# Who pays 4 THAT! **URL:** \ **Category:** Maintenance/Repairs\ **Created:** [April 5, 2014, 12:30am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470 "2014-04-05T00:30:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![geo\_mac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9fc29f/32.png) [@geo\_mac](https://community.cartalk.com/u/geo_mac)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 12:30am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/1 "2014-04-05T00:30:12Z")
99 Sentra 200000 miles- Went to a trusted neighborhood tire guy… been there many times over the years… need 4 new tires. His helper throws a trolly jack under the car, and lifts the whole side of the car from the sub frame/front floor pan!! The damage is a crushed sub frame and a buckled/ pushed up floor.Thankfully I have a picture of the jacked up car. His response… 'well how am I ‘sposed to …’ every time b 4 they used a 4 point lift … any thoughts or comments, thanks ---
**Author:** ![jesmed1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/jesmed1/32/2097_2.png) [@jesmed1](https://community.cartalk.com/u/jesmed1)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 12:33am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/2 "2014-04-05T00:33:14Z")
His insurance pays for that, or he does out of pocket if he doesn’t want to file a claim. That’s the cost of dojng business: paying for the mistakes your employees make. The shop is absolutely on the hook for fixing the damage. Don’t let them off. ---
**Author:** ![jtsanders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c2a13f/32.png) [@jtsanders](https://community.cartalk.com/u/jtsanders)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 12:40am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/3 "2014-04-05T00:40:06Z")
+1 Contact your auto insurer if you haven’t already. They may act in your behalf to get the damages settled. ---
**Author:** ![geo\_mac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9fc29f/32.png) [@geo\_mac](https://community.cartalk.com/u/geo_mac)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 12:51am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/4 "2014-04-05T00:51:28Z")
So it IS wrong to lift a car that way? that’s what I thought, and how is it fixed? They acted like it was my problem, the owner said, ‘well I didn’t lift it that way!’ ---
**Author:** ![BustedKnuckles](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/bustedknuckles/32/25_2.png) [@BustedKnuckles](https://community.cartalk.com/u/BustedKnuckles)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 1:04am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/5 "2014-04-05T01:04:57Z")
Do you have full coverage insurance on a 15 year old Sentra with 200k? If not, your insurance may pass on helping. It is the wrong way to lift the car, that’s why the damage. These cars hsve reinforced lift points just behind the front wheels and just in front of the rear wheels. The four point lift is usually set to these. I’ve also seen rocker panel lifts that have two beams for each side and they span these lift points. But, point lifting in the middle between these points does damage as you can see. And, it was his helper, so it’s his problem. But, this sounds like it may head to court if he keeps refusing to accept responsibility. ---
**Author:** ![texases](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/texases/32/862_2.png) [@texases](https://community.cartalk.com/u/texases)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 1:11am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/6 "2014-04-05T01:11:11Z")
Yes it’s wrong. All manufacturers put in specific reinforcements at the points designated for jacking and lifting. He ignored that, causing the damage. ---
**Author:** ![jesmed1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/jesmed1/32/2097_2.png) [@jesmed1](https://community.cartalk.com/u/jesmed1)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 1:15am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/7 "2014-04-05T01:15:12Z")
This is not rocket science. Any tire shop owner knows there are specific jack points designed into each car, and that jacking anywhere else can cause damage. He knows this and knows his employee screwed up and is trying to weasel out of it. His shop, his responsibility. ---
**Author:** ![the\_same\_mountainbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@the\_same\_mountainbike](https://community.cartalk.com/u/the_same_mountainbike)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 1:21am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/8 "2014-04-05T01:21:56Z")
Yup, jesmed and others have said it perfectly. Kudos for getting the photograph. ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 2:33am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/9 "2014-04-05T02:33:13Z")
**“the owner said, well I didn’t lift it that way!”** However, the legal principle of _ **Respondeat Superior** _ dictates that the shop owner **IS** legally liable for the work-related actions of the people whom he employs. I think it is very sad that somebody engages in a business that serves the public, but is seemingly unaware of one of the most basic legal principles that can potentially bring financial ruin to his doorstep. On the other hand, the shop owner most likely is aware that he is responsible for the acts of his employees while at work, and in this case, it means that the man has no moral scruples if he is attempting to deflect blame onto the victim of his employee’s mistake. ---
**Author:** ![cigroller](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c68b51/32.png) [@cigroller](https://community.cartalk.com/u/cigroller)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 2:36am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/10 "2014-04-05T02:36:59Z")
As you can tell, the shop is responsible. Period. There’s no way around it. Hopefully the owner will come to his senses so that you can avoid having to go the legal route. ---
**Author:** ![jtsanders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c2a13f/32.png) [@jtsanders](https://community.cartalk.com/u/jtsanders)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 3:20am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/11 "2014-04-05T03:20:33Z")
And tell the shop you need a car to replace yours temporarily while they decide how to handle it. If you had an accident on the road and it was someone else’s fault, you’d get a car. How will you get to work without a car? ---
**Author:** ![Caddyman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/caddyman/32/23_2.png) [@Caddyman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Caddyman)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 3:37am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/12 "2014-04-05T03:37:56Z")
Was the structure of the car damaged or is the damage cosmetic? Has the driveability of the car been effected in any way? Was any metal torn allowing fumes, water, dirt into the cabin? While having meat-head tire-busters damage your car is not acceptable, it IS a 15 year old 200K mile Sentra…Would “repairing ?” the damage make any difference in the serviceability of the car? ---
**Author:** ![George\_San\_Jose1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e5b9ba/32.png) [@George\_San\_Jose1](https://community.cartalk.com/u/George_San_Jose1)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 4:30am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/13 "2014-04-05T04:30:27Z")
If you look at your owner’s manual OP, you’ll probably see a page devoted to showing the allowable jacking points. Those are the only places that can safely support the weight. ---
**Author:** ![meaneyedcatz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/meaneyedcatz/32/692_2.png) [@meaneyedcatz](https://community.cartalk.com/u/meaneyedcatz)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 4:58am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/14 "2014-04-05T04:58:16Z")
Mistakes happen but he needs to step up and be responsible. If he did not think mistakes will happen he would keep insurance. lets see if this separates the men from the boys ---
**Author:** ![kmccune](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/kmccune/32/1237_2.png) [@kmccune](https://community.cartalk.com/u/kmccune)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 3:50pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/15 "2014-04-05T15:50:35Z")
Had this happen on an older Volvo(pristine under body) the guy may have been irked at me because I made him install the anti rattle hardware on the brakes,showed the manager the damage,his response was.“one of my better techs dont know what happened” his response was to take a pair of pliers and halfway straighten the seams back out,dont think he sprayed any sealant back on the underbody-they are no longer in business-Kevin ---
**Author:** ![karl-sieger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c77e96/32.png) [@karl-sieger](https://community.cartalk.com/u/karl-sieger)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2014, 9:45pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/16 "2014-04-05T21:45:55Z")
The owner’s helper wasn’t a real mechanic, probably just a “tire man” & wasn’t properly trained. It’s his & the owner’s fault. Period. Don’t back down. ---
**Author:** ![Joe-Guy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/joe-guy/32/124_2.png) [@Joe-Guy](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Joe-Guy)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2014, 12:19am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/17 "2014-04-06T00:19:19Z")
You have a picture now get an estimate or two for cost of repair for the damages. If the _tire guy_ refuses to pay, you may have to take him to small claims court. If you have someone else fix it and need to rent a car while the repair is being made, you can add that to your claim - but you will need to show that the car rental was absolutely necessary. Hopefully, you won’t need to do that, but you should be prepared just in case. ---
**Author:** ![geo\_mac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9fc29f/32.png) [@geo\_mac](https://community.cartalk.com/u/geo_mac)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2014, 6:18pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/18 "2014-04-07T18:18:55Z")
Thank you all, I went to a couple body shops today and was brushed off saying the shop lifted the car properly and the fault is the age of the car… ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2014, 6:44pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/19 "2014-04-07T18:44:00Z")
If you trust the word from both of those shops, then I would say that your only course of action at this point is to start shopping for a replacement vehicle. If “the fault is the age of the car”, then indirectly they are telling you that the car is no longer structurally sound–most likely as a result of rust damage after 200k miles. Since lack of structural soundness is a significant safety hazard, I would suggest that you begin your replacement vehicle search right away. ---
**Author:** ![Cavell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/cavell/32/43396_2.png) [@Cavell](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Cavell)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2014, 6:10pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470/20 "2014-04-07T18:10:22Z")
Got tires at SAMs club. They have small “body” lifts. Raise car about 18". Pretty cool unit. Saw one on CL for sale for $400 or so. I almost bought it. [Next page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/who-pays-4-that/84470.md?page=2)