Going too far will cause durability problems with cylinder walls and head gaskets, but it is impossible to increase the bore to the point that it will create problems with the ecm/pcm.
- Your catalytic converter will be fine. For it to become oil fouled will take much more oil burning than you are experiencing. Catalyst overheating is generally caused by an overly lean or rich mixture or a chronic misfire that is left untreated.
- I have never heard of displacement on demand resulting in oil consumption, or correcting a consumption problem by disabling it. I would leave that system alone.
- The EPA could care less about how much oil your car is burning. They seem to be more concerned with gaining more power in DC and legislating the American automakers out of existence.
Why would a Honda dealer even let you into his shop, let alone take your engine apart and put it back together for nothing…That’s not how dealerships work…
You bought a used car…
It’s warranty is long over…
The cars engine fluid consumption is well within accepted limits for a NEW car…
It runs fine…
No OBD-2 codes or CEL…
Passes emissions requirements (if any)…
27 posts for WHAT???
Trolling…
Wow Thank you. The issue arose shortly after purchase and very unexpected. I have kept eye on it since. I get you on the 10k.Not for everyone. It has served me well until now. The actual compression test from what they told my wife was low-but in range so it passed. They did not give me the readings and she thinks they said 145psi. I assumed that if marginal they would do wet test before teardown. I always think 1.dry,wet,leakage. before I tear down.From what I understand they checked valve stem play and compression and that’s it. I figured a cyl leakage would be good idea. They may have and didn’t tell us. The 2 calls with Serv Mgr. have been very brief cause he is very busy. He is the writer/mgr I guess. I’m not a tech. I have no experience with tuning/programming air/fuel management etc. Wasn’t sure just how sensitive the new engine management systems are.If I had my way go a couple mm and give it a compression point or two and try to make some power. Supposedly the dropped cyl lose pressure relaxing rings allowing blowby. EPA comment was just for the tree huggers. Thanks
I asked a simple question dealing with catalyst. I can’t control the dealer that is trying to either make us happy or feed a technician. It is a CPO with 100k miles so any concern is warranted. Consumers have the right to ask questions. If the dealer says bring it in wouldn’t you? Have or do you work at a dealer? That’s how the good one’s work. Called customer satisfaction and bonuses and paychecks depend on it. I have worked at independents and dealer. Sometimes it just works this way. Again. I’m not a tech. but I’m not stupid. Oh yeah 27 posts - Which number were you?
Hi EdNC878991,
I have read through all your replies, and everyone else’s too.
Here’s my opinion, and I’m sure someone is going to low star me for it, but I don’t care too much:
I think your oil change intervals are PERFECTLY FINE for the type of driving your wife does. All highway, long distance, daily. I would actually guess that you could go futher on the oil change interval, and you can certainly send off oil samples to a lab, like Blackstone Labs, after you get the car back in your possession.
In fact, I would actually recommend this.
Go to their website, and order a test kit or two.
As soon as you get the car back, check the oil level, and top it up, if it needs it.
Have your wife drive it for that first week, pull an oil sample, and send it for analysis.
I personally like to pull the oil through the dipstick tube when I’m not changing the oil.
Send it off for analysis, and let them know the engine was recently rebuilt, and you are looking for any issues along that regards. They will give you a nice write up on what they see in the sample you send them.
Then, at your first oil change (make sure you do it at the interval your shop tells you for the first time), take another sample, and send it to them again. They will give you another opinion on how the oil looks, after however many miles that is, and after you add however much top up oil you need to add.
At that point, you should be good with going to a full synthetic oil once again.
Now here’s where I believe you should differ from what you have been doing for the past 50k+ miles:
I believe you would be served by using a different oil than Mobil 1.
I’m not sure what weight oil you are using, because I don’t believe you have posted it at all in this thread.
If you are using a 30 weight oil, I would probably recommend Castrol Syntec, the 0W-30 version that says “Made in Germany” on the back label. This oil tends to do much better than most 30 weight versions of Mobil 1 according to BITOG forums (Bob Is The Oil Guy) for the type of driving that your wife does.
I personally use either Pennzoil Platinum for most of my fleet of vehicles, or Valvoline Synpower. 5W-30 for the Altima, PT Cruiser, Camry, and Corolla. I’ve been using Rotella T6 in the Boxster for the past 20k miles, but that one is a whole different beast. The Crossfire has had the oil changed by Chrysler twice, and the first time was Mobil 1, and the last time was Pennzoil Platinum Euro Formula, which I was much happier about.
Also, another recommendation I have would be for you to change all the O2 sensors on the car. If they are lazy, and causing the rich running conditions, then they should be swapped. This will most likely increase your fuel economy.
Also, since you’re a service writer for a BMW shop, have you considered having your guys at the shop look the car over? It may not be a BMW, but I know they know cars in your shop, and could have performed all these tests, and given you a great second opinion.
Might be worth doing that after you get the car back, just to have an opinion on the rebuild work.
BC.
I went from real estate to being a writer and now at 36 I’m finishing my AAS Automotive Serv. Tech. Degree I’ve also passed all ASE and only need to send for my Master Cert. I’ve rebuilt engines, trans etc. not a dummy. My Snapon tools haven’t been collecting dust. The oil used is 5w 20 as required by Honda. I had asked my wife to see if it was ok for me to check things out and that’s when the dealer said bring it in. So here we are. I planned on the 02 swap cause I imagine the heater will quit soon anyway like all Honda 02s. Your on to something with sample tests. I really appreciate the reply.
Your oil change intervals flat suck as does the compression figures you cite. A 145 PSI reeks. It should be up in the 180 and higher range UNLESS:
Engine overheated.
Oil not changed often enough leading to sludged/coked piston rings, which is likely the reason for the 145.
Stay tuned. I snapped a couple of pics of an oil pan I removed this afternoon and will try to get them ready for viewing this weekend.
A virtual prize will be given to the person who makes the closest guess about the oil change mileage/time interval on this one.
What is your shops service recommendations for normal use? 145 psi is what dealer relayed to wife not something I dislodged from a dark hole. I agree with you. Keep in mind car has had issue since purchased at 22k. You think maybe the previous owner might not have changed the conventional oil? I put clean MOBIL 1 SYNTHETIC and in 1200 miles it is dark regardless of level something is wrong. Dealer knows this. THey chose the course of action. Some Lube techs say every 3k to keep them busy. Mobil 1 is top tier oil I believe. 10k is ok. that needs to be on a bumper sticker Hope this isn’t flagged again.
I would expect a perfectly running, tight Honda to be giving around 180 psi, at least.
My gf’s daughter’s '98 Corolla with 173k miles on it had 3 cylinders at ~180, and 1 at 145.
If you’ve got dark engine oil after a short amount of miles, it probably is getting contaminated by piston ring blow by. It’s possible that the oil control rings have an issue from manufacturing, or that the original owner never changed the oil, and they got carboned up, which is causing your current issues.
This is where a higher detergent oil, like Pennzoil Platinum or Ultra might lead to better results. A couple of shorter oil change intervals with them might clean things up a bit, like their advertising campaigns say they might (currently trying this with the Corolla). Maybe even trying Valvoline MaxLife, as I’ve heard great results from that oil for just this problem.
I really believe the problem is either going to be the oil control rings, or the actual Mobil 1 oil, for the driving being done. It won’t cost you anything extra to try a different oil for a couple of months.
BC.
Catalyst is fine. When the check engine light comes on then you can troubleshoot and deal with it. My suggestion is once you get the car back from Honda drive it a year or two and sell it before the cat throws a check engine light.
The vast majority of people use a mileage figure only when figuring the intervals. Even the car manufacturers are guilty of promoting recommendations that are utter crap.
Some of those are:
Ten thousand mile oil changes. (or higher)
100k or never transmission fluid changes.
100k miles and more valve lash inspections and adjustments.
Changing fuel filters “when necessary”.
Changing air filters every 30k miles. (Good luck with that in OK)
Leaving spark plugs in place for 100k miles or infinity, whichever comes first.
Replacing timing belts only while never mentioning tensioners and water pump if applicable. (And so on and so on)
With engine oil time is a factor along with a dozen more minor factors. The type of oil, even if the best synthetic in the world, is just as easily contaminated by moisture, engine performance, enviro, etc. as regular old dino oil. Moisture is the leading contaminate when it comes to oil sludging, etc.
It’s also quite possible in your case that any ring problems could have happened before you purchased the car. I’ve seen more than one damaged or even totally trashed engine in vehicles that did not even have 30k miles on them yet.
(My all time favorite is the 25k miles Subaru in which the oil was so thickly sludged that it would not run out of the oil pan - with the pan removed and upside down on the shop floor. A 3 foot screwdriver stuck upright in the oil would not fall over.)
My better half is more proficient with camera downloading and whatnot so I’ll have her do the pics of the oil pan this weekend and it should make my point about oil change regularity.
For what it’s worth, the general rule of thumb on compression pressures is 20 X the compression ratio at sea level.
This will vary based on altitude, barometric pressure, engine wear, camshaft profile, etc., etc. but when you start getting to 160 and down on a Honda you have problems.