that sounds a little bit better
I was was comparing a few numbers form the front pages on sites, did not dig into any tax credits data
I’m not into buying either of these… mostly toying the “what if…” scenario here
Car and Driver liked the Volt way more than the Prius Prime. Twice the range, much better driving experience, twice the range (44 vs 22 miles), much better looking. Of course, neither make sense if your commute is longer than the range.
Just to add a little left brain. I get around 30 mpg with my good sized V6’s. So at 45 mpg instead of 30, you save around 3.4 cents a mile on gas, assuming it is around $3 which is high for here but may be low for other areas. So if you drive 10,000 miles in the year, you save about $340. So three years just to break even not counting other issues. Even when I drove 30,000 miles a year I could never justify an electric, even if I didn’t have to sit and wait for a charge. Just saying as all. Do what you want but think on it a little. Most people do things because they want to and talk themselves into it whether it makes sense or not.
3 Likes
Sounds like those guys that have convinced themselves of something, then come on this website and get upset when somebody doesn’t have the same opinion 
1 Like
That’s called rationalizing.
Your vehicles might get only 20 MPGs in the city, some people live in cities. Electric vehicles usually have an equivalent MPG rating of over 100 MPG city driving, the savings would be about $1200 per year.
About 30 years ago, I found a Citicar at an almost giveaway price because it needed new batteries. (Citicar was a battery powered car that wasn’t much bigger than a golf cart, but could be licensed for road travel). I think the range may have been 25 or 30 miles. I live within 2 miles of my job. I was going to estimate the power usage and figure out how much I would really save driving the Citicar around town over the 1978 Olds Cutlass Salon with a 260 V8 that I owned at the time. One reason I passed over the Citicar was that it had a propane heater for winter use that really didn’t appeal to me. I gave up on the experiment.
The university where I taught adapted a couple of Ford Taurus cars to run on either CNG or gasoline. This was about 25 years ago. I think the institution found it wasn’t cost effective and the CNG equipment was removed. The institution added Civic Hybrids and Ford Escape hybrids to its fleet. I was assigned both the Civic Hybrid and the Escape hybrid at different times to make a 250 mile round trip to a convention where I was presenting a paper. I was not impressed with the Civic Hybrid. My research partner owned a regular Civic with a manual transmission. We measured the mpg on the Civic Hybrid and she claimed the mileage was no better than her manual transmission Civic. The Escape hybrid was more comfortable than the Civic Hybrid. I think we got about 32 mpg. I just returned from a 360 mile trip in my 2017 Toyota Sienna and averaged 27 mpg. For me the comfort of the Sienna is worth the 5 mpg penalty.
As an experiment, I bought a Black and Decker battery powered mower from a friend. I had to replace the batteries for $68 and the new batteries only lasted 2 seasons. I replaced the batteries at the beginning of this mowing season, mowed 2 strips and the mower quit. I opened up the mower. I can bridge across the control board with a screwdriver and the motor will run. I haven’t had time to dig into the mower further. The batteries for the mower are sealed lead acid batteries. Perhaps the new battery powered mowers with lithium ion batteries are better. I don’t use anywhere near $34 worth of gasoline for my push lawnmowers in a mowing season. At this point, my experiences with replacements for gasoline internal combustion engines on either vehicles or lawnmowers hasn’t been really very satisfactory.
It appeared that there are settings you can adopt on the Volt for if you plan to do a cross country trip or a commute to work as well as something in the middle. You could set it to use the battery exclusively or close to that if you are only going a few miles and then recharge it at work. This is something the driver would have to set as the car wouldn’t know which mode to use.
I think battery tech is really improving with everyone getting newer and better phones and laptops. Some of the recent power tools, even the cheaper ones, have really impressed me. I have a family member who has a postage stamp yard and loves their electric mower. I guess it is quiet and there are no fumes. Whenever you can find something electric to mow tens of acres of pasture and brush, SIGN ME UP! I think this stuff is great if you can make use of it. It doesn’t work for everyone. A battery drill where I need to work on things away from power is great for me. A mower or tractor running on electric probably wouldn’t cut it.
I am not impressed with battery powered anything, I drove gasoline powered forklifts 60 years ago that were far superior to any electric ones I have ever seen, More controllable, more reserve power and the hydraulic lift and tilt controls were much more precise than the electric ones. Same thing with riding mowers, I guess I just like everything about the internal combustion engine. As far as cell phones, tablets and laptops, I have none, hence no one can bother me while we are eating dinner out except the young idiot at the next table who doesn’t even know enough to remove his baseball hat while eating dinner with his date and directing all his attention to his phone. instead of his date.
2 Likes
We had a battery powered fork lift at work too and it performed very well. But when the batteries went I about had a cat fit at the $1200 price for new ones. Still just part of the cost of doing business but you need to match the machine to the job. I bought a 20V B&D drill with battery and charger for about $50 and it worked fine, except now the battery is shot. One new battery is $49 so it sits on my bench in indecision. I also have a Porter Cable drill that is great for $100 with two batteries and a charger. I really like it. I bought a saw though that uses the same battery for about $35. I’ve used it twice and very disappointed in its performance. No power and stalls half way through a cut. So I guess no magic but when you really need to use something a lot, a cord works pretty good. I was hoping I could buy Triedaq’s batteries for my drill but wrong kind. Dang. Maybe Craigslist.
Oldtimer, you are absolutely right on. Your years have given you the wisdom to know the truth about electric cars instead of believing the BS they keep feeding us. Thanks for the heads up.
1 Like
Electric forklifts are NOT the same ones used 60 years ago. Batteries have improved 100 fold. It’s like comparing a Model-T to a 2018 Cadillac.
Electric cars are NOT for everyone, but they have a place and in that place - they are king.
Long distance driving is not their strong point - YET. The advancements in battery technology have made substantial improvements in the past 20 years. There are several new battery technologies being developed now that have the potential to be real game changers.
The Tesla Model-3 is the PERFECT vehicle for my wife’s commute. She’s averaging about 19k miles a year. Her commute is less then 20 miles each way. Her current car is an 07 Lexus with a little over 200k miles. Plan on reaching 300k miles, so won’t be in the market for a new car any time soon. If she needed a new car this year…the Tesla Model-3 would be at or near the top of the list. Same price as a new Lexus.
To say Electric cars is BS…you either don’t understand the technology or you’re just afraid of it.
5 Likes
Battery powered everything is here to stay. One thing I REALLY like are the battery powered motorcycles my son and I ride around our property. The neighbors cannot even hear them so they disturb no one, they do not emit noxious fumes and they are just as fast and peppy as a gas powered engine, maybe even a bit more torquey on the low end…
2 Likes
Using experience with electric forklifts from years ago is ridiculous . Electric vehicles are not for every situation but as Mike says in certain applications they may be better and they will continue to improve.
As for being against everything battery powered that is just not logical thinking. The 40 volt trim and leaf blower system I have is fantastic. The battery powered drill I have has been in use for years and is only on its second set of two batteries.
1 Like
The BS of electric cars is that we are told they are reliable and deliver the best mileage. Given all the fires lately in electric cars, how safe are they. Given the cost to buy an electric car just how efficient are they over the first 200 to 300 miles considering the initial high cost to purchase. When batteries get be SUPER devices with extremely long charge cycles ( 1,000 to 2,000 ) of driving before a charge is needed, and the cost differential to purchase is imore in the 5 to 10 percent range, then we will be suspicious of the claims about electric cars. The year 2050 is probably a good target year. Until then have a good time at the local gas station trying to find an electric pump to charge your battery in less than 30 to 60 minutes on your way to work or on the road on tour vacation.
The fires are real…but EXTREMELY RARE. Far rarer then ICE car fires. The battery technology has changed and newer lithium batteries that are not prone to catching fire will be in the market soon.
I work with a several people who own Chevy Volts. Yes they are a hybrid, but their range is so good on electric the ICE engine doesn’t kick in for their commute. The Tesla range is far better. One guy I work with had t Sta-Bil in his gas tank because the ICE engine was almost never used. Went for a few months without filling up. If you owned an electric vehicle - it would be EXTREMELY FOOLISH - NOT to charge the vehicle while you’re home.
As stated in my previous comment…I admitted that long commutes are not it’s ideal situation YET. So guess what - Don’t take it on vacation.
Please show me the ICE vehicle that has a range of 1000 miles? Why is that even a goal. Cars today average under 400 miles on a tank. As for cost…you can get an Electric car today for under $30k. The Tesla Model- 3 is under $40k.
From what I’ve read, production is exceedingly slow and uneven, and the wait time for customers is quite long. Not likely to get a Tesla Model 3 this year unless you’ve had money down on one for a long time already.
1 Like
I’d look at the Bolt, too.
1 Like
Agree! My nephew ordered his years (2+) ago and just took delivery last week.
It may be on someone’s top of the list, but it’s close to the bottom at Consumer Reports, due to many flaws typical of early production models with new technology. They often rate such cars as “unacceptable” until all the kinks have been worked out!
The nephew works on a high tech environment in the power industry, so he’ll be able to cope with the initial gremlins, since there is no dealer of any sort nearby. But the power plant has a world class work shop.
His big challenge will come when he plans an extended honeymoon trip by car, which will require careful planning!!