After 160 posts:
After 160 posts:
Now you’re making a completely different argument. So what they don’t make them for cars. But thanks for proving my point.
We are not going to agree here because you’re talking about EPA number, which the manufacturers have the freedom to post a lower estimate, whereas I’m talking about mechanical efficiency.
I now live in a part of the world where I bought my last car that was the size of a Toyota Camry powered by a 1.5 liter 4 banger. Mine was a five speed manual, but it was also offered with a six speed amt. I can’t imagine it having a torque converter dumping heat into the radiator on a 10 minute hill climb(I usually descend that hill in 2nd), with the ac on full blast, 5 adults on board, and in 95Fo summer heat
My 2008 1.5 liter five speed Toyota Yaris seldom gets less than 40 mpg even though the EPA rates it at 29/36 manual and 29/35 automatic. A lot of that is how I drive though, obeying speed limits, not accelerating towards each and every red light, letting the car coast down hills, etc…
Also, the automatic version of this car has the type of transmission that gave slush boxes a bad name in the past.
One thing I feel that handicaps many manuals is that because they tend to be sport oriented, they are short geared, lacking a true overdrive, or have a top gear that’s an overdrive in name only.
With chain drive motorcycles that is easily remedied. It didn’t take me long to replace the 14 tooth front sprocket on my Kawasaki Ninja 300 with a 15 tooth sprocket, now sixth gear actually feels like an overdrive instead of being “permanently in a passing gear”.
My 93 Miata has 186000 on it, original clutch is still good on it.
Gee with 3.7% of the cars sold with manuals, you wouldn’t think this discussion would be so long. Now my four speed manual 59 VW bug with a 36 hp engine, got 25 mpg. My 60 Morris with a four speed four cyl got around 5 mpg. So I switched to an automatic and haven’t had a manual since.
My 200,000 Yaris is also on it’s original clutch, and disk brake pads too. An unabused manual is one of the most reliable transmissions there is. It’s abusive driving habits that give manuals a bad name.
Back in the 1940s and 1950s, if you wanted good gas mileage, you bought a car with the 3 speed manual transmission with the Borg Warner automatic overdrive. The overdrive was phased out in the late 1960s. Not only did the overdrive equipped car save gas over the same model without the overdrive, but there was less engine wear.
Some like to be connected to there vehicle
Some just use it to get from one place to another.
A lot of people that drive for a living want an automatic especially if they get stuck in traffic a lot.
Others are white nuckle drivers that will never have a connection to a mechanical machine.
Others like myself lov to drive and get a thrill from learning there vehicles limits.
100% with you on this…
Tightwad and do not trust cvt’s.
And you shouldn’t
They are fine for the nervous nellies out there. But get aggressive and watch how fast they fail.
When you see how the OEMs have reduced the trailer tow numbers on anything with a CVT, that tells you wear the weak link is.
I do believe that anyone who drives conservative will get good life from a CVT.
But that’s not me.
I would say that people who insist on a manual in 2019 are Luddites. Note that this my opinion only, not necessarily shared by the management
Okay, I’m a luddite. Whatever that is.
Hey asterix. The Luddites were a group of textile mill workers in 19th century England who were losing their jobs due to automation, and protested by destroying the factories. Today it’s used as a generic term to refer to anyone that resists modern technology. I know you’re in Denmark, so driving conditions and brand availability may be different than here in the USA. What do you dislike about automatics?
Good concise description of the Luddites.
Those of us who prefer manual transmissions aren’t trying to destroy the factories that make automatics - so on that basis we’re not like the actual Luddites. The term is used nowadays as a kind of tongue-in-cheek overstatement.
Oh, I know about that group. I would never in a million years have guessed that luddite in that context I responded to had a connection to them. Well, learned something new today. Thanks.
I don’t dislike automatics per see, but I do like to do my own shifting (guess it’s a “man thing”), I prefer to be able to disconnect the drive wheels from the drive line in case of snow/ice on the road, as I see it - unless you buy a vehicle directly build for it, an a/t is weaker than a m/t for towing (in Europe, any a/t Ford which is to tow more than 1100 lbs has to be fitted with an extra cooler for transmission, that indicates to me, that it’s a weak link) Might actually be a good thing, that will give me a good excuse to say to my MIL that she has to stay home.
That’s just a few of my reasons to stay with m/t’s.
People should at any time buy what they like.
less exercise (both mental and physical)
It’s not just a man thing. My sister prefers a manual transmission, much like I do, but for different reasons. My biggest reason is cost of maintenance and repair. Servicing an automatic transmission takes a lot more work than changing the oil in my manual transmission, and a clutch job is about 1/3 the cost of replacing an automatic transmission with a rebuilt transmission that will never shift as smooth as the original did when it worked well.
I agree wholeheartedly.